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Can a successful (as in artistically successful) song be recorded without a shred of

Discussion in 'Recording' started by jmm22, Dec 13, 2010.

  1. jmm22

    jmm22 Guest

    R E V E R B....... ...... ..... .... ... .. . ?
  2. jmm22

    jmm22 Guest

    In a small dry room of course. It would be too simple to dismiss the question through recourse to larger and more lively rooms. :smile:
  3. Steve@Russo

    Steve@Russo Active Member

    and justice for all....
  4. BobRogers

    BobRogers Well-Known Member

    It's definitely not my style. I really like using reverb and find that using just the right reverb in just the right amount is a key to getting a song "right."

    With the said there are a few sounds that I love that have little or no natural reverb. One is a late night radio DJ. Very intimate sound. Like someone talking very close to your ear. If I was trying to accept this challenge I'd start with that and add electric bass and some synth sounds.

    Probably the best answer is, "no."
  5. Ravikash

    Ravikash Active Member

    its music, there are no rules, and there have been many high selling records, that had no reverb on the track.
  6. Space

    Space Well-Known Member

    "there have been many high selling records, that had no reverb on the track."

    Name one.

  7. mdb

    mdb Active Member

    I'd say it is possible. Depends on where the sound source is recorded, what's being recorded and ultimately, who the intended audience is.

    Can chorus, echo, or delay still be used? :)
  8. Ravikash

    Ravikash Active Member

  9. Ravikash

    Ravikash Active Member

    The first two Beatle records, released in the UK had no reverb, the American versions had reverb added to them. Johnny Cash's Folsom Prison record, didn't have a drop of reverb added to it. You've got to remember reverb is simply just a tool you use to make music. Thinking it is necessary to use reverb for a song to be successful is like thinking you need to use a piano in a song to make it sell well. Reverb has absolutely nothing to do with the sales of any record, I never once heard a bunch of people buying a popular album because they really like the reverb. Reverb is just a trend, a tool, and a sound, it doesn't constitute success. In some music it would be inappropriate to add reverb. Also if you look at virtually every high selling rap album many of those tracks have little to no reverb. Reverb is only necessary if the song calls for it. If you are a professional Producer or engineer, you add reverb because its appropriate for the sound, its a conscious decision, just like what lyrics to put into a song. For example, if you were recording in a orchestral hall, to capture an orchestras performance, it would be considered a mortal sin to add reverb. The people who record that music, set up a few choice mics in the room, with a few choice pre-amps, and record. I only know this because I know a guy who is currently up for a few grammys for his classical recordings. I hope that helps.
  10. Space

    Space Well-Known Member

    Reverb is an artifact of a room's properties...so it isn't, to me, specifically an electronic device it is a simple process to electronically re-produce what specific rooms can create but not every room can sound like. :)

    anyway, it was kind of a trick question :)
  11. BobRogers

    BobRogers Well-Known Member

    Sam Phillips made a record in 1955 with no reverb??? He must have used his supply up on all of his other records. I'll have to check this out.

    UPDATE: Well if the is no reverb on this sample then there were some interesting rooms in 706 Union Avenue.
  12. TheJackAttack

    TheJackAttack Distinguished Member

    This is generally true, but it depends on the hall in which the orchestra is being recorded. In the 50's orchestras would frequently "borrow" a hall that was known to sound great. The original configuration of Orchestra Hall in Chicago is an example of this (prior to the first remodel). This died off in the 1980's due to budgetary concerns. Today, it would not be anathema to add some additional reverb if the Music Director and RE/ME decided it was warranted. Does it happen very often? Not so much, but more than one might think with us purist long hairs.

    I return you to your regularly scheduled discussion.
  13. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    Where ever did you get this information? This sounds exactly like internet half-truth. The FACT is, EMI was famous the world over for their echo chambers in the basement of Abbey Road. And with the use of what they called the STEED system they were able to add a tape generated pre-delay to the chambers signal. They were the innovators of this technology which is so commonplace today and YES this sytem was ON the entire time the Beatles recorded ANYTHING. There were tapeops assigned to the tape machine controlling the predelay signal to the chambers.

    As for the popularity due to such an effect, MANY artists recorded their records at Abbey Road simply because of the unique and very identifiable sound of the studio and its gear. So, in a way, people did buy records based on the reverb of a room.

    As for adding reveb to a classical recording, if you think its just a matter of throwing up a "few choice mics" with a "few choice pre-amps" and bang, thats the ticket, you have a lot to learn.

    We have a number of engineers who frequent these pages who record this type of music almost exclusively, and hopefully they will see this and show you the errors of your thinking. Yes, there is , on occasion, reveb added to a classical mix. Sometimes to fill in the bloom in a room with uneven acoustics and perhaps a variety of reverb lengths within the hall itself.

    As far as a "mortal sin", the only thing I can think of there is playing the devils interval in praise music.
  14. BobRogers

    BobRogers Well-Known Member

    Adding reverb to a classical recording has been marked down to a venal sin. Couple of Hail Marys and you are good to go.
  15. BobRogers

    BobRogers Well-Known Member

    I wrote a pretty good blues communion song called "Thirteen at the Table" that has flated fifths all over the place, so it had better not be mortal.

    Bonus math question: Does anyone know WHY the tritone is the Devil's interval?
  16. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    Thanks Bob. Its good to know I can take the gaffers tape off that fret.

    I'm guessing....Played in order they are all descending sixths? Like I said....a guess.
  17. Ravikash

    Ravikash Active Member

    Talking about reverb gets a little philosophical in that sense, because when do we not here Reverberations, because that is what you are talking about, the phrase room sound comes to mind when you talk about reverb in that sense, and people put up room mics, to record the natural reverberations in the studio, so thats a good point is the question about room sound or reverb, because technically delays are a reverb as well. Not all reverbs model a room, and those that do are called Impulse Response, or convulsion reverb which is the simulation of the reverberation of a physical or virtual space. Because even if there is a room mic, or the room sound was involved with the mic positioning, some people will still call it a dry recording. I have pulled up recordings for people where all I used where room mics in the recording to create space, and they asked me if I was keeping the mix dry, so in that sense what constitutes reverb?
  18. Space

    Space Well-Known Member

    "Reverberation [reverb] is the persistence of sound in a particular space after the original sound is removed..." in the literary sense, now to what end the OP referred is out of my mental control. But I am thinking, and also seeing support here, that you have to take the rooms ability to color as well as the potential coloration from electronic or other external devices to completely cover reverb in respect to what gets printed on an audio track.

    But if the clarification is that reverb, in this sense, is confined to electronic devices, that would be fair to me...since I didn't start the post anyway :)
  19. Space

    Space Well-Known Member

    ...and if I can take this one step farther, two things: the complete removal of room based, mic placement technique or artificial reverb in an attempt to record would make listening a difficult process for the human since we by nature are used to hearing the spatial enhancements that are a direct process of our environment.

    And then you cannot replay any recording that will not be somehow affected by where you are listening to it. The main reason a control room and tracking room are given a different rt60 [if applicable] or at least the two rooms are different in nature aimed at this exact phenomenon that is a simple by-product of hard boundaries.

    Carly Simon recorded vocals in a hard tiled bathroom for this effect alone...she among many others.

    But like I said, isn't my question...just some random thoughts in a random day :)
  20. Link555

    Link555 Well-Known Member

    OK I will bite,whats the answer Bob?

    I still like to use real room tone first before I add simulated reverb

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