Questions on the Classical Music Recording Industry

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:27 am

Greetings to all.

Here in Chennai, South India, most (former) major (?) labels releasing acoustic music have closed down. Some are lying dormant and ONE company is releasing serious Carnatic music. There are a few fundamentalist religious organizations which sometimes record the big musicians, but I cannot take them seriously. And then theres some type of "fusion" in which tasteless individuals will get together and bastardize multiple genres in one go. As for the one company currently actually active, i'm pretty sure its not a profit making scene... Somebody has a lot of money and is running it to suit their fancy. The base reality is that not enough people here want to spend money on serious music. Piracy/sharing is the dominating means of distribution for the very small listener base that has time for anything other than bubblegum pop and "bollywood" style film music.

Now my question: Whats happening out there? Is the classical music industry profitable as a whole by itself, or does it survive because of governmental subsidies and corporate sponsorships? I can believe that the sort of guy who listens to Bartok or Stockhausen will probably want to go out and buy a CD (tho' the only guy i know who listens to Bartok and Stockhausen freely copies stuff for friends) , but your run of the mill casual listener who wants to listen to "Fur Elise" or some iteration of "Greatest Hits of Classical Music" again will probably have no problems with downloading it. And then I imagine that the major part of the audience which listens (?) to classical music will be the "coffee table book" type, for whom it will simply be mandatory to have some work of "The Three Tenors" or Andrea Bocelli or whoever is the current "face" of classical music... What i'm saying is that I find it difficult to believe that when established pop music record companies (with 1000 times the listener base as classical music) are not able to survive, how is the classical music recording industry keeping its head above the water?

My second question is perhaps a bit more subjective... Out here, old timers believe that the best days of classical music are over (but don't they always Rolling Eyes

?) and what we have today is simply not worth recording/preserving. Either it is the beating of a long dead horse or some tasteless abomination in the name of progress and experimentation. I AM personally inspired by the phenomenal capability of some of the musicians I work with, but still, I am always a little insecure when a veteran listener tells me that the music is long dead.

Would you guys care to discuss these (that i imagine must be) universal issues confronting the acoustic music recording community....

Respect,

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:53 am

rfreez wrote:

Here in Chennai, South India, most (former) major (?) labels releasing acoustic music have closed down.

Which ones are you referring to?

Quote:

how is the classical music recording industry keeping its head above the water?

It isn't... Many major labels have closed facilities, Decca, Sony, Philips... Money is being made with the Boccelli/Rieu kind of bubblegum indeed.

It may be different for small independent labels, some of which may in fact be profitable, but they don't have to feed as many people. I also think recording fees have changed...

Quote:

My second question is perhaps a bit more subjective... Out here, old timers believe that the best days of classical music are over (but don't they always Rolling Eyes

?)

Yup... Even in the olden days, everything was better in the olden days... Rolling Eyes

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 6:27 am

Classical music recording in the US is almost non existent. Naxos and Telarc are about the only ones left doing classical recording and now that Telarc has been bought out I am not sure what their fate will be. I think in the last couple of years that Telarc has been working closely with the Cincinnati orchestra producing a lot of the "best of" or "songs from" and not much real "sink your teeth into it" classical recording.

There are a couple of problems with classical recording today. First is is so expensive to hire an orchestra or larger ensemble and the hopes of making any money on the album are dismal. Even if you go with a single performer doing the recording the hopes of making back your investment are really slim and record companies are keenly aware of this problem.

Today, the first time a school has budget problems (and what school does not have budget problems), the first thing to go is the arts. When I was in school our high school had a lot of music ensembles but now my high school only has a marching band for football games. The orchestra, wind ensemble and chamber ensembles are all gone. Since no one learns or is exposed to classical music in schools how are they suppose to want it when they are adults. A lot of young people today don't learn to play any type of classical instrument and if it is not an electric guitar, electric bass or drums they want no part of it. Also a lot of young people today spend an inordinate amount of time playing video games and listening to their ipod (sometimes doing both at once) and unfortunately classical music sometimes requires your undivided attention.

