Field recording Equipment

Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2002 11:04 am

I've been offered to record dialog and sound effects for a movie production (low budget), and to do post as well; my background is studio work (various styles of music, mostly pop and Jazz)and live sound engineering, so I'm fairly new to the issues of audio for video (though not new to the audio field at all :p ); what basic equipment would you suggest for dialog recording and sound effects recording (mics, shotgun, booms, recording format, etc.), and what tips to avoid the most common pitfalls?

Thank you for your help

Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2002 8:14 pm

Quote:

Originally posted by gerax:
... my background is studio work (various styles so I'm fairly new to the issues of audio for video...

Hello..
Ahhh! video, how many camera's, cause if they are using just one, you can tie right into the cam,(low Budget), done it, and it works well. Hi-fi if s/video, or beta SP, dvcam, or digibeta. If they are using more at one time, then you need SMPTE generation on a separate recording device. Syncing of the separate sequences will handled in post, more cams would be great for a live switched type thing, but if more cams are used just for a wide angle, or copter shot effect, it won't matter so much. But if they are used to cover a series of events, like a car chase scene, quick action, etc., then separate SMPTE generation IS what you need. The process will involve mainly the dialogue. The editors will work mainly with this part, and clips that build the timeline, you can then take the finished dialogue(timeline), process the audio, on their timeline, add the required effects etc. These you will capture on your recording device, on the sets, noises, atmosphere, effects, etc., some may be canned, then there is the music etc. All this stuff will be on the timeline at specific places. So many tracks may be needed. Have a look at the storyboard, and script, this will give you a clear understanding of the sequence, and give you an idea of what equipment you may need.

Quote:

Originally posted by gerax:

what basic equipment would you suggest for dialog recording and sound effects recording (mics, shotgun, booms, recording format, etc.), and what tips to avoid the most common pitfalls?

You will need a good handheld boom w/shock mount, maybe bigger-one, (depends), shotgun mic, with a wind screen, possibly a recording device with SMPTE Time code generator, actually better for all the other sound, etc., cause it will be easier to log, find, and sync up. Depending on the shots, some extra mics to bury somewhere, a mixer for the mics (someone to watch levels), cabling, lots of it, like I said it depends on the script and storyboard.
Think ahead, if there is a bar scene, the actual background is not present when dialogue is being taped, it is added later. As far as recording format, any good camcorder, with TC will work (just roll with the lenscap on) or let it fly, any other portable recorder with TC, 16 bit at least if digital. Headphones, ones that cover well, closed type. You may need extensions, and send an audio feed to the main cam, so director can review shots.

Precautions: After thought, if you are in another country, the sync standards may be of a different kind, for PAL, or other formats. Though it may be an equal process just a different type.

When the director calls for sound, check your TC is running in record and reply.
Keep the boom out of the shot this will take practice, and listen to how to move the mic around, without clanging, and get used to pointing. Point the rear of the mic toward loud sounds on the set, like traffic, or construction, loud people etc. In other-words keep it behind you. Reposition if you have to, and work it out with the director.

Keep the boom out of the shadows, from the sun, from lights, and reflections, that might be in a frame. Keep audio lines away from power for lights etc. If you have to cross one, do it at right angles and listen for hum.
If linked to a camera, match the levels carefully, don't distort anything, keep it a good average level. Do not use auto level, the background will just rise and fall, with the dialogue. Make sure the cables and connectors on the boom do not clang, foam and duct-tape, if you have to. Bring foam and duct-tape.
If you have to get a busy street sound, record enough, so you don't have to loop. For vehicles, door slams, etc., let the natural sound, near, far, close, be done with your distance. Refer to the script and story board a lot. Use roll-off if too boomy, rumbly, or do it in post.

