DVD-A is here!!!!

[golli]

That's all fine and dandy for the average joe, but the average joe isn't buying hi res audio. The audiophile is.

Hmmmm....I would think that in order for a high res format to exist the average joe would have to get in on it. The music industry is all about cutting corners, these days to survive.
If a mixer is producing 2-3, 5.1 mixes a day that IS cutting corners.
So there is no gain in high res or 5.1 if its done in such a hurry.
Are there really enough audiophiles in this world, to produce "deep pockets" to pay for releases in high res. I dont think so.
So that means, me and my mom, will have to get in on the format.

I am not biased in any way. The only investment I have made, so far, is to have a DVD drive in my PC around $50.

I'm just saying how it looks to me. I could not care less who lands on top(as long as we get either one). It just seems to me that to get either formats up and running, the DVD-A is there. The fact that I can go and buy a SACD player, right now, does'nt mean that it is here. I've been looking over the internet (and I consider my self above average Googler), the cheapest SACD player I could find was $3.000 :shock: ( please inform me if I'm wrong on that one)

Both SACD and DVD-A have been plagued by sillyness in marketing, since they came about. SACD by not involving suround, until recently and DVD-A on watermarking (wich is a content protection).

But, again if either high res format are to have a future and songwriters/producers/musicians/etc.. want consumers to get a better picture of their creation, ME and my MOM will have to have means and the hardware to enjoy it.

Until, of course we get faster internet conections and better ways to shrink and decode files, this is a valid discussion.

[TeeME]

No watermarking of homemade DVD-A's

You can get a good SACD player from Sony for about 200~500 bucks. Most of the lower priced stuff has the same quality chipsets but lesser power supplys and transports. Nowdays, Sonys offereings have regular DVD and SACD in the same machine. Look around, they are out there for your knowledge.

My First SACD player was the Sony SACD-1 @5000 US Then I opted for the 777 which retailed for 3500 but oade brothers had it for 1500. A 50 lb beast of a machine. The the SCD-CE775 Sony SACD player became available for 179 at best buy. It retailed for 350 but they could not sell any of them since they had a total of 9 SACD's in stock. I grabbed that one and unloaded the SACD-1 as it was a good sale. Then the Panasonic DVD-F65 and DVD-F85 became available for great prices. The F-65 floor model for 60 dollars and the new F-85 for 140. Then the hoopla about the Toshiba 3950 grabbed my intrest, and I picked up 2 of them, for redbook (DVD Players) and they sound better on redbook than the Sonys. They upsample using 24/192K

The Panasonic F-65 and F-85 blow away the Sonys on redbook and do flawless DVD's (pro scan_ and DVD-A's and stream the digital out as well at 24/192K...and they upsample the redbooks with their re-remaster features to highest redbook playback possible, not even different from the hard drive IMHO.

So...the gambit on all this changes so fast that 6 months ago, it was not as it is now for the recording studio or the consumer. DVD-A decks for cars are being devloped by the dosens for CES 2005 to be shown.


Me thinks...SACD novelty will be exceeded by DVD-A because of its "mainstreamability"

[golli]

I'm not that great at googling :lol:

You can get a good SACD player from Sony for about 200~500 bucks.

That means they are well in the game. I stand corrected :oops:

So...the gambit on all this changes so fast that 6 months ago, it was not as it is now for the recording studio or the consumer. DVD-A decks for cars are being devloped by the dosens for CES 2005 to be shown.

And the war goes on.

.and they upsample the redbooks with their re-remaster features to highest redbook playback possible, not even different from the hard drive IMHO.

Does this upsampling improove the sound.??


BTW are those SACD players you mention, all surround??

[TeeME]

Does this upsampling improove the sound.??

What upsampling does is rearrange the filtering scheme as to not allow the brick wall nyquest filtering (ringing) to come into play, so the answer is YES, CD's sound better than ever.

BTW are those SACD players you mention, all surround??

Yes, all SACD players being manufactured today play:

Redbook
SACD 2mix
SACD 5.1 mix

SACD's will either be...(the discs)

SACD 2mix only
SACD 2 mix and 5.1 only
SACD 2mix and redbook only
SACD 2mix, redbook and 5.1


Since these are the formats available on SACD, you have to know what you are getting before you purchase, and sometime, it is not even labled.

