24bit 96k vs 24bit 192k converters

Discussion in 'Mastering Engineers Forum' started by bigtree, Apr 15, 2011.

  1. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    I'm buying a new converter and interface for my MixDream hybrid DAW system and a modest attempt in mastering that I call polishing at this point.
    I need 16 IO and an interface. The Prism ADA-8RX or less expensive RME are in the running for me.
    I mention mastering because I know you guys are the end result and could save me grief. You may have some for-warned advise that I should hear before I make the plunge.

    I have Lavry Blacks with the Dangerous Master for my polishing rig but haven't even gotten there yet so its a ways away from turning on the power for that part of the studio.

    Do you ever use 24bit/ 192 ? Is this a waste of money and is there better choices that I could make for the combo of both area's of my studio?
    I could save a pile of money if I chose the 96k Prism ADA. I have considered Blues but they are way out of my price range. Lavry is of course 96k which is why I'm asking this question in the first place. I have no need to ever record that high. Do you see me needing this and/or who does? Dan Lavry is @ 96 so... What's all the fuss with 24/192 converters?

    Any suggestions on converters, 96k vs 192k and/or anything the comes to mind would be appreciated.
     
  2. Link555

    Link555

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  3. TrilliumSound

    TrilliumSound

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    Hi, you certainly meant 192k. I have never used 192k so I can't say much about this but Lavry's articles talks about this. Prism ADA8's are great converters but I doubt that they are cheaper than the Blues. I use Prism and love it (@96k max.). I liked the Blacks also but I need at least 8 channels for my workflow.

    Hope this helps.

    Richard
     
  4. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    Hi Richard, yes I meant 192, fixed thanks!

    Richard, hey... can you explain the ADA's configuration better for me? 1 unit can be used 8 AD DA or 16 in or 16 out. So, am I correct that this would do it for me? The only time I am going to be using 16 outs would at the end of my sessions, thus, sending stems out to be summed in the MixDream. I would then either return back or continue on the two buss into the Dangerous Master, either way, 2 buss back to print via the AD10 Black to DAW #2.

    Plus, I am able to use the same ADA for a remote AD via firewire. Am I getting its functionality correct?

    Thanks Link555, I read that long ago but just wanted some conformation from the ME here.
     
  5. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    I'm really thinking out loud at this point and still so unsure of what to do. Whether to get less channels and better quality of more channels and less quality. Have you done comparisons with the ADA-8XR ?
     
  6. TrilliumSound

    TrilliumSound

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    Hi,

    Yes, 16 channels could be done. Stock, it comes with 8 Analog in and 8 Analog out. There is also the AES I/O card that provide 8 Digital in and 8 Digital out. Firewire card also provide 8 I/O. I have both cards and the flexibility is just superb. Both path are also clock and sample rates independant. You can of course monitor any path and channels anytime.

    I did some comparaison with Benchmark, Apogee (Rosetta) and Lavry Black. I personally prefered the Black over the Benchmark and Apogee but I needed multiple channels with flexibity.. so the Prism was a GO for me. Of course, it's all a matter of personal taste when it is about sound preference and I must say that the difference were pretty subtle between the Prism and the Lavry Black (transparency, stereo image and depth). Honestly, I had no desire and time to spend on testing many hours to compare, proper blind testings need to be done... I believe that when you go with Prism, Lavry, Benchmark... you can't go wrong in my opinion, it's a matter of personal taste (how different these could be) workflow and reliabilty with a solid clocking! About RME.. I never used one but I heard good words but not in a real AD/DA Mastering chain but more as a Audio Interface card. I am sure some people could comment about this with real situation and comparaison.

    Again, it is only my opinion and personal experience. Good luck with your choice!

    Richard
     
  7. TrilliumSound

    TrilliumSound

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  8. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    Got it, I'm reading over the options. Either way its expensive. Damn...
     
  9. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    ADA-8 I was looking for them on the website. They must be discontinued yes? $4000, Do you see them used around your area?
     
  10. TrilliumSound

    TrilliumSound

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    Yes, it is discontinued and have been replaced by the XR. I don't see them a lot on the used market but I will keep an eye for you ;-). What about this: Orpheus Recording Interface Home Page , reviews are just great! Is this could work for you?

    Richard
     
  11. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    Yes, if I don't get something like the ADA, the Orpheus is on my list for my remote rig. I'm waiting to hear back on those after the show in the Germany. Orpheus is what got me thinking about the ADA-8's. I've known about ADA's for years but never thought about them much. I thought they where dated and newer converters like Lynx where better value but I now know what value means :)
    Rebuilding the new system from ground up has been a learning curve sifting through 12 years of dealer hype and the uninformed/misinformed. The ADC are the last on my list.

