Personal Monitor ?

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:23 am

I have been having a problem with my monitor system. I would like to run thru my setup to see if theirs a better way to go which im sure there is.
First off, im a drummer I run a 1/4 to xlr from aux1 on a allen an heath mix wizard board. From there i connect a standard mic cable that runs into my personal behringer sub mixer xlr input. I then run a 1/4 cable from L/mono to the input of yamaha 31 band EQ. 1/4 out (mono)of the EQ into a Radio Shack head phone battery powered head phone booster.
I have wired EC3 Shure in-ear headphones. I setup a metronome that runs directly into my sub mix. I never have problems with it, so it must be coming my main monitor signal.
The thing is everything will be sounding great and working fine, then after an hour or so it starts cutting in and out. Or it will work all night?
This may be a stupid way of running things. But it sound great when working!
Thanks In Advance For Any Advice, Kevin

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:57 am

OK........one question! Simple yes or no.

Is it ok to run aux 1/4 to xlr to my mixer with the need of a direct box?

Rolling Eyes

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:51 am

Quote:

Is it ok to run aux 1/4 to xlr to my mixer with the need of a direct box?

Do you mean "without a DI box"?

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:57 am

Would you use a DI with that setup? Check out first post.
Thanks for the reply!

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 12:03 pm

Which Behringer do you use for the submix?

There are two ways to skin this cat:

1) If your submixer has 1/4" line inputs, plug out of the A&H aux directly into one of them.

2) If your submixer does not have 1/4" line inputs then, yes, use a DI.

The A&H aux send is line level - the xlr (mic preamp) inputs on most mini mixers have a hard time dealing with that signal level. Larger frame mixers typically have mic/line switches and pads to attenuate signals before the pre, or bypass it altogether.

When you crank line level into those pre's, they'll degrade over time.
Sometimes they can run for a fair amount of time, while other times they will crap out immediately. Luck of the draw.

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:31 pm

Thanks for the info Bent.

I am using Behringer EURORACK UBB1002 10-Input Mixer. It has 1/4" line inputs. Obviously I am no sound tech Ha Ha. From what I had read, I thought that running 1/4" to xlr would help with buzz I sometimes get at some venue`s. I could`nt figure out why it would work and sometimes not. I had a hunch that impedance might be at play, but then again I am no sound tech.
Do you think that will fix my problem? Would a DI be a better way to go? or just use the 1/4" input? This sounds like the problems Ive been having. I would set the "gain" all the way down and the monitor input channel would still clip. Could this have damaged the pre`s is that what you mean by crap out, like totally crap out, done, gone, over, tape over the channel input?
One more question, I run left 1/4" mono main out from the behringer to a yamaha 31 band EQ It has a 1/4" in and out it also has a pair of rca jacks.
From the EQ output I have a 1/4" mono adapter to 1/8" stereo radio shack battery powered head phone booster for my Shure EC3 headphone monitor. Im sure there`s a better way, will this effect anything? Should that be setup different?

Thank You, Very Happy

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:50 pm

No problem, glad to be of service!

Quote:

I thought that running 1/4" to xlr would help with buzz I sometimes get at some venue`s.

Not really, that buzz is probably coming from the light system or a bad ground in the building. Nothing you can really do about that (using A/C ground plug lifters will more than likely cause you to get a good shock).
You could invest some money in a power conditioner, be prepared to spend some dough - good ones are not cheap!
Pay attention to your gain structure at the Allen & Heath and on your Behringer - most hum and buzz problems are prevalent due to too many channels clipping (the buzz and hum are overmodulated along with the original signal), or conversely, too many running at -20dB and lower (making the gain up somewhere down the line boosts the noise as well)! Happens where I work all the time...

Quote:

Could this have damaged the pre`s is that what you mean by crap out, like totally crap out, done, gone, over, tape over the channel input?

It's possible, clip is never a good thing. Take a close listen to that channel at unity and see if you can hear any distortion or other artifacts. If you can then yes, it's time to tape over it.

