1. Register NOW and become part of this fantastic knowledge base forum! This message will go away once you have registered.

audio "Compassion" Donny Mix & Bigtree Finish

Discussion in 'Fix This MIX!' started by DonnyThompson, Apr 26, 2014.

  1. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    This is a pre-release version of a song a client of mine has recently recorded at my place.
    I produced, engineered, performed and mixed, and then sent the 2 mix to Chris for his Mojo. He did an outstanding job.

    Compassion was originally written and recorded by Todd Rundgren. This current cover version sounds nothing like the original, which was released in 1981 and was heavily laden with analog synths that were popular at the time.

    (Dead Link Removed)

    (Dead Link Removed)

    Session Details: ( for those who care ;) LOL)
    Recorded at A.I.R. Productions
    Akron, OH, USA
    3/1/2014 - 3/15/2014
    Mixed 4/04/2014

    ©1981 Todd Rundgren
    Warner-Tamerlane Publishing

    Artist: Terry Fairfax
    Engineer/Producer: Donny Thompson

    Terry Fairfax: Piano, lead vocals, B3 and synths
    Donny Thompson: Drums, Bass, Guitars, Backing Vox

    Production Chain:

    Lead Vocals - AKG 414EB
    Backing Vox - Neumann U89i, AKG 414EB

    Pre amp/Audio I/O: Tascam 1640

    Keyboards: VSTi's by NI and Garritan
    Bass Guitar: Hoffner
    Guitars: Fender Tele (U.S.), Nylon string acoustic (recorded with 414)
    Fender HotRod DeVille 4x10
    Drums: Yamaha, Senn 421's and Shure 57's, 414EB's (2) on Overheads
    Various other Synth Drums: BFD

    Platform: Recorded in Sonar, Mixed with Harrison MixBus

    Chris will have to provide the details as to the processing chain he used on his end. ;)

    Thoughts, critiques, discussion... all welcome.




    (Dead Link Removed)
  2. ouzo77

    ouzo77 Active Member

    It sounds great. Really nice and smooth.

    Just two things. The piano stands out a bit. It feels to me like it's before the vocals. Maybe just a little. And the drums could be a bit louder. But that could be just me being a drummer... ;-)
  3. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    LOL.. Chris picked up on the piano as well, Ouzo.

    My ears are pretty gone on this one after hearing it so many times. I'll let Chris post an updated version with that correction if he wants.

    Thanks for listening. :)
  4. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    (NOTE, I got two tracks on this which were (background music and Vox). So, my hands were tied there.. )

    How fun seeing this here, beautiful song and performance by Terry Fairfax. Nice harmonies done by you too Donny. Stellar IMHO.

    I just tweaked and uploaded Master2 of this version. See what you think? Maybe you like it better? I felt the keyboard intro was a touch bright on those two spots.

    I agree on the drums as well. This was already mixed (no drum tracks for me) so I couldn't do it justice. If I had the drum track on this now, wow. !
    The Vox is a bit low for me as well, but that's taste. I tend to push vox to the max.

    Here is the tweaked version. What do you think?

  5. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    BTW, this is a great example how people (engineers, clients) can work well together online.
  6. ouzo77

    ouzo77 Active Member

    Yeah, the vocals could be a bit louder. But I'm more on the "better too low than too loud"-side.
    Anyway, great work!
  7. ouzo77

    ouzo77 Active Member

    I couldn't listen to the second version yet. I'm posting from my cell phone right now.
  8. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    I re wrote the link. Try it again.

  9. ouzo77

    ouzo77 Active Member

    No, I meant I didn't try it because I'm on the cell phone. Sorry...
  10. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    Donny, was the original I had to work with in an MP3 too? Not full bandwidth?
  11. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    Gottcha (y)

    Donny, I'd love to post the original. Could we somehow?
    Not to make a comparison between you and I, but, to show how far Pro Audio has come, and what we can do with a rig like mine including how engineers or clients can work online with each other.
    I'm sure you could word this much better too ;)
  12. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    Sorry guys, I was playing a show in Cleveland last night and was gone after 4 yesterday. I'll see what I can find sometime today... or, I'll just break down the original project file into stems and upload them to Chris. ;)

    The original was a 16 bit wav file. Actually, come to think of it, I might have rendered it at 24. I can't recall at the moment.