    I really need something that will hook nice and neat to my MixDream. 25 pin dsub is choice so what's out there that's ideal.

    Have you compared anything to the Aurora there? No one I know here has what I am doing. Its wide open up here. But, the drawback on buying anything, its all special order. I have nowhere to go a listen within a 1000km. I'm not so concerned with shootouts. You sound like me, I hear something and know right away. I just want to get something and be satisfied as close enough but, the Lavry's changed my life and its impossible for me to go to far backwards. I don't have 15 grand though.

    RME AD8-QS are perfect design but I'm worried I will hear what I don't want to hear.
    I'm a nightmare to live with right now.
     
  12. Big K

    Big K

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    I used 192 kHz SR only to test it for myself and could not find a reason to record with it.
    Even 96 kHz SR projects are not that often received for mastering, here, but with some material it has its merrits.
    About a third of our work we do in 88.2 kHz SR.

    Chris...
    Didn't you promise to stop your Convertor spams??
    LOL....

    Why-oh-why don't you order what you want to test and send it back when you don't like it?
    I do that a few times a year and about 2 out of 5 devices I send back. We don't even pay for any shipping.
    Aren't there any shops who offer the same service?
    I am suffering like a dog watching you agonizing over your pending purchase.

    :tongue:
     
  13. TrilliumSound

    TrilliumSound

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    50% = 48k, 30% = 88.2k, 15% = 44.1k, 5% = 96k that is coming in over here.

    Yeah Chris, converters spamming is boring, why don't we open an "in depth" discussion about Dithering instead? :wink: hehe.
     
  14. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    My wife and kids are staying clear of me now. The forum and members are being effected and my work is suffering lol.

    AH!

    I've never had such anguish. I'm almost there. I needed the sample rate resolved, re confirmed. Thanks guys!
     
  15. Big K

    Big K

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    Tap, tap, tap...

    There you go.... Take your pills and calm down... :wink:



    [​IMG]
     
  16. TrilliumSound

    TrilliumSound

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  17. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    HA! that made my day!!


    We are certainly going to be attracting new members looking for converters but what about interfaces!
    Am I correct to assume this is just as important.

    My research tells me RME is choice because their drivers are solid, I like TotalMix and PCIe will have less latency and faster conversion. We've covered MADI vs AES/EBU and how MIDI is connected via breakout cable on the card , what else is essential when choosing an interface? If I was going AES/EBU do they all interface quite well or are their key things to consider?

    Have you all found better results with different cards or brands? Do you have regrets after you've chosen one?
     
  18. Big K

    Big K

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    There is a great danger when going AES/EBU !!!
    With many AES/EBU I/Os it changes pitch and instrument!! Especially RME!!
    If you put in a heavy metal axe sound you get a thin violine out of it ( 8 kHz/ 8 bits)
    Really, really awful...! Any Brahms or Puccini replays as a Guns N Roses underwater live gig in half speed.
    With Wagner there is even the smell of Bratwursts in the air when replaying... I am quite desperate!!
    :eek:


    Oh my, AES/EBU is rock solid up to the 192...
    I have never heard any complaint about it from any brand over many years...
    You should be just fine.. as long as you buy gear that has a socket for it...lol...



    See the latest RME third party plugin tool for decidophopia stricken Studio owners:


    de.jpg
     
  19. bigtree

    bigtree musician, mixer, music producer Has Studio Services

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    Thanks for being so patient but I'm still suffering here :)

    So, if I choose to order the RME: HDSPe AES or http://www.lynxstudio.com/product_detail.asp?i=16 does this mean any third party AES converter like Lynx, RME, DAD, Lavry, DirectOut... will work?

    Remember, in order for me to test any converter, I need a new card so I'd like to get that all sorted and hear any concerns. You are saying yes, either a Lynx or RME would work for the described converters and either one would provide the same results? Either on has the same stability? The difference is the software like TotalMix via and whichever I choose to favour?
     
  20. TrilliumSound

    TrilliumSound

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    I think RME or Lynx is a good choice for the sound card interface, both have solid drivers and have been very stable over generation. But if you go with converters with Firewire, you don't need a sound card, your converter will be your sound card. Just like the Prism ADA with Firewire (which I use), no need for sound card anymore and only one source and solid Clocking.
     

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