Presonus FireStudio / DigiMax setup

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:57 pm

Lets say I have a Presonus FireStudio & DigiMax FS setup for a total of 16 mic preamp/channels.

I don't see any Line level inputs on the FireStudio.

How do I connect other outboard pre's w/ a line signal? What kind of cabling do I need?

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:14 pm

there are 8 line level inputs on the front of the firestudio, i believe.

The mic preamps also function as 1/4" inputs (they should have the nuetrik connector that lets a mic or 1/4" plug be inserted in the middle)

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:20 pm

I see that inputs 3-8 are mic/line, although will this truly bypass the internal preamp?

EDIT: Nevermind, i see they also have 2 line inputs on the rear of the unit. Apparently the volume knob merely acts as a Line Trim pot when a line signal is engaged. It's recommended to keep the volume knob at 12 oclock when using a line level source.

Thanks for the help!

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 10:42 pm

I would think that 12 o'clock setting is only a relative suggestion. There are so many different line level references that that broad comment is not really applicable to all line sources. Also, some people don't realize that the instrument inputs on those devices, inputs 1 & 2 are in fact quite usable as line level inputs. It's technically, perfectly fine to take a low impedance output source preamp and run it into a high impedance input source. It's not fine the other way around, i.e. taking a high impedance output source and running it into a low impedance input. That's a no-no. So, you should have no problems feeding line level into all 8 front panel inputs on the FireStudio.

Why would you want to bypass the microphone preamps? The only way to make sure if the preamp is bypassed when utilizing the line input is to look at the schematic. If you're using an external microphone preamp, why? Do you need to group some microphone inputs into a single channel? You already have 8 superb microphone inputs on the Fire Studio. No need to bypass those. These are not junky preamps. Although they could sound that way with improper gain settings.

It sure seems like you're trying to make recording harder than it has to be?
Ms. Remy Ann David

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:14 pm

It's not a broad suggestion, it came from Presonus who designed the unit.

A line level into an instrument in? That's what reamp boxes are for. The impedance is all out of wack otherwise.

Why bypass the microphone preamp? Because I'd be using an external preamp...there'd be no reason to use an onboard preamp when using an external preamp. I know what kind of preamps those are....I'd be running certain tube preamps or Grace Design 101 for particular parts. It's not uncommon to do so, I prefer to mix things up a bit and not have the same preamps on every single input.

I don't think you get it.

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:22 am

Mr. Cornett, you don't know what you're talking about, sorry. Just because Presonus recommends a 12 o'clock position, it is being suggested to you because you don't know what you're doing, or understand anything about gain staging.

It is electronically typical and acceptable to feed a low impedance output source into a high impedance input. That is normal modus operandi and nothing will be out of whack except your knowledge.

You are correct that you do not need to use the onboard microphone preamps when using an outboard microphone preamp but the unit already has 2 fine microphone inputs and so you're being a little silly. Those are supposed to be part of the strong points of that device. Yup, having different preamps will provide you with a different palette of colors, so why did you bother to purchase this particular device? You should have purchased a line audio interface device plugged into a laptop but you seem to know what you're talking about in your own mind and so, have fun. And it is a broad suggestion that they made. What do you know about line level reference sources and all of their different voltage I puts? You think you use the same line input level, when using -10 or + 4?? If you do, I suggest you think about another career choice?

Knowing where I come from
Ms. Remy Ann David

And it ain't from someplace stupid like you.

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:36 am

Wow. This doesn't even really deserve a response. I work with pro audio daily in a top of the line studio running multiple pro tools HD setups. I am building a system at home. I know what I'm talking about. You just suggested in another thread that someone shouldnt run a preamp into their mackie board, but rather straight into the line input of their interface....so why the different response here? Funny.

I'm sorry, but if you have to ask why use outboard pre's, or ask why I have pre's other than what comes on the presonus unit, then you need to do a little hands on experience instead of spending days on end on a message board giving 'expert advise' with no merit to back it up.

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 1:58 pm

mikecornett wrote:

...then you need to do a little hands on experience instead of spending days on end on a message board giving 'expert advise' with no merit to back it up.

Damn dude, nice....

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:27 pm

RemyRAD wrote:

And it is a broad suggestion that they made. What do you know about line level reference sources and all of their different voltage I puts? You think you use the same line input level, when using -10 or + 4?? If you do, I suggest you think about another career choice?

Unless this is "opposite day", the suggestion is anything but broad....it's quite specific in fact. Specific to the design of this unit. Your rant on various line levels on other products would be a broad suggestion, not that of Presonus.

