Our Sponsors
Pro Audio Products

http://www.mojaveaudio.com

RECORDING ORG
PRO SHOP
Categories
· Accessories
· Compressors / Limiters / Gates
· Equalizers
· Micing Systems & Spitters
· Microphones
· Mixers/ Consols
· Modular Rack Systems
· Monitor
· Preamps
· Processors
· Recording Channels
· Summing Amps
Pro Shop
Random Audio Product

GainStation 1
$1,275.00
Members Support
RO CLUB
You are not subscriber of . You can subscribe from here now!
Traffic Stats
We received
100242601
page views since March 15, 2004
Recording Org
Navigation Map
icon_home.gif HomeShow/Hide content
Access restricted to our members Feedback (contact us)
tree-L.gif Recommend Us
· Advertise Here
keyword ads
· Feeds
Forum InfoShow/Hide content
tree-T.gif Forum RULES
tree-T.gif Forum Search
tree-T.gif Your Account
tree-L.gif Lost Password
Business SectionShow/Hide content
tree-T.gif NewsNew content !
tree-T.gif Topics
Access restricted to our members Submit News
· AdvertisingShow/Hide content
Access restricted to our members Advertising Contact UsShow/Hide content
tree-T.gif keyword ads
tree-L.gif Pro Audio
Linking System
Access restricted to our members Feedback (contact us)
Access restricted to our members News Search
· The Pro Shop
Gear 4 Sale
ContentShow/Hide content
Access restricted to our members Reviews & Features
tree-T.gif Stories Archive
Access restricted to our members Music_Business_Links
InfoShow/Hide content
fleche.gif Books
tree-T.gif FAQ
Access restricted to our members Feedback (contact us)
fleche.gif Glossary
tree-T.gif Recommend Us
tree-T.gif Statistics
Access restricted to our members News Search
tree-T.gif Surveys
tree-L.gif Your Account
Audio Survey
Where Are You From?
Asia
Africa
North America
South America
Antarctica
Europe
Australia/Oceania
Results Polls Votes: 164 Comments: 4
Mix News
·Nashville's Blackbird Studio Installs API 1608 Console
·SPARS to Partner with NAMM to Produce the SPARS Sessions
·Auto-Tune Named One of 'America's Hottest Brands'
·Brian Wilson Records George Gershwin at Ocean Way
·Songs To Your Eyes Announces Music Placements

read more...©
Remix News
·Denon DJ DN-S3700 Rebate
·IK Multimedia iPDJ Mobile Groove Event
·Brother Ali Us (Rhymesayers)
·Job Listing: Native Instruments Managing Director
·Akai MPK88 Now Shipping

read more...©
Google Translation
Translation
  Forum FAQ    Search    Profile    Log in to check your private messages    Log in


 
Post new topicReply to topic
View previous topic Log in to check your private messages View next topic
Author Message
DavidSpearritt
Moderator



Joined: Jan 09, 2005
Posts: 757
Location: Brisbane, Australia


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 11:45 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Any doubt that product development in modern consumer electronics has gone completely barmy, will be removed when you take a look at this useless thing.

http://musicthing.blogspot.com/2005/10/there-is-god-and-his-name-is-sony-pcm.html

I guess everyone is trying desperately to develop another killer device like the iPod. Its made of titanium (why?) and costs $2000 USD (bargain!) and uses crossed cardioids, except they are not coincident but spaced incorrectly, left audio will arrive at the right hand mike first (ugh!). Classic design errors.

I had a good laugh, what do others think.

_________________
http://www.lodestarrecordings.com.au
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's website
Plush
Recording Org
Pro Audio Forums



Joined: Jul 19, 2003
Posts: 111
Location: Chicago


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:27 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Oh my root! I hope that they've made the correction for the channel reversal internally.

