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"Borrowing" Samples

Discussion in 'Recording' started by kaverinator, Apr 22, 2003.

  1. kaverinator

    kaverinator Guest

    Hello to all the scary RO people!

    This is my first post here and I am afraid that I am going to come off looking like a tard so please be kind, give a girl a chance, and don't flame my message unless you think it is absolutely necessary. Eeeee. (Nervous)

    Ok, if I were to jack a sample from a popular song, say a well known pop radio song, and this particular sample is extremely unique but very identifiable (that's why I like it :D ), could I use this sample without looking like a poser? Would this rule apply with any identifiable sound that has been in a copywrited song, or should I just be impressed by their skills and leave it alone?
     
  2. Kemble

    Kemble Guest

    Hey Kavernator (Cavern?)-
    First- there is no dumb question here (beat you to saying it, Kurt!)
    Second, unless you badmouth the United States of America, baseball, apple pie, or mom, then you won't get flamed.
    Third- $125,000 per incidence of use per sample is the going rate you can be sued for by the owner. And I think it is even if you don't make money off of it.

    I may be a bit off with the number, but its near that.

    Specify what you're going to be using this sample for. That will help. Sure, the bottom line is "NO", you can't use it without permission.
    BUT: (there is always a but!) Do I have a silly rap song on my harddrive using the KnightRider theme, a loop from a Journey song, and a drum loop that I made and rapped to? YES. And there it shall forever stay. Vanilla Ice made a WHOLE ALBUM and didn't get permissin from ANYONE! He later paid out the nose. But then again, he got to be famous and had a great haircut.

    The Verve illegally sampled the strings for Bitter Sweet Symphony and were sued. They had to give ALL of the money to the owners. (the Stones?) That means that ANY time that song is played someone else makes $!

    While the copyright law is black and white, it seems your question scenario is not!

    Jeff
     
  3. HiString

    HiString Guest

    I think that sums it up nicely..............without even a risk of flames.

    Although I did notice a change of nik by kaverinator to laurasia.........curious :cool:
     
  4. David French

    David French Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2002
    Location:
    Indiana
    I think I know what you want to do; it's called 'biting' in the hip-hop community. Such an act can generate a surprising ammount of resentment toward the perpetrating producer.. even if you bite yourself like the Neptunes do.

    If you bite other producers, you can have success, but at the cost of your integrity.

    Be original and you won't have to worry.
     
  5. kaverinator

    kaverinator Guest

    Thanks so much for your help boys.

    Mr. Jeff Z., all I can say is "cool." :) . So I changed it to Laurasia, which is part of my first name (Laura), and the ending ‘asia’ because I am Asian. Plus it refers to the geological phenomenon known as ‘Laurasia’, which is the technical name for the Northern half of Pangea. :D

    And David French, thank you for the term ‘biting.’ I will be sure to incorporate that into my vocabulary from now on. :D
     
  6. HiString

    HiString Guest

    (Mr) HiString bows in acknowledement of Laurasia's most educational reply :) .

    An inventive and appropraite nik, and much shorter than Gondwanaland, (as you would know, the Southern Land mass of those past times), part of which I inhabit.

    BTW, the correct spelling is Pangaea (Gr., all earth).

    Now I can sit back and continue listenin' to Gov't Mule, sipping coffee and try and forget my time working in Geology.

    :cool:
     
  7. David French

    David French Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2002
    Location:
    Indiana
    Laura,

    The Neptunes have been known to use the exact same drums (and other things) from production to production. Moreover, they often use the same rhythms, but since they are the originators of these sounds and rhythms, it's not so bad. It helps even more that the sounds and rhythms are totally ill! (there's another one for your vocab)The real danger is taking someone else's sounds. If you try to sound like Timbaland or whatever, people are going to notice and you won't get respect from the people whose respect you care about: your peers. As for the public, they don't know a Dre from a Dupri, and consequently don't give a squirt.

    And yes, those are K240's, but I bet they would look better on you ;)

    BTW, have you talked to Wendy May over in the vocals forum? I'm sure she'd be happy to see another girl here!
     
  8. kaverinator

    kaverinator Guest

    Thank you for your reply David. (May I call you David?) :D I will look-up Wendy May ASAP. By the way, I think your headphones look pretty snazzy.

    Anyway, you said that the public doesn't know a Dre from a Dupri. Sounds like the average listening Joe is pretty dumb. There are some songs out there that are so good a complete idiot couldn't help but like it. However, some horrible songs seem to slip through the cracks and make it onto the radio.

    Do you think that a lot of musicians and producers are counting on a stupid audience to like their tracks and invest in them?
     
  9. Kemble

    Kemble Guest

    I just wanted to chime in that this is a loaded question, and should many RO eyes come across it I would be interested in the replies of the RO big shots (big shots in my eyes, not their own. ...those humble moderators.... :D )

    Hey Kurt! Whattaya say to this question? I'm going to guess that someone is going to say "Sell outs who are only interested in MONEY will dumb down their music to sell it" and then someone will say "Well, then call me a SELLOUT because I want to provide for my family and make $!" and then someone will say "This is a free market society and if I want to sell out and make $, fine; and if I want to be an artist and starve, fine too!" and then (FINALLY), someone will chime in- usually some elder statesman and bring it home again with "music is about expressing who you are and finding that song inside of you. And when you sing the song that was put in your heart, it doesn't matter who else likes it. If you have to sell out to make $ to then be able to release the songbird of your heart, then so be it!"

    And that concludes this session of "What Jeff Thinks" theater....

    JZ
    (BTW: I went to court for what I thought was a traffic ticket today. The judge looked at me and said "Mr.Zika, you are hereby charged with 2 counts of speeding, 3 counts of resisting, and 435 counts of being a stone cold pimp" She then realized I was the shizznit and not some whack daddy G, so she released me on the grounds that I am straight up fo' real)

    (thats all the hip hop lingo I could squeeze out of my little suburban white body) :roll:

    JZ
     
  10. HiString

    HiString Guest

    ROFLMAO @ the BTW.

    Oh and BTW, Ms. Laura..........just in case you haven't chosen automatic notification in your profile, can you please check your PM's at your convenience. ;)

    :cool:
     
  11. kaverinator

    kaverinator Guest

    Hmmm. I may have opened Pandora’s Box before, but I was wondering if Jeff Z just said it all.

    By the way, where has Kurt been? Jeff Z has made refernces to him twice now, but still a no show.

    I think that Eminem might make an interesting example of “when you sing the song that was put in your heart, it doesn't matter who else likes it. If you have to sell out to make $ to then be able to release the songbird of your heart, then so be it!"

    Slim Shady, always seems to say that it is about his music, not the image (hence the trashy sweatpants and white T’s at performances). He is pretty true to the game in his rap lyrics :D , yet I hear that there is going to be a new line of Shady clothing coming out soon, Shady Limited. So has he found a pretty good balance of $ and artistry?


    BTW:
    [Though I'm not the first king of controversy
    I am the worst thing since Elvis Presley,
    To do Black Music so selfishly
    And use it to get myself wealthy (Hey)
    There's a concept that works
    20 million other white rappers emerge
    But no matter how many fish in the sea
    It'll be so empty without me]

    -Eminem
     
  12. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2002
    Location:
    77 Sunset Lane.
    I here, I just didn't have anything intelligent to say .... yeah I know, that never stopped me before....
    Actually, I haven't been able to get the computer away from my Wife. I just bought her a scanner and she's been posting pictures on a forum she moderates, http://www.gynocentric.com allllllllll daaaaaaaaaaaaay loooooong. Kurt
     

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