Faced vs unfaced insulation...

Discussion in 'Studio Construction & Acoustics Forum' started by somexone75, Jan 18, 2011.

  1. somexone75

    somexone75

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    I have tried searching around online and it is looking like the consensus is ruling towards using unfaced insulation for walls between rooms and from interior to exterior walls, but I wanted to be sure before I made my next major investment...

    This is pretty much an elementary question, but better be safe than sorry...

    Room info: (I don't think you'll much / any of this, but to be safe...)

    13' x 11' interior floor dimensions 8'3" to ceiling (12' x 14' to exterior as a free standing building)

    2" x 6" header and footer beams with staggered 2" x 4" s @ 12" oc

    dividing wall at around 7.5' on one side and 6' on the other with a peak towards the middle multiple portions at non parallel angles

    to be double layered & green glued with 5/8" drywall

    no ventilation ducting (Almost like an old bomb shelter... :biggrin:)

    to have linoleum flooring

    Stuccoed exterior walls

    Single sloped roof joists (2" x 8" base with diagonal cut 2" x 8" tacked that couples with the OSB that the paper and shingles are tacked into)

    Relatively quiet neighborhood, but it can get loud quickly without notice

    Trying minimize in to out & out to in noise as much as possible (keep happy neighbors and not worry about noise interference while recording)

    Planning on using R-19 in walls and R-21 in ceiling rafters both fluffy fiberglass

    Could easily push 85 to 90 dB, maybe even 95dB with some drummers...

    Already built for the most part. (Left to do: brown coat / color coat stucco, finish running EMT for audio lines, insulation, linoleum and drywall)

    Y'all think R-19 wall and R-21 roof rafters is about where my R values should be and do you recommend faced or unfaced?
     
  2. MadMax

    MadMax

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    I'm assuming you don't have permits... nor will you go back and get any, nor any inspections. Which is a serious mistake on your part, if this is true.

    Why would I assume this?? No ventilation... which is about as dumb as you can possibly be.

    This sounds like a half thrown together idea/plan, that's going to have some serious issues when/if you decide to sell the property... due to someone dying in the room from no one having good air to breath.

    But to answer your question... 2x4's get R13, 2x6's get R-19, Ceilings get a minimum of R30.

    In your case... I'm guessing it likely won't matter whether you you use faced or unfaced. Just get the cheapest you can buy... as my suspicion is that cheap is the main operative word, and planning is less than well thought out.

    Sorry to be so stern... but I would be remiss if I didn't take you to task about not having proper venting. It's THAT serious!

    When you do the construction properly, your room will be air tight. No fresh air... it gets DEADLY serious.
     
  3. somexone75

    somexone75

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    That is very true, i should have mentioned that I plan on having a screen door that can be used in conjunction with fans and an idea that's still in the brainstorm stage for a door mount intake & exhaust vent for a portable air conditioner system therefore no "official" ducting system room to room to a central point. Lucky for me sounthern California is not a "weather prone" location (mostly hot or hot...) so I shouldn't have many days where I can keep the door open and let ventilation happen via the screen and a fan for practice, baseline mic setup / check and so forth. I need to make sure I keep takes short and quick when there is no air circulation. Needless to say, you have a very valid point.
     
  4. MadMax

    MadMax

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    I realize this is drifting off topic of simply asking what insulation for what sized stud, and for that I do apologize. But the bottom line is proper venting of the room is something you must address, along with permits and inspections.

    GET YOUR PERMITS AND INSPECTIONS!

    Permits are not there as a foe. They exist to protect YOU!

    Permits are in place as a MINIMUM standard to meet. If you are seriously considering building a studio, you will have no problems exceeding codes.

    If you fail to get permits and inspections, two major things can happen, along with a host of other nasty stuff...

    If the municipality (or whom ever issues permits) finds out, they can make you completely tear out everything down to the footer and start all over with permits and fines... or they might just make you tear it down to the beginning and NOT give you permits and STILL fine you.

    If you have a fire, structural failure, injury claim, death or some similar disaster, your insurance does not have to pay your claim, can drop your insurance, and even sue you. To add insult to injury, the municipality can fine and sue you as well.

    If you go to sell the property and your tax base does not include this new outbuilding, you may not be able to sell the property without a full inspection... which at that point, you're back in the crosshairs of the insurance companies and the municipalities.... and you can end up in the same situation of fines, tearing it all down and potential litigation.

    Granted, some locations are better than others, but is it really worth the crapshoot? Not in my opinion... but lets face it... You're building in California... and in SoCal at that! You need to be sure you are building to earthquake code on top of it all.

    Granted, you probably don't need to put in a full on HVAC system, but you need at a minimum, a permanently installed ventilation system. e.g. Some sort of fresh air supply and return system.

    The air in a 13' x 11' room, that is air tight, can go bad amazingly quick with occupancy of even two people. I'm not sure of the exact numbers, but IIRC, each additional person in the room exponentially decreases the time before CO2 exposure reaches a dangerous level. (Regardless of whether the exponential figure is correct, the concept of the danger from CO2 exposure is extremely short with additional occupancy.) Having the real numbers will help, so if anyone knows off hand, please feel free to share them. (HVAC is NOT my strong suit!)

    I honestly believe you are only fooling yourself if you think you can guarantee that you'll open the door in time, not to suffer from the effects of bad air. I've sat in front of my console for hours on end, not paying attention to the time. Without proper air exchange, I know damn good and well, I'd be dead, and/or the musicians and others visiting would be too.

    A simple air intake, attached to a fan and exhausting to the outside is not that hard, nor that expensive. It's such a small room, that turning that air over 4x/hour should be obtainable with just about the smallest fans that are available.

    I would also encourage you to either get Rod's book, or at least go to the library and get a copy of your local code regarding HVAC, electrical and structural specs.
     
  5. Space

    Space Moderator

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    funny thing about adding insulation...things tend to get hot....you live in an area that isn't "weather prone" it's just hot....well, prepare to meet your maker my friend, and do not turn on any electronic gear that is known to do what?

    Get hot :)


    Yer killin' me!!!
     
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