I saw this thing in New York last weekend but forgot to make an enquiry as to the above.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
Zilla
Recording Org
Pro Audio Forums



Joined: Mar 29, 2005
Posts: 358
Location: Hollywood


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:36 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

How do you press RECORD when it is at the top of a 18' mic stand?
View user's profileSend private message
Costy
Recording Org
Pro Audio Forums



Joined: Feb 15, 2005
Posts: 179
Location: Virginia, USA


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:45 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
How do you press RECORD when it is at the top of a 18' mic stand? -- Zilla
Nothing is more easy: just order the thing with optional (+ $1000) remote control... I bet it's of titanium as well. Shocked

_________________
Costy L
www.factor13records.com
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's website
JoeH
Moderator



Joined: Jun 22, 2004
Posts: 1913
Location: Philadelphia, PA/ Greenville, DE


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:22 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Yikes! It looks a little like Robbie the Robot or something.

WAYYYYY too much $ for the features. I don't care if it's made of solid gold, that's just ridiculous at $2k. It's a nice prosumer "toy", but at that price, I'd rather go after the M-Audio version without the mics for $499.
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's websiteAIM Address
DavidSpearritt
Moderator



Joined: Jan 09, 2005
Posts: 757
Location: Brisbane, Australia


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 3:59 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Plush wrote:
Oh my root! I hope that they've made the correction for the channel reversal internally.

I saw this thing in New York last weekend but forgot to make an enquiry as to the above.


It would take some pretty fancy DSP to separate the directional cues and time delay cues to correct for just one of them. Lake could probably do it, I guess it would drive the cost up a bit. Smile

_________________
http://www.lodestarrecordings.com.au
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's website
RemyRAD
Moderator



Joined: Sep 26, 2005
Posts: 4333
Location: Washington DC Virginia suburbs


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:05 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

It doesn't record 5.1, so how useful could it be? I mean, Sony now offers a consumer camcorder that records surroundsound! What ever happened to quadraphonic??
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM Address
DavidSpearritt
Moderator



Joined: Jan 09, 2005
Posts: 757
Location: Brisbane, Australia


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:44 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Now for about 2/3 the price, here is a device where the designers have got a real clue. Its certainly on my shopping list.
http://www.nagraaudio.com/pro/pages/products_ares_m.php

_________________
http://www.lodestarrecordings.com.au
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's website
John Stafford
Recording Org
Pro Audio Forums



Joined: Oct 01, 2004
Posts: 847
Location: Dublin, Ireland


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 9:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi David
That looks like something I could could enjoy playing with! Anyone know of something like this with digital inputs? I'd love something a little more affordable for emergency backup.
John
View user's profileSend private message
Plush
Recording Org
Pro Audio Forums



Joined: Jul 19, 2003
Posts: 111
Location: Chicago


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 9:42 am Reply with quoteBack to top

DavidSpearritt wrote:
Plush wrote:
Oh my root! I hope that they've made the correction for the channel reversal internally.

I saw this thing in New York last weekend but forgot to make an enquiry as to the above.


It would take some pretty fancy DSP to separate the directional cues and time delay cues to correct for just one of them. Lake could probably do it, I guess it would drive the cost up a bit. Smile


Actually, this is a correct variant of xy placement, as you know. The difference is that you have to connect the left ch. xlr to the right mic and vice versa.

So, Sony could just switch the channels in analog before going to the adc.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
Cucco
Moderator



Joined: Mar 8, 2004
Posts: 4776
Location: Fredericksburg, VA


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 10:22 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Plush wrote:
DavidSpearritt wrote:
Plush wrote:
Oh my root! I hope that they've made the correction for the channel reversal internally.

I saw this thing in New York last weekend but forgot to make an enquiry as to the above.


It would take some pretty fancy DSP to separate the directional cues and time delay cues to correct for just one of them. Lake could probably do it, I guess it would drive the cost up a bit. Smile


Actually, this is a correct variant of xy placement, as you know. The difference is that you have to connect the left ch. xlr to the right mic and vice versa.

So, Sony could just switch the channels in analog before going to the adc.


I don't think simply swapping the cables internally would do the trick.

You would have sound from the left first hitting the right, but it would be off-axis. You would then have reflections due to the actual placement of the microphone elements.

So you would have:

A time delay, similar but not as drastic as non-coincident techniques (AB, NOS)

Channel reversal (easily fixed by swapping channels)

Acoustical build-up

I don't know, maybe this could all easily be corrected, it just doesn't seem that easy to me.

J.