Try the change that I've suggested. Go buy yourself a nice 1/4" cable and jump from the Aux to the line input, set your gain properly, and all should be well. When you can afford to, splurge and buy yourself something better than that Radio Shaft monitor!

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:39 pm

Bent, thanks for your time and quick response. I know this what you do, but for me the knowledge is priceless and I did`nt even have to pay for it!
Happy Holidays to you and yours, Kevin

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:18 pm

No problem, Kevin.
Feel free to drop in anytime!

Edit> If you want a suggestion on a replacement for your Radio Shack headphone amp, the Shure P6HW hardwired beltpack is a good investment.

And for power conditioners, the Furman PL Plus will help (not solve, but help) clean up that dirty venue power.

Throw a few IL-19s in your suitcase and you're all set.

-Ben

Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 4:39 pm

allenk wrote:

I have been having a problem with my monitor system. I would like to run thru my setup to see if theirs a better way to go which im sure there is.
First off, im a drummer I run a 1/4 to xlr from aux1 on a allen an heath mix wizard board. From there i connect a standard mic cable that runs into my personal behringer sub mixer xlr input. I then run a 1/4 cable from L/mono to the input of yamaha 31 band EQ. 1/4 out (mono)of the EQ into a Radio Shack head phone battery powered head phone booster.
I have wired EC3 Shure in-ear headphones. I setup a metronome that runs directly into my sub mix. I never have problems with it, so it must be coming my main monitor signal.
The thing is everything will be sounding great and working fine, then after an hour or so it starts cutting in and out. Or it will work all night?
This may be a stupid way of running things. But it sound great when working!
Thanks In Advance For Any Advice, Kevin

1. If you are running from the -10 aux send to the mic preamp, that could be adding to the noise. You need to run from the aux out to the 1/4" line in.

2. Your issue is that you are running unbalanced for a distance greater than 3' and/or you are getting some RFI or EMF interference as stated by others. You should be running balanced TRS to TRS, not TS to TS WITH balanced circuits. You could run two DI boxes to balance the line, one on the input and one on the output. Or, atleast use one on the sending side and go back to the preamp and deal with the added distortion.

3. Any time you add an amplifier to something that is already greater than line level, you are going to add noise, and in this budget gear range, it may not be pretty. The noise could be occuring at the headphone amp you have added. It is likely not shielded and is not balanced.

4. You do need clean power, but I would bet your whole rig on the fact that this is a impedence and balancing issue, not power related.

Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:27 pm

Hey Sheet!....Bent!
I am so glad you guy`s dropped in to help me out.
I am certain now that cabling is my problem. I have went back through my manuals to check connections. And as you guys already know the aux out and sub mix input should have TRS to TRS so that`s what I will do.
My problem started at a local club about a year ago I had a bad buzz....well the whole PA had a buzz. It turned out to be a ground loop I believe, because the power amps were setup by the stage and the mixer was setup in the back of the room and plugged into two different legs of the power source and created a ground loop. I think that it was Sheet that actually helped me out on that one from a previous post!
Anyway thats when I started hooking my rig up different. At first I had no problems. And then...and then...and then...sorry got stuck on a movie.
And then after a few months I started having intermittent problems,
distortion mainly. Then cutting in and out. Not every gig more like every
other gig. It just seemed to get worse and worse. But when it was working It sounded great. I thought if it`s working so good why am I having these problems off an on. And usually at the same venue. Am I just unlucky and the problem would only present itself at the perfect time to leave me scratching my head? Let me answer that.....probably? That`s just my luck. I would go from man... this is sounding so great to I wanna pack up and go home now please, this sucks.
I wish I could afford the Shure P6HW hardwired beltpack bent spoke of. I looked it up at musicians friend out of my budget, thats why I have to settle for berhinger and radio shaft as bent would put it HAHAHA. Its the truth, I can handle it! But for what its worth it gets the job done.

Thanks again -Kevin

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