What Do Australian's Know About Sound?

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 5:41 am

Quote:

Originally posted by max:
there are a lot of nice pubs in newie

Yeah, what's the old one that's near the station like these days, the one on the harbour? Last time I was there it was like some Gothic palace. Great venue for bands. The rooms upstairs, where we stayed, were...something else. Don't quite know what.... but..nastier. My folks live up your way...
but we're getting even further away from these people in Melbourne. Wonder if they'd go for a tour of The Hunter? D'yer wanna ask them?
Cool

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 6:38 am

Stedel's Aussie Rave: Part Two (one of three).

I don't quite know what the following relates to - possibly difficulties Australian bands can face.

One of my closest friends is Aboriginal C&W singer Roger Knox. Gundawwindi is a small country town on the north west Queensland and New South Wales border. A few kilometers outside of Gundawwindi is an even smaller town called Boggabilla.Just out of Boggabilla the tarmac finishes. After about 15 kilometers of dirt road is Toomelah Aboriginal Mission. At least that's what it was like around the time I first met Roger. Roger comes from Toomelah. His people are the Camillaroi tribe.

In the 1930's an Anthropologist named Elkin was advising the Australian Government on it's policies towards Aboriginal people. They, the Aboriginals, were it was concluded, dying out. Adult Aboriginal males had the mental capacity and stage of development of a 15 year old Anglo male. It would have been only a matter of time before Aboriginal people were extinct - regardless of the settlement of Australia by the Imperial Majesty and Wisdom of the British Empire. The Mission's were established partly to "smooth the dying pillow" (a phrase then used) and to conveniently round up all Aboriginal people, who were stripped of their land, their culture, their language, their customs. Aboriginal people were not given the right to vote (this didn't happen until the mid-late 1960's). Aboriginal children were forcibly removed from their families "for their own good".( It was just fortunate that "their good" coincided with being suitable for cheap domestic slave type labour in affluent "Australian" households).Phil Noyce's new movie "Rabbit Proof Fence" deals partly with some this policy.

However bad the above may have been, it was still better than the previous policy, which was stated in the declaration of Australia as being "Terra Nullis", that is, "unhabited". Aboriginal people witness to murder and massacres by white settlers could not testify in a Court of Law. They had no souls you see. And of course you'd look bloody silly in an International Court claiming that your lands had been stolen when officially you didn't even exist.

It's hard to imagine all this, people see the blue blue skies, the golden beaches, the price of a rich red steak and fink, well it ain't half bad here - there are far worse places in the world where people have suffered and still suffer real hardship, they say. At least that's what the Clash said (bless they're little hearts - I liked The Clash - really nice guys) when I and some Aboriginal friends of mine, had lunch with them one day in Sydney and told them all this.

The Clash did however end up inviting an Aboriginal - Gary Foley - to speak at their concerts over here. Gary was a gifted orator and was the best support act the Clash had ever seen. (IMHO). Gary also starred in one of Phil Noyce's early movies,
"Backroads", made round about the period I first met Phil at a place called The Filmmakers Co-Op, in Darlighurst, Sydney.

When I met Roger I was playing in a band with some of the best Rock - Jazz players in Sydney. The band was the "baby" of guitarist John Robinson. These guys were all great players...much better than me.. but John had heard something in my playing that he really liked, and asked me to join the band.

Trouble was, these guys were into Chic Corea, Herbie Hancock, Jaco Pastorius, John McLoughlin,
Aaron Copeland, Stravinsky, and Jimi Hendrix...BIG time. I was into Hendrix, and I didn't mind the other influences, but I was coming from a Marc Bolan, Robert Fripp and Brian Eno, Fairport Convention, Beatles, Rolling Stones, John Lee Hooker and the Supremes way of thinking...if you know what I mean.

Roger had just started to perform around Tamworth (where he lived). Tamworth is known as "Australia's Country Music Capital". Country and Western is a big deal for many Aboriginal people. They love it. I started to have "sessions" (not drugs you nongs - music) in Rogers kitchen with him. Apart from the fact that it was pretty unusual for white people to mix with them, it was even stranger that there was one playing guitar in their kitchen. Roger and evrybody thought I was really cool cos I could play a piece of music called "Classical Gas" by Mason Williams. To this day people still ask me to "play the Gas". So I'd start to play these C&W songs. And a bit like what has happened to me on Stephen Paul's Forum with poetry, it sparked some regressive gene I never knew I had in me. Unknown to me I was actually good at C&W guitar. Very good.
This was a shock to me ("Get it on bang a gong, your cheatin' heart"?) and even more of a shock to John and my fellow band members, as when it came to be my turn to take a really fluid 2,000 notes per minute guitar solo, out would come this Scotty Moore - Robert Fripp - Stedel hybrid.

