hueseph

NIMBUS: real world recording school?

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hueseph
, 12-12-2010 at 05:51 PM (1743 Views)
I finally found time to drop by Nimbus.They sent out an invite to an open house for the school that they run there. This is a working studio mind you. Bands go there to record. Recently Lillix finished Tigerlily there. Garth Richardson was at the door to greet guests. Bob Ezrin wasn't about or if he was, I didn't get to meet him. Seeing Kevin again was really cool. This is a guy who is just made for inspiring people.

The thing about these guys and all of the staff there that stood out is their lack of ego. There was nothing to prove here. They don't need to prove anything. The proof is in the pudding so to speak. But, more than that. They seemed to show a respect for everyone in that we have a common desire. To produce music. To be involved with music and the creative process in some way. The air is charged with a drive to reach for something better. Something that has yet to be achieved.

Kevin took the time to personally show myself and a few other guys around. We got as far as their Studio A sound room when Kevin's drive took over. Talking openly about why they put this school together. I'm sure there is the financial proponent. That goes without saying. But, there was something else. Something that they were striving for that goes ignored at most schools. Not just media schools but schools in general.

There is something missing in recording schools that has been resulting in a loss in the music industry all together: a desire to produce a high quality product. To capture the moment as it happens. To entice the listener to join in on the groove as it happened there in the studio.

There were many analogies. One that stands out for me is this: Imagine you find a band with a great vocalist. The next Freddy Mercury and a band as tight as Queen had ever been. Imagine them going to record an album and nailing every cut. Now imagine that the engineer beatmaps and autotunes the whole project. That is the state of the music industry. People are so bought into the technology that they wouldn't know a good thing if they heard it. Even if they did hear it, they would "fix" it beyond all recognition.

The drive is toward something else. Something that we have yet to see. The music industry is changing. Power is in the hands of the musicians again but where do you take it? How do you control that power? How do you focus that energy so that it doesn't burn out before it has a chance to start a fire?

No one made claims to have an answer. Their goal was not to provide one. The goal is give tools so that a person could "hit the ground running". Not just a head start but a resume and a plan. There were no claims to have anyone in a job by the time they were finished. Only that they would have the tools to be prepared to work. Credit on a project. An understanding of the laws involved. Experience taught by Award winning producers and industry professionals.

Most of these "schools" are run by former students. Unfortunately it's true. Do they work in the industry? Sure they do. They teach at Full Sale.

The format is also different. A maximum of 6 students. No classrooms. They are always either in the studio or on a music workstation. The goal being to teach real world skills. The purpose being not to teach you how to plan your strategy but to have your business strategy plotted and your promotion material ready, complete with a resume and recording credits.

When I first started learning from Kevin he was fighting for this same ideal. At that time fifteen years ago it was already obvious where the music industry was headed. He talked about it at length but still nobody seemed to see it coming until it hit us. The degradation of these schools into nothing more than cash flow generators was a large part of that. Suddenly people were being processed and given certificates regardless of whether they learned anything or not. The technology has made cheaters of most people. There's no longer a standard to be measured against. If you can't get it right, fix it in the mix. Atotune, beatmap, sample and assemble the best notes into something resembling a song.

They're striving for something better than that. Maybe, they're on to something. Normally, I like to bash recording schools. There might be something different here. Maybe there is hope for music. Maybe there is something better than what we're hearing on the radio yet to come.

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Updated 12-12-2010 at 05:53 PM by hueseph (Typos)

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Comments

  1. bigtree's Avatar
    What was their choice DAW? I may be reaching but the Lillix track I checked out, sounded like Pro Tools? I mention this because it interests me greatly to see what educators are doing and the trends they are following or leading. I would have love to of been there with you Hue.
    How do I think it is PT?
    There is a certain sound that I notice unique . It's becoming identifiable to to me. That diigitalconverter sound and the overs that pile up at the 2 bus. I hear it in the high end and how it lays out in the mix. Its what I detested with my PT rig and why I am done with ITB and that system. But, I may be way off and it could all be in my head. I'm just shooting high on this as its something i'm starting to notice more and more and thought it was a good point to discuss here..

    If I'm out of line here, please feel welcome to say so or correct me.
  2. hueseph's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by bigtree
    What was their choice DAW? I may be reaching but the Lillix track I checked out, sounded like Pro Tools? I mention this because it interests me greatly to see what educators are doing and the trends they are following or leading. I would have love to of been there with you Hue.
    How do I think it is PT?
    There is a certain sound that I notice unique . It's becoming identifiable to to me. That diigitalconverter sound and the overs that pile up at the 2 bus. I hear it in the high end and how it lays out in the mix. Its what I detested with my PT rig and why I am done with ITB and that system. But, I may be way off and it could all be in my head. I'm just shooting high on this as its something i'm starting to notice more and more and thought it was a good point to discuss here..