DVD labling is FAR more consistant and conspicuoius

[golli]

Ok, check this out for me.

http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...article_id=575


And here is a link to a good article, a one mans opinion but a good reading:
http://sound.westhost.com/cd-sacd-dvda.htm

[Michael Fossenkemper]

I picked up a pioneer elite player for $350 brand new and plays all formats including mp3. The Technology is the same whether it's DVD-V, A, or sacd. No consumer players that I know of offer digital output of the hi rez. only the dolby digital or dts streams. things are changing but still the average joe is not buying. SACD is still outselling DVD-A by something like 5 to 1. the only people I know that own either format are audiophiles. At least the ones who actually know that they play hi rez and go out and purchase the discs. I know one person that had an SACD player but didn't know it. Players are cheap, you can get them for $179, granted they sound like dirt even if they do up sample. Labels were very hot on these formats but in the last year or two have cooled. They may heat up again once they get re organized. On the other hand DVD-V is where it's blown up.
I personally like both formats. I have good and bad on both. Sony is below par on their product because they are just trying to crank out as much as they can. It's not so much of the mastering as it is the mixing. I mean they are crankin the stuff out trying to out product DVD-A. Both formats can really sound great, but it's only going to be as good as they people doing it. Give it time to develope and it can be great. If Sony were to give up their licensing on SACD, I think it could take over. I believe Sadie has created a SACD authoring system but the problem is delivering refs to clients. I have mastered a few DVD-A titles but not authored them. I like DVD-A not because of the sound but because I can use the gear I have. But I'm in the biz and not the average joe. the average joe has heard of SACD but doesn't know DVD-A from a hole in the wall. It's a tough call and that's why it's not successful. The real problem is not what best serves the music, it's what best serves the owners of the music. The owners of the music make gear. The music is what they use to sell gear. The problem is that they sold CD to well to the consumer. They sold it as the ultimate medium, you can't get better than digital. They see no need to have better digital, digital is digital and it's the best. most of the people that I know in NYC download mp3's rather than buy the Cd. everyone here has an ipod and this is their main medium for listening to music whether is be at home, car, or on the go. I spend more money on better equipment and they listen to it on an ipod. The supply is there but the demand isn't.

[TeeME]

http://www.highfidelityreview.com/ne...umber=18483611

DVD-Audio Sales Five Times that of SACD Says RIAA Survey
DVD-Audio sales doubled in 2003 and are more than five times that of SACD, according to an RIAA survey – that is the news from the DVD-Audio council circulated today:

In a world where a drop in music sales is the expected norm, DVD-Audio, the leading high-resolution audio format, bucked the trend, more than doubling its sales in 2003, according to the RIAA’s 2003 consumer survey released recently.

DVD-Audio offers surround sound and stereo along with images, lyrics, videos and other extras, and is compatible with existing DVD-Video players, delivering the highest level of quality on DVD-Audio/Video players.

The RIAA survey concludes that DVD-Audio sales in 2003 were over five times the level of competing high-resolution audio disc formats, with a 2.7% market share – up from 1.3% in 2002 – in comparison to SACD’s 0.5%.

John Trickett President of the DVD Audio Council said “The growth in DVD-Audio demonstrates that the format is being rapidly adopted and poised to move into mainstream music sales. This is clearly a product that the consumer wants to buy. The increasing number of titles being released by many labels including releases by superstar artists such as Britney Spears, R. Kelly, Sting, The Who and Neil Young will further help the development of music in DVD Audio. We are very excited about the future.”

The RIAA survey also showed continued growth in sales to older consumers, with 26.6% made by buyers 45 years old and up, 35+ purchasers making up 47.8% of all sales. “They are one of the two primary markets for DVD-Audio,” said Trickett. “DVD-Audio is also becoming popular among younger consumers for the added-value music videos, artist commentaries and web links that are often found on the discs – a market segment where conventional music sales are falling.”

[Michael Fossenkemper]

That's great news. Still, if I walk into circuit city and look at the systems, the only one I see is SACD. But I think they even stopped carrying that. I would love to see DVD-A dominate and take over and be in every house. I just don't see it now. I also think that with these new higher format DVD's that are going to come out in the next few years may even bring another audio format. I feel that if DVD-A or SACD has a chance to make it, the manufactures are going to have to make it standard in all DVD players. Once that happens then we will see a turn. I have 2 universal players so I know it's possible to build a unit that will play back everything. We are just now beginning to see titles that are really worth getting a system to play it back on. I have maybe 4 now that I love to listen to and benifit from this hi rez medium. The rest I can live without.

[TeeME]

My Best Buy carries 9 different DVD-A machines and one SACD machine. I just left there. The DVD-A selection VS the SACD (discs) look about the same. Kinda lame, no more than 200 titles each. I get my dvd-a discs on line or just make my own.

[Michael Fossenkemper]

I need to find a new junk retailer to hang out at.