Oh man... did I write all that?
Well, for your first, I hope it is a good shoot and that minimal equipment be involved, so you can enjoy, and feel the vibe of the producers as you make this come to life.
Hope this helps some, Chime in anytime Boom Chic!
If you have any more info about the project, I would be very interested in what is involved.
--Rick

Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2002 2:13 am

Hi Rick

Thanx a lote for your reply, it was really helpfull.

The subject of the movie is a 1700 circa story, so there will be costumes involved; it will be shot in DV cam, with only one camera (as I said it's low budget), so no multiple shots and no things like car chases or copter shots ( Sad

); I talked to a couple of guys friend of mine who work in the audio/video field, and as a recording medium they suggested me a portable DAT: since I own one, would it be a viable solution or it's mandatory that I use something you listed above?
Also, I asked the director and the camera OP to work at 48KHz, so I will be recording at 48KHz 16 Bit, and doing post in Pro Tools.
I already have a copy of the script, and I'm currently analizing any troublesome scenes; they actually asked me to get a full stereo sound for some movement shots, like in a scene where a horse rides by from l to r, so I was thinking about getting a couple of mics to do an MS technique. Is it a good choice, or is better to record it mono and move it later in post?
Dialog will be the most important thing, as there are few effects (apart from backgrounds and some common things) to be recorded, so will 1 shotgun be enough or should I get more than one to be used with different characters ( I also have a lavalier mic available)? I was thinking about getting a couple of boundary mics to shot a dinner table scene where there's about ten people acting, is it a good idea? Also, is there a sure method to take note of what piece of audio recorded is coming from a particular scene (apart from writing it down)?
Wow that's a lot of questions I asked, but you know, when approaching a new job for the first time you're never sure enough <img border="0" alt="[retard]" title="" src="graemlins/retard.gif" /> .

Thanx in advance for all the help you can give me.

Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2002 9:48 am

Quote:

Originally posted by gerax:

The subject of the movie is a 1700 circa story, so there will be costumes involved; it will be shot in DV cam, with only one camera (as I said it's low budget).

Sounds really cool! Send an audio feed from your equipment, (line out) to at least one cam input if possible. One cam works fine, the director blocks all of his shots, and lines are read accordingly. Like all (his) over the shoulder shots, all (her's) etc. the 2 shot,(just examples). The director will hear, on phones, what you are capturing for him on playback.

Quote:

Originally posted by gerax:

I talked to a couple of guys friend of mine who work in the audio/video field, and as a recording medium they suggested me a portable DAT: since I own one, would it be a viable solution or it's mandatory that I use something you listed above?
Also, I asked the director and the camera OP to work at 48KHz, so I will be recording at 48KHz 16 Bit, and doing post in Pro Tools.

Cool enough, if your DAT will do the time code, you can make rough notes on your script in the field, and if you have an audio feed to one camera channel, you can get a dub of footage with a TC window burn, and make reference with a vcr in post. The slate can be used for rough back timing.

Quote:

Originally posted by gerax:

I already have a copy of the script, and I'm currently analizing any troublesome scenes; they actually asked me to get a full stereo sound for some movement shots, like in a scene where a horse rides by from l to r, so I was thinking about getting a couple of mics to do an MS technique. Is it a good choice, or is better to record it mono and move it later in post?
Dialog will be the most important thing, as there are few effects (apart from backgrounds and some common things) to be recorded, so will 1 shotgun be enough or should I get more than one to be used with different characters ( I also have a lavalier mic available)? I was thinking about getting a couple of boundary mics to shot a dinner table scene where there's about ten people acting, is it a good idea?

All your planning is really showing, you know what you are doing for sure! The horse ms thing sounds cool, I can hear it now, If you are worried about how it might sound, and phase problems, when and if, going to surround, you can always pan mono, fake stereo, though I like your idea better. Another shotgun won't hurt, jeez.. at least as a back-up, I didn't think of that last night sorry!

