new yamaha hs80m studio reference monitors

Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 8:01 pm

so i went into guitar center looking for monitors. i was about to resign myself to ordering the Wharfedale 8.2's or buying the KRK Rokit 8's or the M-Audio BX8a monitors they had up there. Then i got a listen to the Yamaha hs80m speakers they had just gotten in.

Is it just me or are these things really friggin' good?

I listened them to the before mentioned speakers and also all the top end Event, Dynaudio and Mackie 8" monitors and it really blew them all away in my opinion. from what i could hear everything was real even, listenable and with no pronounced dips like the other speakers, particularily the Mackie's upper midrange fall out. I couldn't hear any peaks either and the HS80m's had a really tight and low reaching bottom end too. I was horribley impressed. I liked these things even more than the most expensive Dynaudio's they had.

Somebody correct me if i'm wrong or knows something i don't about them. I went ahead and decided not to buy anything until i got some feedback from some people on this board. They are a little more than i wanted to spend at $350 a channel but i figure these speakers would do me right and I'd never have to upgrade when I got tired of them.

Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 8:12 am

I just purchased the HS80M's about four days ago after purchasing and returning the HS50M's. The HS50's sounded great but I wanted a more power at my programming station so I returned them and got the HS80M's. I tune all my monitors to my control room with my DBX Driverack, a must have for anyone serious about mixing in their own studio. It made a world of difference in my monitoring, mixes, and masters. So, as far as the HS80M's are concerned, I have them set completely flat and tuned to the room and they have nice tight low-end and smooth high's. I bought mine and Guiter Center and I don't regret the purchase at all. My main mixing monitors that I've used for about 3 years are my KRK V8's for near-field and a pair of KRK V88's for mid-field and they both sound great! However, I'm going to mix my next television commercial with the HS80M's.
Must my 2cents! Very Happy

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Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 9:31 am

Hmmm...I've heard the Yamahas (also in a Guitar Center) and while they did sound nice, I don't see how one could describe them as blowing away the Mackies, (which I don't like, but found more robust and realistic nonetheless), Dynaudios and Events. First off, I've actually used all of those competing monitors in a real studio situation and discovered the strengths and weeknesses. Second, I would never base a decision about a loudspeaker on what I heard in Guitar Center. The placement of a monitor and the ambient surroundings (noise, etc.) are crucial to properly evaluating a monitor.

Also, the Drive Rack is a PA product - intended for live use, not for use on your studio monitors. A studio monitor, on its own, in a well-treated control room is the only solution. Placing a standard (read - non-linear-phase) EQ in front of it, only serves to smear the imaging and create distortion.

Just some thoughts - not meaning to be a poopie-pants.

J. Thumbs Up

Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 9:01 pm

thanks for the reponses!

cucco, thanks for your input.

i agree with you for the most part. especially tuning a room with an eq. however, for some people that is their only option if they can't treat the room they are in or don't have the cash too. i think a lot of career people forget that most of the other folks in the world are dealing with limited resources and that sometimes an equalizer will atleast get somebody part way there for the time being. i see alot of gear heads and succesfull types generally getting an "all or nothing" attitude that other people can't, unfortunately, afford to adopt right now. i'm all for having somebody using a PA type eq if it gets them any closer at all to a better mix Smile

but i think your general point, however, is that people should avoid doing things like that cause they might be fooling themselves about their mixes....? correct me if i'm wrong.

i'm also sorry because i don't think i made it clear that i was listening to all of these in a closed off control room setup they have for monitors and high end rack gear. guess its suppose to simulate a control room of sorts. it might not be an actuall studio but i think its the best that any newbie or hobbiest could hope for in terms of comparing monitors side by side in an in-store environment i guess that might point is that if you can't bass your opinion at guitar center, then where can you? i know i don't have access to multi-million dollar studios Very Happy

you said that you have actually used all of those competeing monitors in a reals studio situationand discovered their strengths and weeknesses. i would then be very interested to know the specifics. for example, i like the smoothness of this monitor but find that presence peak in this monitor helps to keep me from mixing too much vocals, yada yada yada. i am seriously interested to know.

sorry if i seem impolite, but i get weary from reading people's genuine questions on these boards only to be replied with the whole "you've got it all wrong, this is what you should be asking" and them not even answering their own repurposed question. seems like a lot of people here just want to show off their knowledge and/or gear and not actually contribute the education of people.

i know that's probably not your intention, sorry. forgive me. it would help that when somebody says something like "can't believe what you hear at guitar center" to atleast let me know where to go afterwards. its just a pet peave of mine i guess. hehehe.

didn't mean to be rude Wink

Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 9:31 pm

I don't take it as being rude, no worries.

My concerns are:

1. For the cost of a crappy EQ, you could easily afford a $100 package of Auralex. This won't be the BEST solution, but it's sure better than even the best EQ for loudspeaker correction.

2. I know that choosing loudspeakers is a personal endeavor and that everyone has their varying opinions, but what you're comparing here are apples and oranges. The Dynaudios and the higher-end Events are serious, pro ranges of equipment. The Yamahas, while decent sounding, are budget speakers. You may find them to sound better, but you're very right, they are quite peaky. The definition of a good monitor is one that is devoid of these peaks (and subsequently the valleys too.)

