Professional vs Hack

Posted: Tue May 13, 2008 12:26 am

Yeah, this is kind of funny. I listened to both of your cuts, before I knew who did what. You are by far the superior engineer. Your friend/engineer that had the analog stuff, didn't have the good analog stuff. I wouldn't want to mix in his control room. Now my control room is probably a little different, as I have really old analog stuff? You know, that stuff from the mid-1970s. And if he has the analog stuff & its good stuff, he's got a lousy set of monitors because his mix is just MUD CITY. I really didn't find anything about it that I even thought was marginally professional sounding. I can't figure out what anybody else here liked about it?? Come on guys, it sounded like a bucket of mud. A bucket of something at least that we wouldn't want to have in our living rooms. So your Buddy there obviously went to a quickie recording school. It's too obvious. But hey, he has to pay the bills too. Of course, you have to start somewhere. So you learned a very important lesson here. IT AIN'T WHAT YOU GOT BUT WHAT YOU DO WITH IT! (Insert Austrian accent here) It's not a good mix. It's a tumor!

Dame Bramaged Engineer
Ms. Remy Ann David

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 8:06 am

Sorry I missed this one, but the second mix sounds like syrupy goo. While the first mix is clear and well defined, it could use just a little rounding to reduce the digital edge. As someone already pointed this may be due with the bus limiter. But all and all good job!

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 9:38 am

Thanks for the input everyone. I think any more suggestions will be biased as there are too I'm tempted to show him your replies. My bandmates seem to like my mixes, but say that they are brash or harsh sounding. It could be due to limiting on the 2 buss. But here is the million dollar question...

Will my mixes be less harsh sounding if I get them professionally mastered, or will it enhance that digital harshness and make me feel like I've wasted my money. This is the question I guess I really need someone to answer!!!!

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 9:58 am

If you ask any of the mastering engineers here, the first thing they will tell you is NOT to limit or compress the master bus. They may be able to soften the harshness but it's more un-necessary work for them. If you can fix it in the mix, all the better.

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 10:16 am

I have received quite a few mixes that suffer from distortion from over limiting. Typically I have asked for a remix if the problem is significant. The best thing you can do for your mastering engineer is do no limiting at all on the bus. Also leave a few dB’s of headroom (peaking at -2dBFS or -3dBFS) this give the ME some space to work.

But to soften mixes I have tried a few techniques. I like to mess with a EQ first to see if I can round out the aggressive sound. Also I have used a harmonics generator (Cranesong HEDD 192) to add some goo. In some extreme cases I have used a Declicker to reduce the large transients.
Check out this topic which was along the same lines:

http://recording.org/ftopicp-328401-.html#328401

edit: Oh and by the way in no way am I saying your mix was bad, its not.

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 10:29 am

Thanks

I'll show you a mix without mastering software and limiting this afternoon

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 12:00 pm

here's my mix unmastered

http://www.box.net/shared/3e6ry5qko8

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:30 pm

I have to go with the unmastered version. There is still some distortion there but I think it's the mic. Some people like that sound. I don't particularly like it for your style of vocals but there certainly is nothing wrong with it. It's just an opinion thing. The unmastered is considerably less "trebly"(is that a word?) which is nice. Softens up the vox a bit.

This is one of the few occasions where I personally would try and employ a multiband compressor to try and soften some of the highs. But again it's just a matter of opinion at this point. The mix sounds good and much less aggressive. Easier to listen to. That is my fully unprofessional opinion.

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 2:12 pm

I like the unmastered version better, there is some work to be done around the 2-4k Range I think.
Something seems a bit edgy in the vocal.

On the other end The guitar could use a touch more edge to it maybe 1dB or so at 4-5k.

I like the snare and the space around it.

But to answer your question a mastering eng, would have lots to work with.

Nice job.

Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 2:24 pm

Thanks everyone this is what I wanted to learn/hear. Very informative and thanks for your time!!

Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 10:36 pm

Well I did a remix and tried to get some merits of both mixes

http://www.box.net/shared/piaknf7ggo

This is the mix I'm going to get mastered. I'm no expert, I've only been doing this 7 months now, but I'm pretty happy with this one and I have to finish this CD some day, time to write more songs and rejoin the human race! Thanks for your input!

Posted: Sat May 17, 2008 10:32 am

I really enjoyed it. Nice work!

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