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 6:39 am

Hmm. Hope I'm not boring you! Sad

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 7:36 am

Stedel's Aussie Rave Part 2 (two of three).

I left the band. Which was a shame. I liked the guys, my playing was getting better, and John was well connected industry wise (a little bit of Aussie Rock trivia - John had had a hit over here with his band "Blackfeather". a song called "Seasons of Change", which featured alongside John's great guitar, a recorder, played by non other than original ACDC front man Bon Scott).Ah well, like Freddy King sang, I was living on the highway now.

A couple of years went by. Roger had started to play some of the more serious C&W spots, and had got a lot of support from Tamworth C&W Radio, particularly from a guy called John Minson. I had learnt the whole of Elvis's "The Sun Sessions" LP and was desperately trying to make some sense of all this, (I found learning "Little Wing" by Hendrix helped). Roger was offered a spot on a Tour of the Missions around the top of the Northern Territory. This was quite a lucrative circuit for the white C&W artists that played it, and this was the first time an Aboriginal performer had joined them. All the people on the Missions loved Roger, the tour was very succesful, and Roger was asked to go on the next one.

Have I told you Australia is a BIG country?

So the second tour leaves Tamworth by plane. We all wave them goodbye. This first plane develops engine trouble and has to make a forced landing. The tour party then splits into two groups, each group of four or five going to two smaller light aircraft.
Rogers second aircraft crashes. The pilot and the bands drummer, who was seated in front of Roger, are killed. Roger suffers terrible burns head to toe and is hospitalised. His hands close up and he is unable to play guitar again.

When he is released from hospital he spends a year bedridden, having to wear a full body stocking. He can't leave the house. His kids are around (he has a fairly large family) and there's a couple of crappy "box guitars" and some old half toy/half real-instrument drum set. I start to show a couple of Rogers boys (the oldest must have been about 14 -15) some things on guitar. The youngest ones fight for the drums.
We all start to play and sing songs together. An electric guitar and a half dead amplifier appear from somewhere.

Roger goes back to the Mission and gets some "tribal medicine". By the end of twelve months Roger is talking about performing again. But he has to start right from the beginning again, and has no money. So he decides his kids are gonna be his band. They call themselves "Roger Knox and The Euraba Band" (Euraba is Cammilleroi for "healing").
We work on their playing. They start doing gigs. Most of the band (apart from Roger and one other) are under age for the places they play in.

Anyway, the band gets really tight, and they start to get good reception. Eventually they cut an album, and are invited to tour Canada. No plane crash this time. Everybody's happy about this. Roger and Euraba continue to play, we organise a tour around Moree and Toomelah with The Warumpi Band (whose singer, George, once fell in love with my mum one night...but that's a long and other story). Roger and his kids are still playing.
His oldest son, Buddy Knox has now got a bit of a reputation of his own, good enough for Bob Dylan to invite him to play with him on his last tour over here.But they are Camilleroi people, this is their tribal sacred land, and they aint gonna live in Nashville.

Roger and his kids constantly seem to overestimate
how much I showed them, a lot of folk up around Rogers way, even some of the younger Aboriginal Rap and Hip Hop performers think I'm some sort of guitar legend. It's embarrasing. I have my moments, that's true, but I think I'm a pretty average player. So when you hear phrases like "The Heart Of The Country", and you start to really understand what happened to Roger and his people, the Cammilleroi, and hundred of other Aboriginal tribal groups, when current Prime Ministers refuse to say sorry, you can maybe undertand why a song like "Your Cheatin' Heart" struck a chord (or should that be four chords?). Or why "Treaty" by Yothu Yindi is not just a great dance track.
Cool

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 7:53 am

OK folks. Time for a cigarette.

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 8:13 am

Quote:

Originally posted by stedel:
OK folks. Time for a cigarette.

You'll be back soon though won't you Stedel?
I bet your version of Cheatin' Heart is second only to Hank's ...
You've got soul man

P.S. Smoking is bad for you - don't say I didn't warn you.

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 1:17 pm

stedel wrote:

what's the old one that's near the station like these days, the one on the harbour?

that be the great northern

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2002 2:18 pm

damn stedel thats a long smoke!!

