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Building an ELCO connection- Help!

Discussion in 'Pro Audio Equipment' started by sandbox, May 24, 2005.

  1. sandbox

    sandbox Guest

    I have been asked to retrofit a TRS snake with an ELCO connector for an old Soundcraft 2400 board.
    The schematics I received from soundcraft show the pin configuration. It says, "View from solder pin side of free connector".
    Does this mean that it shows the view from the side I insert the connectors, or the side the connectors snap into their counterparts? (I am connecting a female free connector to the snake).
    Also, the ELCO connection is for a TRS insert snake (Meaning each cable is a send AND receive (I believe)).
    Is there a way to alter this so that I can make separate send and receive cables?

    I am in a tight situation, so any help would be GREATLY appreciated!!!
     
  2. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    That is what I think the correct answer is to your question. It should have litttle tiny numbers on the connector if you look closely. Then you should be able to match the both of them up. The damn numbers are real small. Good luck
     
  3. sandbox

    sandbox Guest

    Thanks! I'll check it out.

    About rewiring it for separate send and return cables , I don't think it would be possible. The schematics show a send and return, but wouldn't a mono cable still need at least two wires inside?

    Could I connect only the ring or tip on a TRS and essentialy double my cables? And, would they not be able to be received by a mono jack?

    I know I have a lotta questions, so thanks for any help!!!
     
  4. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    1)yes
    2)no
    a mono cable needs 2 wires (hot and shield)
    a stereo cable needs 3 wires (hot, cold, & shield)
    Just keep it simple, my first 16 channel snake I wired, blew my mind right off the bat also.
    But it works great and I learned just as much as I saved$$$$$
    The worst part was looking at those tiny little numbers
    Good luck :D
     
  5. sandbox

    sandbox Guest

    Thanks so much! Yeah, I saw the tiny little letters, and they correspond with the schematic...so thanks!
    Also, thanks for the response on my other questions. Just as I expected, just wanted to be sure.

    So I guess the ELCO connector was designed to go to insert connections (Actually, the manual states a specific 24 track, 2" machine). So, I guess really, with that design, I'm limited the TRS inserts. I will deliver the news.

    Thanks again. I really appreciate the support!
     
  6. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    The ELCO connector almost 80 to 90% of the time is gonna be used not to the inserts, but rather to the direct outs. If your mixer has them? Then the other end goes to the recorder.
    Sometimes they can be wired for different things in the audio field. But usally this is what we use them for.
    I do electrical work for a living. Sometimes we see ELCO ends on equipment cords that use PLC's. (programable logic curcuits)
    But that is way different than what you are tring to do.
    Like I said, "keep it simple".
    Also don't get caught up in the wording so much, at least in this case. Because you could read something like this..."insert the 1/4" jack into the direct outs via the balanced TRS end"
    And the first two things you read in that sentence are "insert and jack". Which will start to really confuse you quickly. Because an insert jack is something completly different. 8)
     
  7. sandbox

    sandbox Guest

    Thanks so much for guiding me through this! I took this job because I have soldered cables before, but I'm not sure the purpose has been thought out.
    The ELCo connects to a Soundcraft 2400, the old 56 channel board from the 80's. I think the connection was designed to go to a VARELCO tape machine. On the schematics, for each track it shows one pin for send, one for return, and one for ground. That is why I think it is meant to go to "Insert" (Send/return on each jack) connection. The client wants to connect this ELCO to a MOTU interface for the MAC. The MOTU, like most stuff today has a separate jack for each input and output (Balanced).

    So, I don't know if the ELCO will work like a tape interface for today's applications. (It was designed for interfacing with the old 2" tape machines...remember those?) I'm gonna check out the manual for the console and see if there are "regular" jacks for the tape returns and sends, besides the ELCO.
    (ALl this after I spent a whole night removing the pins! (Just one of three snakes. The snakes are already built, just needed to swap and reconfigure connectors).

    Thanks again. For all your help, I wish I could send you a beer through cyberspace.
    I'm sure someone is working on it now!
     
  8. sandbox

    sandbox Guest

    "The ELCO connector almost 80 to 90% of the time is gonna be used not to the inserts, but rather to the direct outs. If your mixer has them? Then the other end goes to the recorder. "

    So the ELCO's usually don't act as monitors from the recorder for the "Tape monitor" section of the board, just sends to the recorder.

    Thanks!

    The wiring diagram shows a "S" a "R" and a "G" for each track. (One pin each). I can't think it would mean anything other than the kind of cable that acts as a send&receive in one.

    Thanks!!
     
  9. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    The word "sends" in your prior post, is a bad choice of word. It is a direct out. It is not sending a signal. This is why I will repeat "keeping it simple", at first. Once you get a better grip on things, you can start to see some of the more obvious practicle words and termninologies.
    Now, as a professional in the electrical field, 15 years and running. I will astest to one thing right off the back, that ALL the different companies, no matter who it is, everywhere, use different words, to mean the very same thing.
    For instance, the "S" may VERY well stand for "send"
    And the "R" for return, and of course "G" for ground. Now, the only one that is not a little confusing is the "G"
    However the "S" can mean 2 different things Send or Hot
    The "R" is either Return or Cold

    Hope some of this helps. It really is pretty easy, you just have to understand some of the vocabulary from the companies and what "they meant to mean" :lol:
     
  10. sandbox

    sandbox Guest

    Once again, I am indebted to you. Actually, my fault. Looking at it again, it DOES say "send", not "S", and "RET", not "R". Sorry.
    I appreciate your patience!!! I am staying humble through this process. I am in a city where there aren't a lot of resources for this sort of thing. (I just moved from L.A., where there is Plenty of resource, so I appreciate having your help!)

    Ultimately, the ELCO from the board is designed for "Insert" cables, like on the old school 24 track tape machines, where thecables were send & receive. I would like to be able to connect it to an interface that uses separate cables for send and receive.
    You weren't joking about keeping it simple.

    I think a big part of learning is in actually defining and explaining my needs! Just explaining myself has been an adventure.
    Thanks again!
     

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