_________________
www.myspace.com/sublymerecords
www.sublymerecords.com
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailVisit poster's websiteMSN Messenger
Cucco
Moderator



Joined: Mar 8, 2004
Posts: 4776
Location: Fredericksburg, VA


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 10:23 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Zilla wrote:
How do you press RECORD when it is at the top of a 18' mic stand?



http://www.futurehorizons.net/HILL_lg.jpg

_________________
www.myspace.com/sublymerecords
www.sublymerecords.com
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailVisit poster's websiteMSN Messenger
RemyRAD
Moderator



Joined: Sep 26, 2005
Posts: 4333
Location: Washington DC Virginia suburbs


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:57 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

the microphones are correct if you mounted upside down on top of that 18 foot stand? Aren't they? If the microphones are XY, does that mean they're all boys?
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM Address
DavidSpearritt
Moderator



Joined: Jan 09, 2005
Posts: 757
Location: Brisbane, Australia


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 3:49 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
Actually, this is a correct variant of xy placement, as you know. The difference is that you have to connect the left ch. xlr to the right mic and vice versa.

So, Sony could just switch the channels in analog before going to the adc.


No its not a correct variant of XY, and this was my point. They have to be coincident or truely "crossed".

Assume the channels are swapped. You still have a small time delay associated with the capsule distance of 30mm or so. But this time delay swaps the channels opposite to the directional arrangement of channels. Like I originally stated, consider the time delay path only, assuming from the picture that the left channel mic is on the right, sound from the left reaches the right mic first!

Its only small but what it would do to most of the central image where the directivity is still strong in both channels is laughable.

_________________
http://www.lodestarrecordings.com.au
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's website
RemyRAD
Moderator



Joined: Sep 26, 2005
Posts: 4333
Location: Washington DC Virginia suburbs


------------

Books To Read
Your Forum Posts

gimmie gear

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 5:16 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

You know, with XY, the delay is not a major factor. The stereo image is rather bland however. Neither is crossed coincidence. With ORTF, better stereo image many more phase problems but a substantially broader stereo image. Blumlien, don't know which way they're headed?

So do what I do, when possible..... Use MS! A beautiful and adjustable stereo image, from a narrow to a wide perspective. Oh!? Europeans do that, not us Americans even if there is NO PHASE DISTORTION!

When they are summed to Mono, you completely lose the out of phase, figure 8 mic. The stereo sound and imaging, is stunning with this setup. Far more impressive than your other choices. You end up with a beautiful solid monaural image, front and center! The setup is far less obtrusive and does not require a lot of hanging hardware (I hate seeing all that crap).

For orchestral work, choirs, it's hard to beat a beautiful pair of ribbon microphones. You want simplicity? Try the Shure MS all in one condenser microphones. Or the Phantom powered Royer stereo ribbon? I love using the Bayer M130, figure 8 and the M160 HyperCardioid. Relatively small and inexpensive along with being far less unobtrusive. You want less obtrusive? Shoeps has a miniature condenser version. Why are people so hot on spaced omnis and cardios? Besides, here, everybody is discussing a useless rich man's toy. Have I gotten everybody angry now with my stupid sensible practical suggestions?? Has anybody learned anything here? I think so. Don't buy these stupid Sony toys.

That awful, 50-year-old, Grammy and Emmy nominated engineer, woman that doesn't know nothin'.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM Address
Display posts from previous:      
Post new topicReply to topic
View previous topic Log in to check your private messages View next topic



This topic sponsored by:

  Full Compass
(Buy Sure Gear - Get Free Stuff)


  Lavry Black
(Extraordinary Stereo DA Converter)


  Sontronics
(Delta Phantom Powered Ribbon Mics)


  Sontronics
(STC-80 - Handheld Dynamic Mics)


  Sound Performance Lab
(Tube, Mastering, Analog Gear)


  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



Powered by phpBB © 2001 phpBB Group

PHP-Nuke Port by Tom Nitzschner [Total Redesign By: Lorkan Themes] & 2004 www.toms-home.com
Announcements
News, Articles
· SPL releases the Vitalizer® Analog Code® Plug-in
· FXpansion Audio - Newsletter November 2009
· DubSpot’s Ableton Live 8 US Sessions Tour is coming to Los Angeles!
· Syntheway introduces Virtual Sitar VST Instrument software.
· SAE Institute Graduate Receives TEC Award
· FULL COMPASS SYSTEMS RECOGNIZES 25-YEAR EMPLOYEES
· SAE Atlanta and Euphonix present; Vincent di Pasquale and the
· SPL News - For free. No joke.