    These comments are exactly why someone should post their work, IMHO. It's beneficial to gain the perceptions of other listeners, to listen to ideas, to take the critiques and consider them. You might not always take the advice or agree with the critiques, after all, personal taste is involved and it become a matter of subjectivity... but it's nice to at least consider what your peers have to say.

    This might be one of the reasons that those occasional posts that show up in the songs/tracks/collaboration forums - those with no description or intent of purpose - irks me as much as they do. The work seems to be posted to either brag, or, to up a view/listen count on another media site.

    New ideas and suggestions from other artists are a great artistic tool to have at your disposal. And, like so many other engineers, writers and performers here, I'm certainly not immune to burn-out after listening to the same track over and over. It's great to have fresh ears listen and critique.

    I'm not posting music to brag, or to show everyone how many pushups I can do. It's not about that - at least for me. It's about presenting music for my peers to listen to and critique. And while I've been at this for quite a few years now, I'm of the mind set that we should never stop learning, never stop listening, no matter what your experience or knowledge level is in this craft of ours. If I wanted someone to tell me how great I was, I'd just play it for my mom. LOL ;)

  13. ouzo77

    ouzo77 Active Member

    I've just listened to both version. The differences are so subtle it was hard to tell the difference. But I think I liked the first one better.
    Though my room isn't really optimized... so maybe it's just guessing.
  14. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    The more I listen to it, the more I agree with both your opinions regarding the drums. Funny thing is... I'm a drummer too... So you'd think that I'd have mixed them hotter than I did... but for whatever reason, I didn't. I tucked them back to where I thought they should be. It may have been audio burn out, at least partially, but honestly, I didn't want them thundering through the mix. If you listen to songs like Ambrosia's How Much I Feel, or Hall and Oate's She's Gone, this was the type of vibe I was going for. I think I may have over compensated, though.

    Chris, do you want me to re open this project file and send you dry stems? It's up to you buddy. I don't know how much time you want to put into this, you've already done such fantastic work...I hesitate to ask for any more of your valuable time.
    If you do, let me know what you want and how you want them... individual tracks? stems?

    FWIW, here are links to the two songs I referenced above, just so you guys can get an idea of what I was roughly going for...not to steal production or anything, just to cop a style and a vibe.

    Ambrosia - How Much I Feel

    Hall And Oates - She's Gone
  15. RemyRAD

    RemyRAD Guest

    Yeah... very nice. You nailed it!

    Just like Ambrosia. Just like Hall and Oates.

    And you use a 21st-century TEAC to get that? Amazing what you can do when you have talent.

    What do I need this old stuff for?

    The old woman.
  16. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    I think is sounds great but I would mix this again if you have the stems for sure. It would be fun seeing what we come up with like that too. What ever you think.
  17. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    Donny, just returned from the lake and was thinking about this pretty intense for you. Listening to both " Ambrosia and Hall and Oates." you really have this sound down well. H and O are one of my favourites bands of the 80's.

    The drums are still weaker but not by much. Is it worth re doing? I will for sure its not a problem, its a pleasure.
    I think a subtle lift in the snare and kick would do wonders but it might never make a difference to the listener and I may never get it where you have the rest of this, hard to say, but I'm game. I'm might do it wonders too.

    Pop today is about three components. Big kick, Bass and VOX. Just so you know, thats not what I'm thinking. I would be going for Hall and Oats.
  18. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Distinguished Member

    Well... I'm gonna leave it up to you. If you think that a remix would make a noticeable improvement, then I'm happy to send stems. I've lost so much objectivity on this by now that I need to trust your ears more than I do my own. ;)

    If we are going to do this though, was there anything else about my initial mix that you didn't like? Anything glaring that you considered to be a deal breaker?

    I guess what I'm saying is that if you heard this as a commercial release, is there anything that would make you whince, would there be any part of it that you would take exception to, or make you wonder "WTF were they thinking?"
  19. audiokid

    audiokid Staff

    Other than everything mentioned, its beautiful to me.
  20. ouzo77

    ouzo77 Active Member

    Everything else is fine.

Share This Page