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Any suggestion for "KRK Rokit 8 RP8G3 Powered Studio Monitor", i am going to purchase this.

Discussion in 'Monitoring / Headphones' started by vaibhav dewangan, May 2, 2014.

  1. vaibhav dewangan

    vaibhav dewangan Active Member

    hello frns, i am going to buy this monitor, i am going to use this monitor for mixing and mastering.
    i know i am new to this mixing n master, its not every one's cup of tea, but i wanna make my few decent composition... well, i have a separate room of size10*12ft having two sofa set, wall is not covered with any sound absorbing panel, its just the new living room, which i am going to use for recording purpose.
    so, can you guys suggest me something about these monitors and about my room?
    thanx a ton in advance.
     
  2. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    well, not to be a nit picker, but it would be helpful if you could tell us which monitors you are considering.

    As far as your room... don't run out and buy the standard 1" auralex or sonex panels. First, you don't even know if you need them, and second, they are the most-used and the most over-rated acoustic material on the market.

    Don't just go throwing up acoustic treatment all over your room before you even know what your room needs.

    Mixing is one thing... but if you don't know anything about Mastering, then don't even try. Have a pro do it.
     
    vaibhav dewangan likes this.
  3. vaibhav dewangan

    vaibhav dewangan Active Member

    1st thing, how should i know what to do with my room??? whats the need of the room?
    2ndly, i am considering
    "KRK Rokit 8 RP8G3 Powered Studio Monitor"
     
  4. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    The goal is to have the room as close as possible to being balanced acoustically, so that what you are hearing in your room is accurate...

    You need to measure your room in terms of reflection time across the spectrum, as well as standing waves of low frequencies. It's also helpful to know the construction of the room - the type of walls, the material used, and the shape, including the height.

    The easiest, quickest way to check, is to mix something in your room. Then take it to another playback system in an environment that is more trustworthy, perhaps a professional studio.... see if the bass is overpowering or shy, or, perhaps there aren't enough highs, or, maybe even too much high end.

    This is a very quick and dirty way to initially tell what's happening in the room. Most of the time, low end will be your biggest issue. For this, the 1" tiles you see for sale on almost every retail website will be useless. Those tiles will do nothing for frequencies below 1k. If you have upper frequency issues, like echo or reverberation, then this material can be of some help BUT... if you use too much of it, you won't get an accurate representation of your mixes either.

    There are measuring devices available that can measure various frequencies and frequency ranges in your room and provide the "RT60". RT 60 is a standard form of measurement used to determine how long it takes the reflections of a direct sound to decay -60 db.

    You've touched upon a very wide and complex subject. This is a scientific subject, and cannot be explained within a mere few minutes (or even hours) on a forum post. There are several great books on the subject, as well as a few very knowledgeable people here who may (or may not) take the time to explain this to you in greater detail. I suggest you do some reading and research the subject before you begin to add (or subtract) any acoustic treatment material to your room and then come back with specific questions. There are just far too many variables involved to be able to tell you what you need in just a few paragraphs, and there is so much information missing.

    For your situation, right now, I can't see the KRK's as being a bad buy. Studio monitors range anywhere between $50 each to $5000 each. There's no point in spending a great deal of money on high end monitors until you figure out how your environment responds. I would stay with a woofer no larger than 6" for now, and make sure you set them up as close to you as possible, to insure that you are getting as much direct sound as possible, to avoid the sound of the room, until it has been evaluated for issues.

    There's really not much more that can be said at this point until you research room acoustics more and do some measurements of your space. I now defer to the acoustics experts here on the forum who may have something to tell you.

    d.
     
  5. vaibhav dewangan

    vaibhav dewangan Active Member

    thanx alot, its really helpful for me... anyways.. I vll try to get the measurement device first for the best room...
    and come back to you soon with more doubts...

    Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk
     
  6. vaibhav dewangan

    vaibhav dewangan Active Member

    http://music.tutsplus.com/tutorials/quick-tip-diy-basic-room-acoustic-measurement--audio-13678

    Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk
     
  7. vaibhav dewangan

    vaibhav dewangan Active Member

    do you think this link would help me?

    Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk
     
  8. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    Any accurate information will help. Make sure you validate the source. Don't just blindly take random people's words. Education is always a great thing as long as the education you are getting is accurate.
     
  9. RemyRAD

    RemyRAD Well-Known Member

    I've got some suggestions for ya.

    First off, the least of your worries are your acoustics. When it comes to pop music genre stuff, acoustics is a bit of a misnomer. Fine... and if you've got a half $1 million with which to build up your studio complex. Right? No? Oh... you got $200? So don't waste your money on that stuff. Why do I say this??

    While I have been in the studio business, since I was a teenager, 40+ years ago... much of what I have recorded has been in locations where acoustics weren't good, or bad, didn't exist. As I specialized in live recordings, live broadcasts for both radio and TV of musical entertainment events. Where stage monitors are blaring into your microphones. There is no separation between musicians, instruments, church or state. And yet... it still has to sound like a hit record and all with cheap microphones. Nothing ideal. This leaves you with only one option. A proper knowledge of all your Equipment and a solid Technique, in your Engineering.

    So let's start with the equipment. First question... what exactly, do you want to be recording? What genre? How many instruments? How many people? How many people you can have playing instruments all of the same time? Do you have enough microphones to cover all of that, all at the same time? Do you have enough tracks and inputs to do that, all at the same time? See... this is getting a little complicated isn't it?

    So what do you really need for equipment? You need something that will offer you at least 16 simultaneous, XLR microphone inputs. You need something that offers Insert Patching, so you can record a microphone with some external analog compressor/limiter. Or an interface that has onboard DSP, that will allow you to record tracks, with dynamics processing. Many of us, particularly myself, totally believe in recording vocals with some dynamic compression and/or light limiting. While it can be done in post, after recording, after-the-fact, I find that things sound better, when ya do that, right off the bat, going in. And makes for easier recording with less extreme low level stuff that won't be heard against extreme high level stuff that would top out and distort the track.

    Then, you'll also want some downward expansion or slow gating. This offsets the rush of background noise, being compressed to higher levels, between phrases of the vocal. It eliminates the sound of singers gasping for air. It tightens up their track, almost like you put them in a vocal booth. Without having a vocal booth!

    Then you also gate all the drums but not the overheads. You can do that one in post. As long as you didn't record blown out distorted tracks.

    The same can be done with the guitar. So that when he's not playing, you don't hear his guitar amplifier buzzing. And you're not picking up other leakage from other instruments, once you set the threshold to the downward expander/gate, just right. That's a critical adjustment. Much more critical than a compressor or limiter. Whose settings can be more arbitrary. Not so with downward expansion and gates.

    This can all be accomplished with something as simple as a Mackie 1604 and a couple of DBX 166's, along with a bag full of SHURE, SM-57 & 58's. And don't forget the extra foam pop filters for the vocals on the SM-58's. Otherwise... all bets are off. This is actually all you need except for your digital recorder or computer audio multi-track interface, with at least 8 simultaneous inputs to 8 separate tracks. On the recorder or in your timeline.

    You don't even need condensed or microphones for drum overheads, contrary to popular belief. 57's about 3 feet above the drums, left & right, will still sound stellar. In fact I find condenser microphones, of most any type, under less than ideal acoustic situations, to be more of a detriment than an advantage. These more limited sensitivity and slightly limited bandwidth restrictions in any of these dynamic microphones, make up for a lousy small acoustical environment. Which is what most home and basement studios unfortunately possess. Absolutely nothing from acoustic standpoint.

    I have used gates and downward expanders (which are basically the same things with a slightly different twist) to control and compensate for less than desirable acoustic environments. You can gate off or expand away, standing waves and room resonant frequencies, faster than you can hear them. It eliminates the perception of phase cancellation on drum microphones since the drum microphone on the particular drum being struck is the only microphone on, on that drum, for that short duration hit. So any phase cancellation is both eliminated and masked.