[ More in News Section ]
Current Topics!
Last 10 Forum Messages

New Conrad Echelon Amp
Last post by Sundhy in Musical Instruments on Nov 20, 2009 at 21:36:32

Amp Hookup
Last post by bent in Mixing Live Sound on Nov 20, 2009 at 21:02:05

Help with a Ramsa mixer
Last post by studio33 in Pro Audio Gear on Nov 20, 2009 at 19:32:05

Neil Young Official Release Series Vinyl
Last post by roknrobman in Pro Recording Forum on Nov 20, 2009 at 18:17:56

Neil Young Official Release Series Vinyl
Last post by roknrobman in Mastering Sound Forum on Nov 20, 2009 at 18:15:08

Instrumental Rock Mix: Any Suggestions???
Last post by dayn72283 in Song & Mix Collaboration on Nov 20, 2009 at 16:56:23

Live recording: group track bounce or aux send?
Last post by GentleG in Pro Recording Forum on Nov 20, 2009 at 12:53:02

Pro Tools 8 M-powered will monitor but won't record
Last post by hueseph in DAW Pro Audio on Nov 20, 2009 at 12:27:17

Correct Way Of Recording Vocals?
Last post by natural in Recording Vocals on Nov 20, 2009 at 11:44:37

Third Time's a Charm!
Last post by k-dub in Song & Mix Collaboration on Nov 20, 2009 at 11:43:07


[ ]
New Topics!

New Conrad Echelon Amp
Neil Young Official Release Series Vinyl
Neil Young Official Release Series Vinyl
Instrumental Rock Mix: Any Suggestions???
Amp Hookup
Third Time's a Charm!
Live recording: group track bounce or aux send?
Drum heads
how to make my hobby my career?
Correct Way Of Recording Vocals?
recording problem
Home studio in basement(Poland) - possible in so small room?
FS - Recording Studio in North West UK
Gibson Under Investigation
Alchemy - This is downright wicked!
Recording newbie HELP regarding interfaces questions
Basic newb questions, please give advice.
Are the feds coming after your ....
Who can hear the difference?

Forums

BookMark

 _MAKEBOOKMARK

Recording Org RSS Feeds Community News. or Pro Audio Forums

Read this if you are a new poster Rules, who needs em?

For more information on advertising, investing , merging or any other ideas you may have for this community" Feedback

Pro Audio forums, Pro Audio Dealer, audio reviews and all the moderating here is volunteer. Please remember no-one is being paid to be here or deliver hot coffee. Play Fair, be polite, patient and considerate to others. Title your topics properly and do not slander anyone, ever online.
Read this before your post here: Recording Org Disclaimer


This site can be translated into 13 languages. 錄音工作室幫助下,新聞和信息,數位專業音頻論壇, Opname studio helpen, nieuws en informatie, digitale pro audio forums, Studio d'enregistrement à l'aide de nouvelles et d'information, forums de l'audio numérique pro, Tonstudio helfen, Nachrichten und Informationen, digitale Pro-Audio-Foren, Estudio de grabación ayuda, información y noticias, foros de audio digital profesional. help, pro tools, cubase, nuendo, DAW, AD/DA, microphone, preamp, compressor, equalizer, Music Education, Arranging, Composing, collaboration des musiciens, professionelle Musiker und Ingenieure, colaboración de músicos profesionales y los ingenieros lo que pensamos acerca de una banda Our new beta site is now online for testing The New Recording.org CMS
For Incredible Quality Web Hosting Services


© 2000-2009 All Rights Reserved

PHP-Nuke Copyright © 2005 by Francisco Burzi. This is free software, and you may redistribute it under the GPL. PHP-Nuke comes with absolutely no warranty, for details, see the license.
Page Generation: 0.50 Seconds

.: fiSubBrown Shadow phpbb2 style by Lorkan Themes :.
.: Original Theme (FiSubSilver Shadow) by: Daz 2004 :.