Another mixdown

Discussion in 'Mastering' started by Nutti, Jan 1, 2013.

  1. Nutti

    Nutti Active Member

    How about this one? Tell me what you think

    Drums recorded with 2 condenser overheads set at ortf, 2 mics on snare, one condenser on hi-hat and one inside the kick. I used an fx called use space from my tascam dp-01 and added some eq to the whole kit and a little reverb later in cubase.
    Bass went straight into the DI box->compression->interface and got some eq on it.
    Guitar was routed trough a zoom g7 multieffect->Di box->interface with a little eq later on and a haas effect. A little
    Keys left/right into interface with some reverb added in cubase.

    http://m.soundcloud.com/user314830501/jazz

    Happy new year!
     
  2. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

    did i miss the link?
     
  3. Nutti

    Nutti Active Member

    LoL, forgot to paste it to the message
     
  4. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

    stranger things have happened, lol. apparently soundcloud mobile doesn't support the latest version of firefox. which is what the error message said. i'd love ta hear the tune, maybe put in on dropbox? or email me (kmetal@comcast.net)
     
  5. Nutti

    Nutti Active Member

    Crap, here's the dropbox link...hope it works :) Link removed
     
  6. Else Logic

    Else Logic Active Member

    That's pretty well recorded, but the piano sonds a bit empty and flat.
    Also, the bass doesn't really seem to be in time.
     
  7. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

    yea the bass and drums need to work together more. it's making the recoring sound nervous. nice snare sound tho. in a jazz situtaion, i'd really consider micing the bass amp, perhaps his lackluster timing is due to no being able to "feel" it. also, i'd try micing the kick on the outstide to get more boom/woof, rather than beater attack like a modern rock record. to me it's not so much the recording quality, as the performance quality that needs the most work. unfortunately there's no pluggin for that. not a bad capture of the performance.
     
  8. Nutti

    Nutti Active Member

    Thanks for the replys guys! This is actually not a band...it's just me having little to do and playing all the instrumenst myself :) So the timing of the bass is me that just can't play the bass...I shure can't get any realtime feel of it when I'm having trouble to get the notes right hehe. I played it several times and cut out the one that was most in time of them all and just copy/pasted that all over the song. No wonder it sounds like theres no feel to it :) But I made this song just for mixing practice, so it's nothing that will leave my studio.

    I also would have wanted to run the bass trough an amp, but I don't own one! It has been on my "to get" list a long time but I havn't found the resources for it yet, and also I really don't know what amp to buy that would be cheap enough for me. When it was recorded it had no softness to it whatsoever and alot of string sound so it took quite a lot of db changes in freqs to get it somewhat softer.

    With the kick it was already set up for another heavy session so I did'nt want to change it's position, but it would have probably given a nicer boom sound if I would have put it infront of the kickport? I used a subkick but in my opinion that is something you don't want to overdo since it just boosts >250hz (atleast mine does that) and to mutch of it and it starts to produce a "ringing" boom sound.

    Thanks for the snare compliment! It's a Tama starclassic maple snare with evans coated power center on the beater side that is tuned really high, I love it!

    About the piano, I don't really know what to do with it? It's a Korg x5d just lined left/right with a some reverb, I thought it sounded nice so I didn't want to eq it at all. Any tips or pointers on what to do to get more life to it?
     
  9. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

    see your approach to editing is fine but it's missing one thing. to do what you want to, you have to treat the drums and bass as one unit. so when your listen to your performance, you have to pick the section that the drums and bass are grooving, and cut/paste/repeat to taste. cuz what's happening is the drums are going to sway naturally, but the bass part being repeated is just one section, so it is essentially "locked" to only one section of the drums but being repeated over a full drum take.

    when your doing things like this, just group the drums/bass/(rhythm guitars) and take your favorite section and repeat to taste. for more realism, you could pick say four different sections from the rhythm tracks, and mess around with putting them in different orders, to create say a "full" verse, so it sounds less machine like. this is the concept that drum replacement and good midi programmers use. they are triggering the same drum, but the computer has say maybe 16 different hits, that either get randomly played back, or usually based on how hard the drummer is really hitting it. if you repeatedly trigger the same hit over and over, it's known as 'machine gun' effect. the same concept applies to assembling a 'master take' our of a performance.

    you'll get a jazzy boom if you put a kick out mic off center and away from the port hole (experiment w/ distances). the port hole is typical for rock. i typically use a beta 91, or sennheiesr 421 kick in, and an akd d112 in the hole. this is for punchy pointy rock kicks. in an inside for jazz the more towards the shell you aim the mic, the more round itll get more 'boomy'.

    well i love to mic keyboards you get some grit, and some life cuz your actually moving air, it helps it from keeping it 'sterile'. also a little compression can make it pump some more. try a medium attack, and set the release so that the needle gets back to 0 by the time the next set of stabs (in this case) starts. try no more than 3 or 4db of reduction.

    again more so than the sound, is the panning. thats a cool stereo guitar sound, but when the piano comes in stereo they start fighting. 2 solutions. 1- mono guitar mono piano. L/R. 2- pick one instrument to be hard paned, and one much less panned. a 3rd could be to pan the gtr left or right, and a tempo sync'd delay (try 8th) much lower, and to the opposite side equally. ditto for the piano. this will get the mix to "dance" left to right, and not collapse the stereo image, or have them competing.

    also- are you familliar w/ how to work w/ phase on a multi mic'd instrument like the drums? i'll tell you how if you don't, but i don't wanna waste anyone's time in you do.

    keep working at it your getting there.
     
  10. Nutti

    Nutti Active Member

    hmmm, I might just need to rerecord it and hopefully get some decent takes of the bass.

    A 421 has been on my to get list for a while also, but I havn't got the money for it. I still do this as a hobby and don't get a lot of cash to play around with.

    Micing the korg would need for me to get an somewhat amp for it and that is not really of priority at this point. How do you mic synthesizers when they don't have any built in speakers?

    The panning explenation was great! short and simple! Noone have ever explained different techniques to me that simple as I would understand :) I'll shure try out them all to hear what they sound like!

    Yes I know some about phasing. When recorded this I went with drums to the mixer -> L/R out to my tascam dp-01 then exported the L/R channel to cubase for editing. The reason for doing this is to be able to hit record while sitting at the drums. The minus of this was that I was not able to flip the phase of the bottom snare mic, but it seemed to work anyway. I got both the top and bottom mic to work togeather, and tough I had the bottom mic mutch quieter it wasn't killed by the top mic.
     
  11. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

    mic placement is good, and you did it well in the snare. i'm just curious about the OH's, which can be out of phase w/ each other (depending on placement) and the kit. i use an in phase kick drum as the reference to the OH;s, then reference everything else to the OH.

    i think you should re-record too, you can do it better as you become more comfortable w/ the bass's role, and fretboard scale.
     
  12. Nutti

    Nutti Active Member

    I used the ortf mic placement, it might not be optimal for this recording but like I said that it's set up for heavy recording and I used the set as it stands. Here's a pic, sry about the lack of light on the picture... [Updated] Have an Older Computer? Download Adobe CS2 Premium Plus for Free | Fstoppers
     

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