I know there is still a lot of classical recording going on and we do some on a regular basis but most of it is going to CDs that will be sold by the performer or the local book stores or is used for getting live gigs for the performer. I live less than a mile from a major conservatory of music and I know a lot of the professors. I also know some of the students and they are worried about what is going to happen to them when they get out and try to get a job in the real world. With most major symphony orchestras having money problems, with the virtual stoppage of any classical recording and with stable professorships (i.e. no one going anywhere soon) in a lot of colleges their chance of landing a really good high paying job are not good.

Maybe it is different in Europe or the rest of the world but classical music is dying a very slow death here in the states....and it really is too bad.

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:00 am

On the first question of there being money to be made, I can not comment on the state of the classical recording industry but where I live (Suffolk, UK) most classical concerts employing only professional musicians are either subsidised by a regional arts promotion body (using government, i.e. tax payer's money, or money from the European Union) or sponsored by a local business (or both).
Are the best days of classical music over? There are several different facets to that question...
The first thing to look at surely is composition. Are modern composers producing something worthwhile or are they under pressure to be novel at the expense or writing something that is a pleasure to listen to? Whatever the reason it is unfortunately the case that many modern compositions have a much more limited appeal than the older, established repertoire. As far as I can see this has always been the case though because many of the current popular composers were considered avante-garde and not very popular during their own life times.
The quality of performance is also a factor and as other people have pointed out, to make sure you discover the very best performers of any generation you have to make sure they start a course of musical study so there must be that incentive.
Finally there is the quality of the recording. Even if you can not convince people that a new recording of bruch's violin concerto is a must have because the violinist is the best there has ever been you may be able to get sales by the violinist being top flight and this being the new digital recording.
Perhaps where we are at is that most of the market for classical music is for established works and that most of the record companies have recordings of all of this catalogue with quality performers with digital recording so why would they add anything new to the catalogue when they can just sell what they have got. If that is the case then perhaps if surround sound takes off for classical music listening there will be a host of new recordings (old old compostions).

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:42 am

Thomas W. Bethel wrote:

Naxos and Telarc are about the only ones left doing classical recording and now that Telarc has been bought out I am not sure what their fate will be.

I hadn't heard about this. Can you provide more details??

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:37 am

It's clear to me that the business of making recordings of "core repertoire" classical music and selling them to a mass market is all but dead. The final nail in the coffin will be driven as the classical recordings from Europe made in the 60's lose their copyrights on their 50th birthday. It's hard to beat free when it is illegal. Even harder when it's legal.

We'll have to see what markets open for new music and if any of them have mass appeal. One good thing is that it is much easier for a niche market to survive than it was even a few years ago.

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 3:26 pm

Something else is going on, too. The world social-economic climate is changing. As Asia has become more dominant, all other countries have had to compete harder to keep up. That means more stress and more hours at the workplace. People come home too tired or jittery to relax to classical or other kinds of acoustic music (assuming they listen to music at all).

Classical is out of place in the car when traffic makes you late for an appointment. You'll often tend to listen to something "up" and mindless as you look for shortcuts across town, not something soothing or that requires concentration to appreciate. (i.e., How many kids of any era traditionally have preferred orchestral music?)

This isn't a bunch of theoretical nonsense. It's real and it has affected what people listen to and how they spend their diminished free time.

Classical music is suffering because we live in an era that has become too hectic; people no longer take the time to appreciate it. And bottom line profit is now the only thing important to business so grants to the arts are harder to come by.

It is up to us to find the niche audience necessary to keep contemporary performances and recordings alive. Nobody else cares.

Russ Reinberg

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 3:43 pm

I think the recording industry is dying, but the live music scene is alive and well. We still have wonderful concert series and festivals coming through our city every year and subscription rates are remaining steady. Live music is really where its at.