The boundary mics will get the activity of the table well, like glasses clinking, silverware, light chatter, but the director will most likley block the important dialogue shots where you will use your shotgun. The dinner might require some periods of evironmental sound, so remember to roll enough so not to have to loop. Also, I remember this from some crazy movie actually in the scene, get some room mode sound, just air,if you will, wierd eh? But if you have to fill a gap, you got it, same for outdoors.

Most of the things we are talking about are very down to earth, the posting is where it all comes together. The video editors will give you their reference tracks, this becomes your timeline, this is where it gets tougher, but the edit master from the editor will contain the real TC, and if they make changes, you can adjust your timeline to fit the changes. I believe you have a very good handle on this..it is fun to talk with you about it.
--Rick

Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2002 12:31 pm

Gerax,

Your sound will be only as good as your boom operator and if that's you, know the script. Boom the rehearsels, anticipate who will be talking next. Watch out for ceilings, there are special mics that are at a right angle for this purpose. I have always used a 416 for my shotgun mic for ENG stuff and I use it exclusively for V.O. recording in my post studio now.

I rarely recorded to DAT, I would always be connected (quick connect/disconnect cable) to the camera, and occasionally be wireless to the camera, but then the camera operator MUST wear headphones to ensure clean audio.

As I mentioned, I rarely recorded to DAT but that's because I was doing news stuff.
My setup for ENG was this:
416 shotgun into power supply
into Sure FP-33 portable mixer
Tram Lavs
Lectrosonics UHF wireless into FP-33 mixer
Line/Mic out to camera.
sometimes, wireless out using cube transmitter out of FP-32 mixer to wireless receiver mounted on camera.
With the portable mixer, you can generate tone, and get a handle on your levels.
A few times, I had a portable DAT in the front pouch of my "Porta Brace" mixer bag, which I would wear with a criss cross harness to distribute the weight evenly on my back and shoulders.(this makes a HUGE difference). The portable mixer has mini stereo out or 1/4" outs or? so you can go into your DAT and out to the camera. That way, you're covered.

Be careful with costumes, they can be really noisy if you wireless/lav them. Be sure you experiment with mic placement, and you'll have to hide those belt pack transmitters. If you have the headroom (literal headroom) boom from above and be in constant contact with the cameraman as to his framing, you want to be "just" outside of frame.

A good boom operator is "key" to getting good dialogue, did I mention that already?

For sound FX i.e. horse gallopping by, use a library. General 6000 by Sound Ideas has that stuff, foley stuff, cars, guns, you name it.

If you really want to record it on set, well, I know next to nothing about recording stereo sound. Wink

Sorry for rambling, it's those kids runnin' around. :w: <img border="0" alt="[retard]" title="" src="graemlins/retard.gif" />

Enough said.

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2002 2:47 am

Guys

Thank you very much for your insights so far, it's really cool to be able to clear my indecisions with you! Smile

My main concern right now is the boom stand: I know they're pretty pricey, and I don't want to buy one (even though I will if this kind of job will keep coming, as I'm really hoping and working for Very Happy

, as I told you my background is studio work), so I was thinking about renting one: are there any particular models that you recommend? What lenght should be a safe (and not that fatiguing) one?
Also, since I will be doing post in Pro Tools, what do you think will be a good way to know how the final audio will sound like when projected in theaters, I mean, I mix records on my monitoring system (Genelec 1030A), and I know them really well, but for speech and movie sound in general... is there something I should take into account when EQing and working in post soundwise?

Thanx again, you guys rule :tu:

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2002 9:56 pm

Gerax,

I prefer the carbon fiber poles that have several segments, and the cable runs inside the pole. You can get an inexpensive boom pole holder mount for a C stand and that works great if your subject is in one place. I've never mixed for the theatre so I don't have any advice there, sorry. Sad

Good luck.

P.s. Practice your boom technique way before you shoot, you'll be using muscles you didn't know you had! You'll start to tremble from fatigue holding onto that boom in awkward positions, so practice.

Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2002 10:55 am

Hi guys it's me again.