    Learning how to make good recordings under compromised acoustic environments, will make you a better engineer, then purchasing any other gobbledygook. Then it's strictly up to you to make a professional sounding recording. I never let equipment or the lack thereof, get in my way.

    For instance, back in the day when we didn't have any noise gates/downward expanders, to put on the drums? Yeah... then we would put them in a drum booth. To get a better more isolated sound on some of the drums, we'd include gaffer's tape/duct tape, wallet on top of the snare drum head, taped down. Maybe even a handkerchief on top of the snare drum? And a piece of duct tape holding down the snares from rambling too much even when they were tight. Stuff like that.

    Recording and other folks basements... I was known to take guitar amplifiers and stick them in the bathroom with the door closed and multiple microphones in the bathroom. You tape down some microphones inside of a piano and close the door... I mean lid. Both. You put moving blankets over the grand pianoIf you want the top open. Just take the bass guitar direct. And 58's on the vocals, live, during tracking. Call it a scratch track but... many times... scratch track... will end up being the good take. Once you've overdubbed the vocals with better microphones 30 odd times. Believe it. It's happened all too often. So ya have to set things up in order to be able to, in the end, roll with it. You're not going to fix what can't be fixed. Don't even try. You'll be wasting your time which will culminate in nothing but sheer frustration.

    If you got lousy acoustics? Truly lousy acoustics in your recording space? Then take advantage of the lousy acoustics. Use them. Process them. Mold them. And pat them with a B, for baby and me. Bad acoustics and work in your favor in the pop music medium of pop music. You wouldn't want to bring over a string quartet or maybe you would? It's bad for one thing may not be bad for all things. Which is why you shouldn't waste your money putting up expensive pretty looking foam thingies as it will only make things sound worse. It will absorb everything good. It'll leave everything bad, behind, for you to enjoy. Because you can't fight it. You can't get rid of it. Not unless you're going to spend $20,000-$50,000 to completely rebuild your basement or your bedroom. Because the foam is like your phallus. See? It can be up and ready but without the proper enclosure, it won't make a baby.

    As indicated there are hundreds of worthy, DIY home recording books available. There is no one that we would call the be-all, end-all, Bible. Most will just parrot and imitate each other in their, general rock 'n roll purpose, vernacular. They'll recommend all lousy cheap, Chinese condenser microphones they think are good. Are all under $200. Don't waste your money. Instead, purchased a pair of 57 or 58's for that same cost. Why? When others sound better? Well... THEY'RE NOT BETTER. THEY ARE ONLY DIFFERENT. Let's be clear about that. I love 57 & 58's, for a very significant reason. They not only worked great and sound great on 99% of anything you put them on. They also do a great impersonation of the $3300 +, Neumann U-87. I'm not kidding and that's no BS. We proved it time and time again. It is the most valuable microphone, ever made. And only $100, and new. Just watch all of the great live concert rock 'n roll videos. 90% of the time you're looking at and listening to 57 & 58's. Because they do exactly what wants them to do. They sound exactly the way we want them to sound. And very little else is required.

    Yes... can add some low frequency cut when doing vocals. It's appropriate since they are not including any low-cut switch, ya typically find on condenser microphones and higher cost premium dynamic microphones like the 300+ dollar, SHURE, SM-7's. No real difference worth the $200, for the small-scale, home project studios. And which are rather impractical and too large, hiding people's faces, to be used on camera. Of which can also not be easily removed from a microphone stand since they are screwed directly to the stand. And you're paying a lot of extra money for those two switches and a slightly larger microphone output transformer with a heavier weight base that won't fall out of the microphone clip.

    What can you do it you only have a computer audio interface that only has 2 inputs? Well things get a little more complicated but... it just requires, that you have more outboard equipment. Such as a mixer, compressors/limiters, special effect devices. So that folks can hear that when you are doing overdubs, so they can deliver to you a better performance. So this is how things can get streaming involved and overly complex.

