When Recording Bad singers or artist

Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 4:45 pm

Since I am still learning (does it ever quit)

I have recorded my share of unprofessional artist, Myself included.
I make the odd mistake which I can easily replace with auto punch, or bring up in the Roland v-vocalizer and adjust pitch, timing or dynamics or ... you know there are hundreds of ways to fix.
But when you get that one that can't keep time and can't sing that well and you already committed to a contract, Oh my God what a work out. Thats what I've got now with the CD that I am just completing for a solo guitarist slash singer.
He wanted to do a CD for Christmas to hand out to friends and family.

I guess I have just learned that you can't make everyone sound good.
You can make the sound, sound good and you can correct until it's not real, in some cases that sounds better. I have been trying really hard to make this guy sound, umm, not to hard on the ears and I have concluded that with my experience and equipment I am limited to what I can do.
No miracles just a good mix a few extra tracks (bass, Keys etc) and good sound.. I guess this will continue until I build a proper studio and raise the prices which is not the reason I started this.
I wanted to help artist on a budget.
what a circle. hey that reminds me of a song I wrote, LOL

Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 5:13 pm

I record a bad singer all the time...wait....that's me.

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:05 am

Just as a point of clarification, bwmac, are you saying that you can't make the artist sound good due to limitations with your studio setup, or: you can't make him sound good because he's a no-talent hack?

If the latter is the case, I wouldn't attempt to correct too many - or any - of his timing/performance issues. Does he really expect you to? Record his performance as accurately as you can and give it to him. Let the performance speak for itself. Very Happy

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 7:20 am

Well, you are almost done with the CD, so this is probably worthless advice. But I think it is an artistic mistake to try to make someone like this sound "good" for a project of this sort. Trying to fix this up too mush is like taking a child's art project to pro for some touch ups. You should act like a framer or a book binder here - not as an editor. I've done this kind of thing before for friends. I've just kept putting them through multiple takes until they get the idea that they'd better go home and practice. I'm willing to punch out a bad note or two or record the song in pieces, but I make sure that it is their work that people are going to hear, not mine. And in most cases that's what this type of client (and the people they are giving the CD to) expects.

Besides, I think there is an industry rule that the only amateurs we make sound good are movie stars or have large breasts - preferably both.

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:14 am

Quote:

Besides, I think there is an industry rule that the only amateurs we make sound good are movie stars or have large breasts - preferably both.

LOL, I love that that rule Bob, rotflmao

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:08 am

Does the person sing a lot of wrong notes?

Is their tone bad?

Is their voice weak?

What exactly is wrong with there voice?

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:28 am

out of key bigdaddybluesman

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 2:42 pm

Well, Remy could probably tell how they did it years ago.

I don't know how to do it myself and from what I have read they did it with tape years ago.

They spliced in parts.

Have him do as many takes as you can record.

I figure the song has verse and chorus. So use the best chorus over and over. Pick the best verses he sing and put it all together.

A time consuming answer but maybe the only one.

Then you can use the pitch correcter and you should have something that is palatable. The use of FX will also help. One trick is a splash of massive reverb at the end of a line and cut it, he probably loses pitch really bad. a lot of bad singers with improper technique try to hold notes instead of cutting them while in pitch. That makes it go off. So maybe you can even cut it and use the reverb tail of the cut note as a kind end to the phrase.

You really have to use your imagination and the tools you have as an engineer. If you can make this guy sound good it will help you getting work. When they hear the recording as opposed to the person sing they will want to know who recorded it.

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:18 pm

oops, double posted this one somehow!

gb

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:22 pm

I agree with Duncanjp and BobRogers. I tell everyone that comes to my humble place before they get here the old saying (I honestly can't remember where I first heard it or I'd quote the source) the first step in recording great tracks is for the artist to be able to perform their material well. It's the old garbage in garbage out rule. However we all have to pay the rent somehow...........

gb

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 5:57 pm

Well I have listened and corrrected and recorrected for many days and hundreds of hours now. each time now (final day, ya!!!) I run them through T-Racks and give them a quick sparkle and then burn a cd I find another spot that I can't let go, ahhhhh!!!!. my ears need a break, the dead lines tomorrow. Well I must not waste anymore time. I had a bite to eat and back at it.

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:59 pm

I've spent many years recording out of key, adolescent "punk" - never had a problem cashing those checks...

At some point you just gotta say "good enough... Next!"

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 7:55 pm

There is always a point of diminishing returns in every project. This is true in tracking sessions, editting sessions, over dubbing, splicing, turd polishing etc etc...We have a rule that says if it has gotten to the 'linear scale end' we stop and drink.

I would hope that this artist in question has SOME clue as to how bad they are . But then, I have been part of productions that had no chance from the beginning, and its really hard to point that out....especially for a good paying customer. I've had clients that were brilliant and talented and didnt have a penny to pay with, and conversely I've had clients that couldnt mumble a song but ALWAYS had their cash right up front. I've had conversations with these that suggested that they were wasting their time as far as 'making records' and to a person, they simply werent going to hear that reality and were determined to press on regardless.

Waddaya gonna do?

I had one project where I assembled the band, arranged the music, conducted the backing vocals and built tracks that were extremely hot and happening. Every song started out like a real hot band kikin ass and then the singer started.........................................................................

Train Wreck!!!

It was sad but fun at the same time.

Its those sessions I simply refer to as 'exercising the studio'.

Its a good time to experiment...compress a compressor.... check all the cables....try different mics on different sources....learn to play the accordian...practice making tea.....write a memoir.......

Hell, you aint gonna make it any worse Shocked

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:40 pm

bent wrote:

I've spent many years recording out of key, adolescent "punk" - never had a problem cashing those checks...

At some point you just gotta say "good enough... Next!"

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 12:33 am

Wow, awesome support to a "we've been there" post.
You guys were great, Thanks, and the good news is that Its done!! wo!!hoo!! and I am happy with what I did and what I've learned. I stopped by his place and said come for a ride. I had his CD turned up and I pointed out all the Pluses that I knew he would like. The crystal sparkling acoustic guitar,(his), the tenor sax that I added, the steel guitar that he wanted, and on his vox I was careful with the lexicon, and i used three vocal tracks and I found to much pitch correction was to fake sounding.
He was extremely pleased and flipped me some more cash and ordered two hundred CD'z.
I am glad to have made him happy.
Mental note
Never, never, never ever, again,.... well until next time, Oh God.
Marry Christmas everyone.
Brad
bwmac-recording

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