Man, if there were a 'citizen of the world try and do what they did' award, you would get my vote.
As long as part 3 doesn't have some Cohen Brothers twists in the story Wink

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2002 12:39 am

Well glad to see I got the debate going Wink

For the record, technically hungup meant the way they treated their artists not the way they treated their gear.

Many of the great recordings of all time didn't have the best gear either so its down to how you can extract the best from the artist and the equipment. As an artist in studios here, I have struggled against the technical bent of many engineers. Many artists I knew who are/were successful also struggled with these issues, that's why many of them brought in o/s producers or went o/s to record.

Its akin to how the Rolling Stones in the 60's wanted to record at Chess Records because they left the "dirt" in that the English studios at the time took out.

Yes there are some great recordings made in Australia, however we have to keep the bar as high as possible.

My measure of a great recording is how well the artist is represented, not how well the gizmos/frequencies are represented. If they are there and sound good, its a bonus.

Have a good one.....
Cheers
Bruce

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2002 6:58 am

Sorry, but this will be a bit off topic:

Do any of you Aussie's know of an Artist named Armondo Hurley, and his email addy?

I lost track of him about 15 years ago. Last I knew, he was in Sydney.

Thanks

Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2002 3:35 am

Quote:

Originally posted by PTPerson:
Howabout us Aussies meet up for a drink?!?!?

Smile

Hi folks. For any of you remotely interested in me Aussie Rave part 3 sorry for the wait. I'll post tomorrow. In the meantime.....

PTPerson...look this post was about credibilty etc. etc. for Aussie ingenuity. Now over on Greg Malcangi's Pro Tools Forum there was this attempt for RO Forum members to get together for a drink ("Lame Idea"). They failed...miserably. How is it going to look if we Aussies (particularly with our reputation) fail? Smile

Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2002 3:56 pm

I'm up for it, Sydney here, but Newy isn't a drama

Smile

Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2002 7:30 pm

And then there’s Daniel Creighten. Daniel’s the third generation from Toomelah Mission I talk about here. But before I launch phalanges to keyboard
understand, I don’t mean to be pushing any particular political agenda here.
It’s true there are many issues re the position of Aboriginal people in Australia - it just happens that many of my friends and family are Aboriginal
and the anecdotal meanderings I’ve used up here are more to point out that Australia is not a monolithic Anglo culture. Taking away the issue of race and colonization for instance you can extract common themes that effect many Australian Artists and music industry professionals, some of which have been talked about by others up here including:
1. The sheer scale of physical/geographical distances within Australia.
2. Which can lead to isolation and limited access.
3. The relatively small population gives a limited economic base to support the industry –including sales for Artists, studio fees etc.
4. Australia IS a long way from LA, New York, London etc.
5. Stuff that "wiggy", daniel, and Bruce says is TRUE!!! (BTW wiggy, I love Neve stuff myself!)
6. In addition you’d think a city like Sydney would be full of great live venues for bands…it’s not. The last few years has seen a serious decline, particularly for Rock musicians…in fact you could probably count the number of good venues on less than two hands.

Anyway, for chealy, here’s a limited list of some of my Aussie faves

"The Divinyl’s" – late 70’s –80’s band fronted by Chrissie Amphlett who wrote some great lyrics and toons.
"Regurgitator" very clever cynical band with great songs.
"Endorphin" – you can pick the influences but here’s an example of a positive slant to some of what’s been talked about up here – an ability to take an eclectic array of influences and fuse them into a synthesis that has a beauty and uniqueness of its own.
"Lash" new all girl band (Catholic schoolgirrrrls!!!)
Chris Bailey – used to front "legendary" Aussie band "The Saints".
Ed Kueper also ex "Saints".
Paul Kelly – has written some great songs.
Kasey Chambers (C&W singer).

Cool

Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2002 7:37 pm

Stedel’s Aussie Rave Part Three.

Daniel Creighton is a young NSW Aboriginal ("Koori") rap/hip hop artist.
I first met Daniel when he was 16 (five years ago). He was living in Tamworth then. We tracked a song of his in my office in Sydney where I was working at the time. Daniel set up a basic rhythm on a little Boss drum machine, and I played a Yamaha bass and Gibson Les Paul through Sans Amp GT2 into a digital delay unit (I think it was a Delta Labs – anyway it was one rack unit high and was blue!). We used an AKG vocal mike for Daniel’s main vocals and the backing vocals - which were provided by Kay Pratley. (Kay and I have a little performing/writing/recording unit ourselves – yes that’s right folks Stedel has a band!!!!!!!!! Smile