    What do you do about headphone mixes? All the big timers have 8-16 channel mixers, for each musician and each headphone. No problem when you have $5000 plus for a headphone system. For everyone else? They get a mono or a stereo mix. Where you tried to make it sound right in their headphones, the best you can. Because unless you're going to spend beaucoup Dinero? Everything is going to be a compromise of one sort or another.

    Without any solid background or knowledge about what equipment can do what for what you need? We'd really have to know what your recording intentions are? What's your budget?

    As to reading books? Well that's what we all did because the Internet didn't exist. Today... go to YouTube. Unfortunately, with YouTube, there is as much great information as there is the most unbelievable stupid crap, I've ever heard. The blind leading the blind in many cases. So who to listen to? Have ya read the back of any popular albums? Anyone that impressed you? Ya might want to google them? And you might find him giving lectures all over YouTube? Folks like George Massenburg, Bruce Swedein, Bob Clearmountain and hundreds of others. Then search them on YouTube.

    Better have plenty of good smoke, popcorn and beer because it's going to take a while. There is so much to watch. So much to learn. It's all there. It's all free. And 50% is right on the money. The other 50% will waste your money. If you want to know how to make superb recordings? The folks I mentioned, along with myself, I hold in the highest esteem. Other folks, not so much so. They may have their forte at what they do such as the computer created stuff we call rap and hip-hop. They might be into avant-garde, electronic/pop/rock, wanting all sorts of crazy gobbledygook? For that, a lot of folks love ProTools HDX and other high-end versions. Those all offer real-time DSP processors in a separate chassis. The computer doesn't do the work. It just stores the work. Less costly versions relied solely upon the power of the computer and its authorized compatibility. These are where things get rather complex.

    In a good system to learn on that is very affordable, still packs a punch and provides you with everything else you're going to need sans, extra outboard equipment for more involved and higher production situations. Items like the Presonus Audio Box USB 1.0 is only $150 US. The real-time version offering real-time effects, that can be monitored during recording is the Audio Box USB 2.0 at $250 US. Both include an incredible software bundle/package. The likes of which provide for the most intricate and involved, computer-generated, recordings. It includes VST I, synthesizer instruments. It only requires a black-and-white midi keyboard and midi connection to your computer. It gives you an assortment of process, all real, all sample, with various rhythm patterns you could select and modify. It's a $1000 multi-track software package, with mastering plug-ins, a whole slew of plug-ins, 8 or 10 GB sample, synthesizer library. But it's only two inputs.

    They make a FireWire version or two that allow for 8 simultaneous inputs FireWire. Some are now featuring USB 2.0 & 3.0 and for Macintosh users, the new Thunderbolt. Those Universal Audio Apollo interfaces are totally awesome! Might even be my undoing? I don't use Macintosh. But there are others I could on the PC. It all depends on what works right for you? And the only way to figure that out? It is to sample everything, you can, for the next 20 years. 10 years if you're impatient. Tomorrow... if you need to record your Band. Or perhaps yesterday? It's usually yesterday.

    So the 2 input boxes, to get multitrack recordings with, can still be done. But it's not going to be done, a simple way. It will be simpler or more tracks you have available, on your first pass in. For most folks wanting to record most garage bands, 2 is tough. 4, a little easier, 8 if you're trying to make people think you're serious. 16 for those that are more demanding. 24 when you're trying to do live TV and radio or more. Mostly 32-96 inputs for those. I can't take more than 48. For those that consider themselves professional. Then we can do anything! Including still being able to make truly awful sounding recordings when it's in the wrong hands. Some of those folks have been the teachers that teach this. They never knew how to do a lot of recording as they never did it. Except for being some kind of Joker PA guys, which are a lot of the guys here. Not that they're not good engineers because they started off in PA because they are. I don't do PA. I did albums, broadcasts and commercials.


    Somebody had to do it
    Mx. Remy Ann David
     

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