SSL clone's sound vs. original SSL

[Juniorhifikit]

OK, so I just finished two SSL clones. Mine don't sound like a real SSL to me. I mix on an SSL 4056 G+ with E eq fairly often, and am pretty familiar with the sound of the two-bus compressor. I've also used an Alan Smart C1 from time to time on different consoles with great results.

I'm trying to figure out if my clones are out of whack, or if I'm too picky (or crazy). Does anyone have experience with both the clone and the real deal. Do they REALLY sound the same to you?

[timster]

I can not answer that, not having worked on any SSL console, but I am interested in hearing from people who have.

Juniorhifi, what is it you dont like about the clone sound? I have just finished one too, and I must say I like it more than I expected to, a very useable sound....so Im interested if you can elaborate on what you mean :0)

[Mundox]

I personally haven't compared mine to the original but the person I gave it to try swears by it. I made him one too! And he used it for a major recording. I believe him...
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[gyraf]

..This comp will NOT sound like a full-blown SSL4000 console, but rather like what it's bus compressor does to the sound.

It does this rather well, as the electronics actually is a clone from the original. Yes, we use somewhat different circuits for in and out, but it's sound mainly comes from its VCA's (dbx), it's timing, and it's ratio/threshold behaviour. And these are like the original..

Jakob E.

[Shalimar]

Put a long string of NE5532s and cheap caps in series with the SSL clone and you're close...

I haven't heard Jakobs clone, but I'm sure it's close enough. I have heard/used variations of the 4K though and it's piss poor, so is the buss comp. YMMV and all that..

[ssltech]

...My mum always told me that if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything... I never listened either! ;)

-Seriously though, -and hopefully more constructively- The master compressor (which on a 4056 is actually a 4-buss rather than a 2-buss) doesn't introduce any change of "sound" simply by being switched in, by virtue of the fact that it doesn;t introduce any additional sound; the signal runs through the VCA anyhow, compressor "in" (enabled) or "out" (disabled).

Jakob's SSL clone is a pretty righteous copy which differs only in one subtle way, and it is a manner in which his console has been modified to behave, as a desirable feature. -Namely, the GR sidechain is derived from a sum of the two channels (at the two 47k resistors which feed the two channels to the sidechain) as opposed to a "loudest-channel-priority" system which is used in the original.

To modify Jakob's SSL compressor to more closely emulate the GR behaviour of the original design, I think that you should replace the two 47k resistors with a pair of precision rectifiers with 22k resistors at their output.

For a while now, I've toyed with the idea of building a version which had both methods: either switchable, or "blendable" to operate in either "Danish" or "Oxford" modes, or a blend of both... Too much else to do though, specially at the moment! -I do have Michael P's SSL clone on the bench at the moment, and I have several SSLs here to compare it to...

Keith

[timster]

piss poor??!! well, i must be deaf, thats all I can say....???

[Ammitsboel]

Hi Shalimar!

I would like to hear what you don't like about the sound on the 4K range?
Is the sound thin or gray/dark or lacks definition?

What do you who like SSL like about the sound?

I don't know SSL consoles in person, but recordings on SSL can sound as good/bad as every other recording.
I would just like to know what Shalimar and you others hear in the console.

Regards

[Shalimar]

Ååhhrrr, Come on. It's a tool. It's got a sound. I don't like it. I hate it. Hate the size, ergonomics, automation, the lot.. Nothing new here..

And yeah, sure SSL recordings can sound good. I got lotsa SSL recordings (actually, it's mostly SSL _mixes_) at home that sound good. I luv pretty much all Spike Stents work and he only works on an old 4056G.. The Lord-Alge bruthas use 'EM and I hate their work, but that's not because of the SSL.. Pro Tools can sound peachy too. Mitsu 850s, MiniDisc & 4 track casette.. don't see the point really.. what others do is their biz.

I do not think the general consensus is that SSL 4Ks are topnotch when it comes to sound (when was the last time you saw a racked-up SSL strip/module?). I know a lot of people who work on these daily and they do not think they have a killer sound either (DR folks for instance). But yeah, there are people who think SSLs sound good (those who bought 'em in the 80s and are still paying them off). There are people who luv 'em for the automation only. There are people who just don't care..

And there are people who hate 'em. Like me.
For me, they do not sound good. They sound awfull. Cluttered up, really 'electronic/transformerless', thin, really shitty comps. The freq extremes really suck. Soso EQ (don't care what model)... You get the point. Overly complicated and I need to perform a shitload of tricks with a shitload of external gear to get 'em flowin'.

Hate the Neve VR too. Hate big inline consoles in general. Hate buildin comps (never heard any that a humble RNC couldn't kick the living shit out off). I _really_ hate the ergonomics. And I HAAAATE! what that huge surface does to my monitors... argghh!! Monster do-it-all consoles like that seems to be nothing but a compromise.

So I don't work on them anymore. I do not need +40 channels. I do not need build in compression. I do not need automation. I do not need that kinda EQ. I do not like the inline concept. And I really don't like a telly in my mixer..

I got what I need.

[Tommytones]

1stly, I agree and disagree with Shalimar on this one. SSL 4K is not the greatest sounding thing around for sure BUT it is far from "piss poor". I am a big fan of SSL desks and enjoy working with them whenever I get the chance.

As for the compressor issue ... I have built 2 versions of Jakob's clone. 1 with new vca's, 2150, and 1 with original, 202 (actually came from an SSl console). I did put transformers at the input (the original is transformerless) which makes a world of difference. The first thing I did once they were working was to call up a friend of mine who has a FXG384 and start comparing. The 384 is not exactly what's in the console but it does sound pretty damed close (IMO anyhow) and it does sound pretty good. Everyone in the room (myself included) was suprised at how close the clone was. It actually sounded better in some circumstances than the SSL 384. The unit with the original 202 vca's behaved a lot more like the 384 ... smoother and sorta slowish ... whereas the unit with the newer 2150 vca's was a bit jerky and faster. I find you have to play around with the knobs more to get what you want. The 2150 box seems to prefer program that is more percusive. It is very transparent in the mid and high freq ranges which is cool but is quickly noticeable on the low end. The 202 box is just overall smoother. You notice it everywhere right away but it has a nice character.

All in all, I found the 'sound' of compression to be very close to the original and therefore it's well worth the effort to build some clones. They definitely get used. They don't stay untouched in the rack with the power off like some other things. My only issue is that the threshold range is too wide. I would prefer working over a smaller range.

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