If you can't afford the Dynaudios or the Events but find the Yamahas to be a great sound for the value, that's great (and I would whole-heartedly agree with you). However, to say that the Yamahas bested the Dyn's or the Events seems a little sensationalistic.

I didn't listen to these in multi-million dollar studios. I listened in my studio. My studio is meager at best and I spent a grand total of $500 on acoustic treatments (a little O/C 703, some fabric and some wood) but I dare say it's far better of a judge of good sounding monitors than any similarly priced EQ.

So, I too apologize if I sound rude, but that's not my intent. Instead, I simply mean to make sure that people do it right when possible.

Don't think that I own a multi-million dollar set-up. I started small and still am pretty small. It's just that, everything I have, I built from the ground up. After gig 1, I bought a better mic, after gig 2, I bought better pres, and so on and so on...

I just don't like to see people waste money on DriveRacks when they're not even using them correctly. Or trick themselves into thinking cheap monitors are a substitute for the real thing.

Sure, they'll work a heck of a lot better than even the best computer speaker, but they aren't Dynaudios or Events... Sorry...

J. Very Happy

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:26 am

heheh, gotcha thanks Smile

so the yamaha's are peaky then? do you feel that they are more hyped to sound good and that the dyn's will translate better?

Chris

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:33 am

aphid wrote:

heheh, gotcha thanks Smile

so the yamaha's are peaky then? do you feel that they are more hyped to sound good and that the dyn's will translate better?

Chris

In general, I truly do feel that the "flatter" the monitor, the better the sound will translate. If you have a monitor with an exaggerated bass, you will mix the bass lean to compensate.

I've found the Dynaudios to be some of the cleanest, clearest speakers out there. (Only a few others that I've played with come close or best them:
NHT
Paradigm
B&W
Revel)

The Event ASP 8s are darn near as good too, and at a far cheaper price than the BM15A, they're a real bargain.

In general though, just about any monitor can be used as long as the room sounds good and you know what issues you have with the speakers at hand.

So, I guess the short answer to your question is -- yup - I think the Dynaudios will translate better on other systems.

J.

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:48 am

hello evereybody,

the yamahas had a frequency response of 42Hz-20kHz (-10dB)!!!!

-10db, that´s a wide range.

i think the rubicon r6a are much better for the price.

remon

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:24 am

how come you prefer the rubicon's? any hard nose comparisons you couuld give us?

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:34 am

remon wrote:

hello evereybody,

the yamahas had a frequency response of 42Hz-20kHz (-10dB)!!!!

-10db, that´s a wide range.

i think the rubicon r6a are much better for the price.

remon

Hey Remon! Welcome to RO.

Just a point though - specs mean very little. (To me, they mean just a tad more than nothing, but no more...)

I'm sure the reason they're quoting -10dB as their reference is that the -10dB point is 42Hz, which is quite reasonable for a monitor. Many manufacturers quote using a +/- 3dB as their reference, which, in my opinion, is still useless. They take the response at 1kHz and see how much it varies and if it doesn't vary more than 3 dB from that 1kHz reference, they quote the frequency range as xHz - xkHz +/- 3dB. The problem is, there's still the potential for 6 dB of variance there. That's a lot!

Some manufacturers (Paradigm is an example) will quote you +/- 1.5 dB! That's a lot better. That means that there would only be a potential variance of 3 dB over the entire range.

BUTTTTTTTTT..... Here's the real kicker...
None (or I should say, very few) of these manufacturers tell you how they came up with this measurement. Some state that they test in an anechoic room. Most of those that claim this are lying since there are only a couple in the world. (Once again, my hat is off to Paradigm as they do in fact test in an anechoic chamber.) But then, others simply close mic all of their drivers and then overlay each driver's response on a chart and remove/compensate for the overlaps and then show that as their plot.

More specifically, they don't even disclose their testing equipment. Were they using a spectrascope (HP or the like), were they using a cracked version of Cool Edit Pro v1.2, were they using calibrated/certified test microphones like B&K or Gefell, or were they using a Behringer...You get the point.

My point, though a long winded one, is - Specs are more or less worthless. They get you in the right direction, but little more than that. By no means should they be the determining factor behind a purchase.

For example - would this speaker appeal to you:
Drivers - (1) 4.5" (doped paper), (1)1" Soft-dome tweeter
Freq Resp - 85-20,000 Hz (+/- 3dB)
Imp - 8 Ohm
Sensitivity - 86dB/WM

Most people would reject this based on the specs alone, but in reality, these are the specs to one of the most critically acclaimed loudspeakers of all time, and in my opinion, some of the finest at any price.

Care to guess what they are??? Anyone???

j Thumbs Up

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 8:51 pm

hi,

maybe you´re right, i´m not a pro.

when somebody understand german please read the article on this site: www.amazona.de --- klick the archive button, then go to lautsprecher(monitore) and choose the rubicon.

there is a picture from the frequency response.

it´s a very positive test.

the shops in frankfurt/germany all recommend them.

you speak about the ns10m ??

r e m o n

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:06 pm

The suspense is killing me Exclamation

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 3:27 am

the frequency response test is made far away from any wall.

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 9:57 am

cucco, is it an NS10?

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:21 pm

I first thought it was the LS3/5a, but the specs aren´t quite the same Cool

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