    If I'm out of line here, please feel welcome to say so or correct me.
    ProTools is the DAW they are using. You're spot on there, though I don't know that they recorded that project in ProTools however likely. I did happen to see the old OTARI sitting in one of the control rooms. Not sure that it was functioning though. There was no tape and it was powered down. As an AVID educator, they likely only use ProTools when it comes to ITB production. There is no shortage of outboard processing there. I didn't stay as long as I would have liked. I would have loved to stick around to ask more questions.

    School is not in my future.
  3. Link555's Avatar
    Sounds like it was a great tour. I think I know what big tree is talking about, when I first started into ITB mixing everything felt really wrong. It took a long time to either improve my chops, or get used to the sound.... Not sure which happened, but it did happen.

    Now the funny thing is analog is starting to sound worse.... there is a clarity in the box that I can choose to muddy up with harmonics or not. UAD is really helping me that regard. Now when I listen to old mixes I did on tape, I hear effects! Its a weird world....
  4. bigtree's Avatar
    ya, its got that all in front sound with a certain subtle .1 db over that is in everything. Its that cheap converter sound that Pro Tools sounds like. I think if you keep the levels around -15 on the mix and somehow don't trust the 0 db on the master it does help soften that zzz.

    Interesting to hear you've come full circle, Link. Both our comments are acknowledging something we are able to isolate. Is this the converter of Pro Tools or what? I hear in everywhere in that system and it compounds. We have learned something that took a while, yes. I am able to pick it out now, same as you? I had to get better gear to train myself what it was though. In the early days, I was just blown away by the editing and clean sound. Now it all sounds very irritating.
  5. bigtree's Avatar
    To add, I know we've all talked about Alsihad since 1999 but my point and I think you are agreeing, is not the obvious digital distortion, its something I think is identifiable with Pro Tools? I think the industry is getting used to that sound. So, you are saying you hear it and know what I mean and, using Pro Tools are able to work around this? Or, that it doesn't exist with the newer systems or its simply only happening because lack of preventing it during tracking and mixing?
    Again, I'm not talking about just digital distortion that we all hear in clipping. But, maybe thats what it just is and most of us are not hearing it or are not as annoyed by it.

    Thoughts?

    Sorry Hue, I'm side railing your Blog.

    Are we on the same page here?
  6. hueseph's Avatar
    No worries. I blog to prod discussion and if that's what you feel you need to talk about, that's good.

    I'm a bit on both sides of this. I can remember way back in the beginnings of the digital sound people were complaining that digital is "too clean". Now, I know I've said this before but pre-digital, people would do anything they could to clean up the signal. Lowering the noise floor was an ongoing task. Now that the noise floor has dropped considerably, people are trying to get back the sound of analogue.

    Maybe it's a case of "don't know how good you had it till it's gone". I think a large part of the problem is that when there was such an issue with noise floor companies strove to make the finest components they could so that you could get the cleanest signal possible. Now that the signal path is already so clean a lot of that drive for craftsmanship has been lost. There is a plethora of cheap gear out there(and I've owned at least one of each of those products). People don't really know what good gear is anymore. Critical listening has gone to the wayside.

    On the other hand all of the available tools out there make it so easy to trash your mix. Just looking at free plugins is crazy. I have to admit and I'm sure you all know this, that I am guilty of trying to use every plugin possible to "clean up" a tune only to realize that it would have been better if I just stuck the sound I recorded in the first place. I love to mix with my eyes and often forget to listen. I never had this problem with a mixer in front of me. I had no choice but to listen. I wish I had the room for a decent console.

    Recording to tape made better musicians and better engineers. The sound had to be good when it went to tape. You can't change that much. Either the take was good or it sucked. There was no beatmapping and cutting tape was painstaking and unforgiving.

    Having it easy has made me lazy. I don't take the time to listen before pressing the red button anymore. I just up and go. It's a bad thing and it's not just ProTools. It's every DAW. Okay, I'm ranting now.
  7. Link555's Avatar
    [FONT=Tahoma]Before I had the Hedd192 I never got what I was trying too. Around the same time I switched to Nuendo. Things started to gel a bit. Then I got the UAD card. This was over a 5 year period so quite a few mixes to adapt my ears on. Now pro tools is a fading memory, so I am sure my memory of the sound is biased. However I do think it put a digital haze on the upper mids. The hedd192 converters, don’t seem to do this is as bad, nor do my lynx converters. [/FONT]
    [FONT=Tahoma]Its all subjective, and most likely do to my ear adjusting. [/FONT]

    [FONT=Calibri]As far as beat mapping or melodyne…these days I have been very lucky to have clients that really want to capture the moment live. I am slowing down, I record less people in a year. I am also now able to select my clients to some extent, which has made my sessions much more fun and worth while.[/FONT]
  8. hueseph's Avatar
    Just saw this posting. Pretty convincing. But, as has been discussed in the past, the money in music these days is not in studios but in "education". As far as that is concerned, I think these guys are as legit as it gets. I think you'll see a few familiar faces here. At least they should be familiar to the uh.....more experienced crowd.