Recordings are at saturation point, everyone has numerous copies of this and that, there are old recordings to choose from, modern "state of the art", there are simply too many. I laugh at Gramophone reviews where those guys are struggling for new adjectives, new turns of phrase, new angles to describe yet another new but typical rendition of something that is already in listener's record collections 10 times over. You will see that all new artists are all young and sexy. This is what they are now trying to sell, youth and sex. Some of the photos of female classical performers, pouting at the camera with a twinkle in the eye are hilarious. This is an industry in a desperate state.

Live music is the future, its a collective experience which human beings love so much. Sitting at home pleasuring oneself with a recording (pardon the parallels) is boring. Go out and get amoungst it.

Says he, having just bought some big new loudspeakers for the lounge and playing his old CD's again. Smile

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:59 pm

Let's face folks, the New York City metropolitan opera is now starting to offer live performances, presented and projected, at your local movie theaters, across the country, in high-definition picture quality and 5.1 Dolby surround. Those recordings are certainly being archived and/or made for release later but you have to be there and in on the productions. So now it is our job to start canvassing our local orchestral and operatic organizations to broadcast their concerts to the local movie theaters, live. We all need work and it only requires a single high-speed Internet connection!

The future is here
Ms. Remy Ann David

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:44 am

[quote="d_fu"]

rfreez wrote:

Here in Chennai, South India, most (former) major (?) labels releasing acoustic music have closed down.

Quote:

Which ones are you referring to?

Magnasound, Sangeetha, Vani, Inreco, Oriental Records, Music Today... ALL have stopped recording Carnatic music. Some, like Magnasound, have closed down completely, others, like Sangeetha are sitting dormant, having licensed out most of their stuff. Then there are those that sell back catalogues only and others who are putting out very dubious music for meditation, yoga, relaxation, spiritual healing etc.

Quote:

It may be different for small independent labels, some of which may in fact be profitable, but they don't have to feed as many people.

Vaguely I remember having asked you about this before.... could you please elaborate? Its exactly where i'd like to be.... a small profitable independent label, so that i don't have to make as much electronic music as i do.

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I also think recording fees have changed...

Again, could you please elaborate?

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It's hard to beat free when it is illegal. Even harder when it's legal.

I think that should go down as a "quotable quote".

Quote:

We'll have to see what markets open for new music and if any of them have mass appeal.

i guess thats the only positive way to look at it.

Quote:

One good thing is that it is much easier for a niche market to survive than it was even a few years ago.

Could you please elaborate?

Quote:

I think the recording industry is dying, but the live music scene is alive and well. We still have wonderful concert series and festivals coming through our city every year and subscription rates are remaining steady. Live music is really where its at.

I wish i could make a profession out of just listening to live music Laughing

Do critics get big dollar?

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:52 am

I think it's a paradigm shift in general.

Think about it, in the 30s and 40s, there weren't a large number of professional orchestras - at least not NEAR as many as there are now. In addition, there weren't near as many professional musicians. There was a boom through the 50s-80s - going to the symphony was a viable form of entertainment and as Russ points out, it was easy to relax to classical music.

Now, with busy lives and hectic commutes, putting on a Mahler Symphony just isn't practical while speeding from point a to point b. Also, taking 4 hours out of your life to drive to the concert hall and listen to music you may or may not be familiar with.

What I see is that more people are going to local, amatuer orchestra concerts where the musicians are either paid very little or nothing!

The recordings we do are for these types of groups are usually made for the sake of preservation and for the members' sakes (occassionally some audience members).

Groups are starting to understand that they don't need large labels to distribute their work when a good, local recording company and DiscMakers can get them a thousand distributable disks for around $3K! Considering that, over the course of a year, they can recoup all of their costs and then some.

Basically, I see this whole phase as a re-adjustment in the music scene.