) This was all done on a little 4-track porta-studio. Still, the quality was good enough for the track to be played on ABC National radio.
Anyway four years later and a project to produce a compilation CD of NSW Aboriginal artists is begun. Through chance I meet Sarah Longhurst (who used to manage Aussie bands Pollyanna and Custard). Apart from Sarah being one of the most enthusiastic and courageous people I’ve ever met – and a great manager to boot – when she told me about the project, I mentioned Daniel. I played her a copy of the recording we had done in my office and she arranged (told you she was good) to get Daniel involved on the project.
So we ring Daniel, who now lives in Newcastle, give him a deadline of four days to decide if he wants to be involved. (Well of course he does but his sampler’s in the pawn shop). So we discover the pawn shop thing. Sarah arranges for him to get it out. Daniel comes down to Sydney and stays at my place. He re-records the original track we did and a new track. But he’s not happy with the sound. The guys that recorded it did a good job – but maybe it’s a little bit too slick, and perhaps some of the atmospheric grunge and looseness has been lost.
(Chorus). (Hmm, now I think about it, I think they were using ProTools. - Stedel's edit, April 14.2.40am) Plus everyone was thrown together, and apart from Daniel being maybe a bit overawed by the studio (they have a pretty good set-up), he is also quite shy and (IMHO) gave too much control to the producers. It’s also very hard for people to understand the conditions that Daniel comes from, even people like these guys, who have the best of intentions. Daniel actually prefers our first crude attempt. Daniel is invited to the launch of the project and gives a bit of a controversial speech. It’s hard to distance yourself from your life and the things you know sometimes.
Anyway, later this year we’ll be re-recording the track with Daniel, and it’ll appear on mine and Kay’s stuff. (Shameless Plug!!!).
So. It’s not really a case of Aussie engineers not being up to the job, but a case of having to bring things together with minimal budgets, great distances (both geographical and cultural), and limited time. At least it was done.

OK maybe there’s a bit of an agenda here. Folks I’ve been here and the following lyrics are not fantasy. Sometimes, no matter how much you’d like to write "silly love songs" occasionally "My baby left me and I’m so blue" just doesn’t fit. As I said about Peter Garret of Midnight Oil, sometimes you have to take the shit when you stand by the things you believe in.
Remember, Daniel was 16 when he wrote this. (Lyrics by permission).

Ding dong go to church
The bells - ah Hell
Another brother down, strung up in a cell
Highly intoxicated, so their statement stated
And now the brother’s stuck in a trap that’s created
By the man widda badge and a gun
Got the black man on the run just for fun
It’s like this every single night
They’ve gotta be starting something
It’s like where to pray, and maybe they’re out there hunting
Like Elmer J. Fudd
But we ain’t Bugs Bunny
They’re doin’ it just for fun
But I don’t find it funny
How the hell a brother hangs by his shoelaces
He went barefoot
Just look at the faces of his children
When they know their Dad has died
Three years later, and the mother still cries

(Chorus)
Another life taken (Goddamn)
Another heart breakin’ (Why?)
Will you get my brothers
Out of this God forsaken place.

Clank Clank the cell door closes
He goes to sleep with six dozen roses
And a crucifix on his chest
He reads his prayers and now he’s laid to rest
Suicide was your only excuse
But it wasn’t your hands
That put your head in that noose
And that’s why my heart’s on fire
Where the hell did you find the barbed wire?
In a police cell, cos I couldn’t see none
But the man with the badge and a gun had some

(Chorus)

Now
Whatever happened to innocent till proven guilty?
You know I didn’t do it but yet you’re still blaming me
Harassing me in public making me look a fool
What did I do, damn, what did I do?
You said I did somethin’ but I know that you are bluffin’
Cos you know I did nothin’
But yet you’re still stuffin’ me around
In my head
Wishin’ I was dead
Hangin’ from a rafter by a piece of thread
Police harassment – public embarrassment
Police harassment – public embarrassment
Police harassment – public embarrassment
But y’all know how it goes
It gets this way every single time
The Donut King is closed

Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2002 2:16 am

Love ya work Stedel!

was that compoilationt he one that JJJ was flogging last year?

My fave Aussie albums are?..

Paradise motel- flight paths
Snout- Circle high and wide
You am I- Hi-Fi Way
Sandpit- On second thought
Big Heavy Stuff- Size of the ocean
Avalanches- Since i left you
AC/DC- Dirty deeds
and heaps of others...

OZROCK ROCKS!!!!!

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