I'm about to get the gear for my recording, and I just would like to tap into your wisdom once again :p : I have the opportunity to choose among these shotgun mics: Sennheiser K66 or K 416 (half shotguns), AKG UC69 (full shotgun); which one would you recommend, and how do they sound if you have used any?

Thanx again for your help :w: .

Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2002 8:23 pm

Hi Lorenzo! So you had a look at the storyboard, and you know what situations you will find yourself in. I went to the USA Sennheiser site, they show a k6, battery powering module, and a k6p phantom only powering module, for a ME66 shotgun capsule. If this is one and the same outfit that you mentioned, the ME66 technicaly would do the job, with whatever windscreen, or windmuff you may need. I tried to find reference to the k416 you mentioned, but no mic was listed for that # on that site. I had no success on the AKG USA site for a u-69 full-shotgun, do you think you will need that much clearence in scenes?
Are you renting?
And have you had a chance to see or try them?
--Rick

Posted: Wed Apr 03, 2002 12:19 am

Hi Rick

Yes, I'm going to rent it, since it's not one of my ordinary-use pices of gear, but it could be from this movie on...; the rental company told me there's a substantial difference in tone between the two Sennheisers, so I'm going to take a look at the specs too and find out what kind of difference; as for the full shotgun, I don't think I'll need that much, but I just wanted you to tell me so Smile

Be prepared for another round of questions, as soon as they come to my mind Very Happy

.

Posted: Wed Apr 03, 2002 2:36 pm

Hey Gerax,

What do you mean when you say a "boom stand"? I've been on about 100 movie sets, and only one used one of those "boom stands" on wheels, etc.
If you are talking about a boom pole, I use the dbv (i think that's the brand)or vdb? It's carbon fiber and very light.

I've never used anything but a 416 and I really like them. Microphones are such a personal thing really. whatever you put on the end of your boom pole, make sure it's lite! The longer the pole, the longer the mike, add a zepplin wind screen etc, your gonna be achin'! Smile

Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2002 12:24 am

Hi Karen

I just got a boom pole for rent, and it's an alluminium type, it's 500 g, but the weight will go a little up with cable and 280 gr shotgun: I know what you're talking about Very Happy

Thank you

Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2002 10:32 am

Quote:

Originally posted by gerax:
Also, when you record dialog (mono) do you still print it as dual mono on both tracks of the recorder, or just plain mono that will go to only one channel?

Hi! I know you are asking Karen, I thought I would throw in something. Sometimes I split channels to get natural sounds with another mic, but in your dialogue only takes, having the channel backed up is not a bad idea, just in case something glitched a track out. BTW, good luck!
--Rick

Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2002 11:44 am

Hi gerax and Rick,

I just thought of something else to add, when I record stuff onto the camera (Beta SP, digibeta) there are 4 tracks of audio. Usually what I do is duplicate tracks 1 & 2 onto 3 & 4. There is a setting on the camera for this but I don't know what kind of camera your using and what kind of audio inputs/channels it has.

If you are not going to record your sound onto the camera, turn on the camera mic. You might find the audio helpful in post, if just to help you sync something. Set the levels to "auto", but only if you are using the camera mic. If you are going to record "your" audio into the camera, DON't turn on auto levels, as this has the habit of boosting the ambience in between the dialogue and is very undesireable.

You haven't asked about headphones, I've always used the Sony MDR-V6, and every ENG sound recordist I've seen uses these.

Will you be the boom operator and the mixer at the same time? Will you have an assistant?

Good luck, and have fun! Very Happy

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2002 10:09 am

Hi guys

Karen, I'll be the boom operator (it's one of the cool things I've always seen in the movies' backstage and always drooled to do Surprised

) this will give me all the I/O flexibility for additional camera feeds and channel doubling; any advices on stereo miking techniques like I mentioned on my previous post?

Thanx

P.S. : Karen, really cool studio Cool

!!

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