Linking one amp to another for more channels.

Discussion in 'Controllers, Audio Consoles, Live Sound' started by kcguitfiddle, Jul 3, 2011.

  1. kcguitfiddle

    kcguitfiddle

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    I have a Yamaha MG24/14FX mixer and I want to link my Peavey MP 4 powered mixer to it so that I can have 4 extra channels. I still need to make sure I can control my monitors though and I need all of the sound from both boards to come from the same speakers that they would have originally. I am using a Yamaha p1600 power amp. I also have a 12 channel Yamaha mixer that is not powered if that would be easyer to use instead of the MP4. Thanks for the help everybody.

    P.S. Im new to the site and I look forward to helping with any questions I may know answeres to. Thanks KcGuitfiddle
  2. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk

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    Hi and welcome to RO.

    If you Cascade the MP4 into the MG24/14FX (you would come out of the unpowered "Main" jack on the FRONT of the MP4 into an input on the MG24. In which case you're only gaining 3 channels, because you sacrifice a channel from the MG24. If you accidentally plug into the powered 50w "Speaker Jack" on the back - that could get ugly and damage something on both mixers before long. Seems kinda risky to add 3 channels.

    Others may have more ideas, but I'd much rather Cascade the unpowered 12-channel Yamaha mixer into the MG24/14FX and use the MG24 to control anything that has to be present in the monitors. Since you're using a fairly modest amplifier, I'm going to stick my neck out and assume you're not a super-loud band. So it would follow you're not pumping drums (if you have any) back into monitors as some bands might on a big stage with a loud mix. So in your case for instance, you might submix a drum kit to the 12-channel mixer -> Cascade the output(s) to 1 (or 2) inputs on the MG24. Leaving the rest of the channels on the MG for vocals, keys, bass, guits, and fiddles.

    You may not use drums, I don't know.... So not knowing what instruments you're using, it's hard to be any more specific.

    If you want to post some follow-up info - it might open up some other ideas.

    Hopefully that nudges you in the right direction. Good luck!
  3. kcguitfiddle

    kcguitfiddle

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    I am the sound man for a church. We have 4 guitars, 11 mics, 1 keyboard, 1 cd player. But, we occasionally have guests who come in and have guitars and bass's. We do have drums but we aren't amplifying them. I am also recording with Pro Tools. I come out of the St Sub out on the mixer and record everything on one track. It sounds pretty good on the recording because I can judge the volumes in real time. I have 2 monitors. Each with their own power so I can control them on each channel. Would I still be able to control the monitors with the aux if I Cascade the 12 channel powerless mixer like you said?
  4. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk

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    If that's your channel count, you should still have a couple inputs available on the MG24. (probably the two balanced 1/4" inputs of Ch17 & Ch19)

    Sorry more follow-up questions:
    When these guest musicians come in, are they playing in addition to your regular praise band, or instead of?
    Is there a snake to the back of the sanctuary? or are you off to the side somewhere up front?
    If there is a snake, do you enough channels available in it (or other wiring) to accommodate more instruments?
    Do you have any EQs for the monitors at the mixer?
    Can you tell us what model the unpowered Yamaha mixer is?

    Having used plenty of both I would guess that the 'vintage' Peavey is almost certainly a lot noisier than any Yamaha.

    Regardless of which mixer you Cascade into the MG24 - unless you have the means to properly combine Aux signals, controlling the monitor sends from the secondary mixer will be somewhat limited. In other words, if you create a submix of your guests with the Yamaha 12-ch mixer and come out of the Stereo L/R Outputs, into Ch21/Ch22 of the MG24 - compromises will have to be made. Because if you run the secondary mixer into a stereo input (such as Ch21/Ch22), you will only be able to send the entire submix to the monitors.

    Combining the Aux signals from both mixers would eliminate the need to compromise their monitor mixes. There are line level combiners available, such as this ARX model at Markertek. You need it to be line level, not a mic combiner.

    Now it might not be completely according to Hoyle, but if you have an EQ on your monitor sends that has XLR and TRS inputs - you might be able to use it as your line level combiner for Auxes. [I can hear some people clenching as they read this] It doesn't seem like you're blasting full-tilt +36dB levels, so I honestly can't image there's any harm. I'm sure someone will throw a flag here if I'm missing something. If you were to try this configuration, Aux 1 and Aux 2 outputs from both mixers can be used on each channel of both boards. Meaning you will be able to send any combination of channels to either monitor as you would using either board on its own. I'd try combining the Auxes and still Cascade the Mains out into the MG24.

    It's either that, or sell all three mixers and get the MG32/14FX.
  5. IIRs

    IIRs Guest

    I have another suggestion (assuming the smaller Yamaha mixer has two pre-fade auxiliaries suitable for monitor mixes)

    Start by patching the main outs from the smaller mixer into one of your stereo input channels on the MG24. Set the input gain and the channel fader both to unity, and make sure all auxiliaries are down: you have now combined the main outputs from both mixers.

    Now patch aux 1 from the smaller mixer into a mono channel on the MG24. Set input gain to unity, aux 1 at unity, channel fader all the way down: you have now combined aux 1 from both mixers. Do the same for aux 2 with another channel.

    This ties up two mono channels plus one stereo on the MG24, in exchange for 12 channels on the smaller desk with full monitor control.
  6. IIRs

    IIRs Guest

    Actually a slight variation of the method above might be better: patch the main outs of the smaller mixer into one of the stereo effect returns on the MG24 instead of a stereo channel. Then you only lose two mono channels for the auxiliaries.
  7. IIRs

    IIRs Guest

    And a variation of the variation: use a pair of stereo channels for the auxes rather than mono, by simply patching into the left (mono) inputs. So: main outs from smaller mixer into stereo FX returns on the MG24, and aux outputs from the smaller desk into the left inputs of two stereo channels. This would leave all 16 of your mono channels available on the MG24, and might be more suitable if you have spare unused stereo channels available.
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