can't get a good guitar tone in protools

Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:48 pm

pfactionbrett wrote:

I think it has to be the mic placement that's off. there's so many ways, off axis, center, edge of center, edge of cone, center cone etc.

You can document that too. Measuring tape and stick drawings work.

Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 7:33 pm

I still find this hard to figure. That's a good amp and cabinet. Stick a 57 anywhere close to the speaker and you should get an OK sound. Nothing to write home about maybe, but nothing to make you move the mic a million time and describe the situation like he does. Either the room or maybe the mic?? Has someone been hammering nails with your 57?

What kinds of things have you recorded where you got a sound that you really liked?

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 9:00 am

I have to agree with Bob -

Good instrument, good sound, good microphone...it's a recipe for a good recording. You should be able to place the 57 and within 30 seconds get the sound in the recording.

This tells me that the sound that you're hearing in the room is not the actual sound that's in the room. Rose-colored glasses for the ears??

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 9:13 am

Well the sound is full, but it sounds kind of dull. It doesn't have that rumble and definition that I want.

the sm57 is brand new

things I recorded that I had a tone I liked were open and bar chords in drop d.

I guess basically it may be that my EQ is lacking something but I can't seem to figure out what.

Maybe i'll post a clip of the guitar tone later today and you all can give me some input.

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 9:59 am

pfactionbrett wrote:

I guess basically it may be that my EQ is lacking something but I can't seem to figure out what.

Dude...did you read my first post??

Your EQ is not lacking.

Don't touch the EQ.

Get the sound using the mic and the cab. If you can't, you will only screw up the sound more by using an EQ. It's a matter of taking a bad (or "off") sound and screwing the with phase (which is what EQ does). Your sound will never get there with EQ.

You may think it does, but when you listen to it over and over, you'll start to say..."gosh, my guitar still has that wierd something to it..." that "wierd something" is the EQ.

Do you have any more/other mics?

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:18 am

I meant the emsa's EQ but ok.

I have a sm57, sm58, and a poopty Nady PCM-100 condenser mic that my singer bought because he liked the "look" of it.

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:21 am

Just on the off chance, you didn't happen to move the amp did you?

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:32 am

Quote:

Maybe i'll post a clip of the guitar tone later today and you all can give me some input.

Please do! In fact, if you could post maybe 3 different clips, along with the documentation of the different setups (stick figures and the like) and what you do or do not like about each, you might get more specific recommendations.

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:33 am

Quote:

Maybe i'll post a clip of the guitar tone later today and you all can give me some input.

Please do! In fact, if you could post maybe 3 different clips, along with the documentation of the different setups (stick figures and the like) and what you do or do not like about each, you might get more specific recommendations.

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 11:19 am

pfactionbrett wrote:

I meant the emsa's EQ but ok.

I have a sm57, sm58, and a poopty Nady PCM-100 condenser mic that my singer bought because he liked the "look" of it.

My bad - yes, tweak that EQ to your heart's delight.

Re: the Nady...after you use it to smack your singer in the back of the head for purchasing it based on looks...try it in conjunction with your 57. Maybe it will add a little depth.

If I'm ever struggling to get "that" sound out of a guitar and I can't do it with a single Beyer M130, Royer 121 or SM57, I grab a second mic (usually condenser and usually a little edgy) and add it in.

Also, have you tried micing the rear of the cab? Sometimes this helps a little too in getting a different and good sound.

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 11:52 am

Pfaction,

You mentioned earlier that you were digging' the tone in the room, but what was actually going to tape doesn't cut it. Have you thrown up a mic in the room and listened to it along with your mic in front of the driver?

You've got three mics, throw them all up and see what sounds you can capture.

Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 7:02 pm

I have been quietly watching this....

Now I'm gonna go ape frickin shite!!!!! Evil or Very Mad

Nevermind...I'm okay now.

Dude. Ya got such good advice...OVER AND OVER.

Ben got it real close in his last post.

IF...and I say this with a hopeful tone.....IF theres a spot in the room that you absolutely LOVE the sound of the amp, mark that spot. Get ANY frickin microphone...even the pretty and useless one....put it on a stand at the heighth of YOUR EAR....the one you LOVE the sound through......mix this second mic in with the first not so cool sound.

Its really easy. AND it'll either work or it wont.

The next thing you should do is document all the attempts you've made, assess if any of these are doing what you want, and if not, move on to something and come back to this one later.

After a while of frustration, ours minds start to play tricks on us.

Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:30 am

Well last night I found a nice sweet spot with the sm57 on one of the speakers. I marked the face of the cabinet with tape so I don't lose the position.

I then also took the Nady and put it about a foot away from one of the speakers and I recorded those two mics as two tracks. I liked the tone, so I doubled all the parts so I have 4 tracks and I have to say the parts of the song with chug chug palm muting sound absoultely wonderful. The nady sounds brighter, but it doesn't have the edge and dirtyness of the 57 so I lowered it quite a bit more compared to the 57 in the mix, panned the 57 to the left, nady to the right on the one track, then opposite on the doubled track.

I think if I just found a good EQ on my amp for the next tone I'd do, my mic settings would work perfect. What ballpark of settings (EQ) would work for decent metal tones like killswitch engage or something. I have a friend wanting to lay down a metal song but I dont play metal and wouldn't know where to start EQ'ing a metal tone.

thanks for all the help so far it's lead me in the irght direciton.

Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 1:16 am

Maybe you could put the amp somewhere else in the room. Oh, you may not be able to achieve that first sound. Your memory might have glorified what you actually heard. Instead, maybe try and get a brand new tone that you really like. Or add another mic and keep trying.

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