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:08 pm

I know plenty of guys like you that work in fine studios, even teach the recording course. They don't know diddley. They are the blind leading the blind. They are all twentysomethings that think they know more than experienced professionals. I have 37 years in the business professionally as both a radio and television engineer and as a large recording studio chief engineer and I find people like you clueless and uninformed. You have no experience to backup your minuscule knowledge. You're too young. Your questions are of a naïve nature with a seemingly clueless sense of much of anything technical, with questions like those, it's obvious.

You're probably one of those people that doesn't believe you can make a fine recording without a condenser microphone or some kind of esoteric microphone preamp? BULL CRAP!

Have fun with your toy. If you're lucky, maybe one day you'll get it, not the toy, the knowledge, experience, talent, talent, talent???

I'm a practical long-term highly skilled and trained hard-nosed engineer. I've taken all of MCI/Sony's technical training courses and have assisted them in the troubleshooting of numerous tape machines they manufacture. I worked for the legendary Scully professional tape machine manufacturer. I've taken all of the Ampex technical training seminars and have had long talks with John Stephens about his unique transports, electronics and alignment philosophies. I've corrected problems with M. R. L. test tapes. I'm a specialist in on location fine arts, popular and television productions. I've designed, built, installed and maintained numerous large and small control rooms and studios and radio station control rooms at NBC. I've designed and built 24 input audio consoles from scratch, out of high-grade components. All task. I do service work for other studios in the Baltimore Washington metro area. I've been awarded 3 major award nominations, Grammy, Emmy and Soul Train music awards for my superlative audio engineering. I spent 20 years engineering audio at NBC-TV and as a maintenance engineer, camera operator, video editor, installer. And I don't think you are terribly observant of your equipment since you don't quite look at it before you ask questions. So don't give me any crap when you're talking stupid stuff here! I think it's rude.

And freesignal, what the heck is that supposed to mean? You are a big expert here wasting your time helping rude people too?

Quite offended
Ms. Remy Ann David

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:55 pm

Couldn't be further from the truth...It's sad that all of that 37 years worth of work led to such a restrictive & jaded outlook.

Remy, take a step back, or a step down off that throne for a second. Look at the original post, and how you came at it...Your attitude was completely reciprocated.

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:36 am

You are right. I am wrong. Everybody needs to learn from their own mistakes. I should step down, step back, step under, step to the left, step to the right. That would be a little more classy.

Dancing my ass off since it's already too big
Ms. Remy Ann David

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 10:06 am

RemyRAD wrote:

And freesignal, what the heck is that supposed to mean? You are a big expert here wasting your time helping rude people too?

Sorry Remy, in hindsight, that didn't come out the way I meant it to. It was meant to be sarcastic. I totally understand where you're coming from. Some people just don't want to be helped (even though they ask for it). I'm new to this stuff, so, no I'm far from being a 'big expert'. I think it's awesome that someone of your stature and with your experience would take time out of her day to help out some of us in the trenches. Anyway, if he doesn't wanna take your advice, f**k 'em.

Respecting the Experienced
Patrick

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 10:14 am

Advise was already received from Presonus and theaero as stated. Issue was resolved...then she came along and started questioning motives, which in my opinion wasn't called for..not to mention the personal 'slams' which were laughable and far from reality.

Oh well, the issue was answered...no need to continue drama.

Thanks again for the quick response.

Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 12:17 am

FYI If you worked in a 'pro' studio running protools rigs and building systems and that counted as having anything to do with your original question, then there is absolutely no reason you should have had the need to ask the original question. Sometimes its just better to be humble, especially when asking a very basic questions in the first place.

I'd hazard a guess to say this is a pretty decent place, no-one would have jumped at you if you hadn't asked a question like that, and then assumed you knew the answer better because the company recommended a certain path.

Sometimes i worry about the mentality of people who think they are grand engineers these days, but i'm not necessarily saying this is you.... just something to bare in mind. I did teach in a private college for quite a while, and the worrying thing is the amount of self proclaimed young 'experts' who really need to go and do five years or more of apprenticeship after they graduate to actually get to where they think they are in their mind now.

There's nothing wrong with not knowing something! And you didn't know the answer before your posted, or while you posted. Heck if one doesn't know one asks! whats wrong with not knowing these days? nothing IMO. there is a lot wrong in acting unhumble and suddenly knowing it all. You are just better off asking the company in the first place, because they are paid to deal with that kind of stuff.

The inputs on the Firestudio...in fact MANY devices these days, have neutrik COMBO connectors that double as PREAMP and LINE level inputs. ONLY the first two channels are meant for instrument input. at least thats how it was with the one firepod I owned. You can set the trim pot whereever the heck you want to have it! In fact, if you are dealing with a weak source, or say a CD that was recorded very quietly, or a weak O/P synth... and you are feeding into the line ins, then you may need to have the trim pot up some. doesn't mean the preamp is engaged! Nor does it mean Presonus or anyone here is wrong (including yourself). They said 'recommend' didn't they?

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