There will be less musicians being spun out of college, less musicians taking symphony jobs, less symphonies (big-time paid symphonies that is) and more amatuer ensembles. Then, when this all happens (when we're at the "bottom") things will again turn around. People will start to want better orchestras again (versus the little community groups) and the orchestra will again begin to rise.

I wouldn't expect it to be the Brahms orchestra - I think that kind of orchestra is all but dead. Instead, it will be a neo-classical symphony. Sure, they'll play Brahms, but they'll play 21st century music (likely MUCH shorter music based on movies or video games!)

People won't GO to the symphony - they'll listen on-line. This will mean the death of the concert hall. Instead, orchestras (probably including a lot of virtual instruments) will perform in large studios (thus the resurgence of the larger studio). Eventually, it will come back in favor to go SEE the performance, thus the resurgence of the concert hall. Of course, this major paradigm shift will take place over the next 100 years.

It's all a matter of readjustment.

If someone in politics doesn't make a big statement about the arts soon and figure out someway to subsidize it (all art forms), there's going to be big trouble for the arts.

Vote for me when I run for president in 2016 and I swear, I'll subsidize the hell out of the arts!

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:16 am

hughesmr wrote:

Thomas W. Bethel wrote:

Naxos and Telarc are about the only ones left doing classical recording and now that Telarc has been bought out I am not sure what their fate will be.

I hadn't heard about this. Can you provide more details??

See this article http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_concord_buys_telarc/ or just type in Concord purchases Telarc on your browser.

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 10:09 am

Quote:

One good thing is that it is much easier for a niche market to survive than it was even a few years ago.

Could you please elaborate?

This has been pretty well described in Chris Anderson's articles and book on "The Long Tail." The basic idea is that setting distribution cost to zero (via the web) lowers the bar to entry. For instance, if record klezmer music or Indian classical, iTunes is happy to carry all you will format and send their way. It will be there forever without your having to do anything about inventory. The distribution is international. You still have to market, and you may have problems with iTunes price structure, but one of the biggest problems for a niche distibutor - distribution and market access - is solved - cheap.

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:08 pm

Cucco wrote:

Vote for me when I run for president in 2016 and I swear, I'll subsidize the hell out of the arts!

It is interested that a measure of civilisation and progress is the shift away from the essential life supporting activities of providing ourselves with shelter, food and water towards other activities that are there just for interest or pleasure. That doesn't mean that each person should work for less of his time but if you look at the mix of jobs in a western ecconomy you see that relatively few are directly concerned with building houses or food production - most are in the provision of luxury goods or services.

No one doubts the importance of economics, but it is also possible to mistake wealth for quality of life. Here in the UK where I live we rate highly in Europe for wealth but we are certainly not top of the recent "standard of living" league table - that goes to the significantly more socialist France.

Perhaps more people need to make a concious decision not to go for more money, a bigger house, a bigger car etc. and instead make time for family, friends and to appreciate the natural world and the arts (even if apreciating music is only taking the the time to put on a recording and really listen to it).

Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 7:45 am

It is very difficult to discern the current state of music. We are simply too close to it to see the big picture. Historically, musicians have been poor. Mozart is a prime example. The fact that there does not seem to be much money in music today should not make us think that we cannot produce great music.

Even something like recordings going into public domain, which on the face of it seems to be detrimental, is a complicated issue. Obviously if such recordings were freely available, people would be much more likely to be exposed to classical music. This new listener base may wish to hear new recordings, live concerts, and new compositions. Take for example remakes of films. A person may own a dvd of a film. He can watch it all he wants for the cost of electricity. Hollywood then releases a remake of the film. Many people go see such remakes, even if they have seen the original. It goes without saying that people go to see new films, even if they have seen others. They do this despite the fact that they can get an endless supply of free entertainment on broadcast TV. Strangely enough, some of the biggest selling dvds are television series, which were previously available for free.

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