optical sound transfer for single-stripe audio track

Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 4:18 pm

I want to start trying to gather up the equipment it will take to do an optical sound transfer for single-stripe audio track sense there are no facilities in this area that does this kind of work and transfers would require everything be shipped out of town. I know nothing about this process and wanted to know what is required to do it and who sells this type of equipment also if it ever comes up for sale used. So if anyone can educate me I would appreciate it. Thanks Cool

Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 7:36 pm

Single-Stripe:

Magnetic film that contains a single audio track, which is coated with oxide.

is this what you are talking about?

Why would you want to do this? It is very old technology and film is not used very much with a single audio track coated with oxide. Who would be using your services?

Just wondering????

Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:04 pm

No I'm talking about an creating OPTICAL track. where the information for sound is printed onto a piece of movie film and cut on a flatbed or upright editing machine then "married to the release print.

Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 5:35 am

It is called double system.

From the net...

Although it is possible to reproduce sound, either optically or magnetically, in the same camera that is photographing a scene (a procedure known as single-system recording), there is greater flexibility if the sound track is recorded by a different person and on a separate unit. The main professional use for single-system recording is in filming news, where there is little time to strive for optimal sound or image quality. Motion-picture sound recording customarily uses a double system in which the sound track remains physically separate from the image until the very last stages of post production.

Double-system shooting requires a means of rematching corresponding sounds and images. The traditional solution is to mark the beginning of each take with a “clapper,” or “clap stick,” a set of wooden jaws about a foot long, snapped together in the picture field. The instant of clacking then is registered on both picture and sound tracks. Each new take number is identified visually by a number on the clapper board and aurally by voice. A newer version of the clapper is a digital slate that uses light-emitting diodes and an audio link to synchronize film and tape.

Precise synchronism must be maintained between camera and recorder so that sound can be kept perfectly matched to the visuals. (Lack of perfect synchronism is most conspicuous in close-up shots in which a speaker's lips do not match his voice.) On some occasions several cameras shoot a scene simultaneously from different points of view while only one sound recording is made, or several sound records may be taken of a single shot. Thus, to maintain synchronism, all sound and picture versions of a particular scene must be recorded at the same speed; the camera and the recorder cannot fluctuate in speed. One way to achieve this is to drive all cameras and recorders from a common power supply. Alternatively, synchronization may be achieved through the automatic, continual transmission from cameras to recorders of a sync-pulse signal sent by cable or wireless radio. More convenient yet is crystal sync, whereby the speed of both cameras and recorders is controlled through the use of the oscillation of crystals installed in each piece of equipment. The most advanced system uses a time-code generator to emit numbers in “real-time” on both film and tape.

Not sure why you want to get involved in this process but there are lots of places that can give you some in insight into the process and there are certainly lots of places to buy used equipment from. I would do a search on the web for "double system" and go from there. It is not going to be cheap but you may find some real bargains if you do some careful searching.

Best of luck!

Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 8:13 pm

Thanks, but this is stuff I was already aware of. What I wanted was information on what is required to take the sound recordings from a Nagra or Fostex and then turn it into a single track optical recording, printed on filmstock prior to that filmstock being "married" to the answer print to become the release print so it can be edited on a flatbed 35mm editing machine. I know a precision black & white film processor is involve but know nothing about the process beyond that. Has anyone ever worked at an audio post house and does anyone know anything about this? Also does anyone know who might sell an Acmade film edge-coding machine used to number the edge of film for sync purposes while editing also what other brands of machines for this purpose are available. thanks Cool

Posted: Sun Jun 11, 2006 5:53 am

What you are looking for is an Optical Film Recorder. You did not say whether you were using 16 mm or 35 mm/

From the web...

Optical Track - An intermediate step from going from your mix master to your final print is to have an optical track struck. An optical track is photographed onto a blank piece of special high contract stock by the facility where the mix is done, or by the lab. The optical track is a separate roll of film from the original negative and is combined with picture when a print is struck. (The track itself still remains a separate element from the A&B Rolls, it is printed in a separate pass through the contract printer.)

Please read these...

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/question413.htm

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0240802888/103-5738097-0303828?v=glance&n=283155

http://history.acusd.edu/gen/recording/motionpicture1.html''

http://www.lafolia.com/archive/grieve/grieve200112ugly.html

http://homepage.newschool.edu/~schlemoj/film_courses/glossary_of_film_terms/glossary.html#o

http://www.broadcastpapers.com/whitepapers/ChaseOpticalRec.pdf

http://www.aes.org/aeshc/docs/smpte/movie.sound/kellogg-history2.pdf

http://www.redballoon.net/~snorwood/faq2.html

Sellers of Motion Picture equipment include

http://www.visualproducts.com/

http://productionhub.com/directory/listings.asp?section_id=4&cat_id=647

http://www.equipmentemporium.com/

http://www.lacitycollege.edu/academic/departments/cinema/hotlink.htm

The companies that comes to mind for optical recorders are WESTREX and RCA. Both of which are no longer in the film business. Mauer also comes to mind but has not been used for the last 40 years.

You keep saying you know all of this so I am confused as to what you are really asking for? If you take the time to read the articles I have given you above you will know everything you need to know about optical film recording. A wonderful book on the subject is the Audio Cyclopedia by Howard W. Tremaine or Glen Ballou.

Hope this helps

Posted: Sun Jun 11, 2006 8:48 pm

GREAT! thanks Tom! Very Happy

Actually I'm shooting 35mm and everything I have is geared to that. I looked but had far less sucess than you did finding site for info. I really appreciate you taking all the time and trouble to help me with this. Thanks again-The Captain Cool

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