1. Register NOW and become part of this fantastic knowledge base forum! This message will go away once you have registered.

Fixing a guitar - in a major way

Discussion in 'Guitars' started by the_gid, Jun 25, 2005.

  1. the_gid

    the_gid Guest

    Hi, I know that this isn't really relevant to recording guitar as such - however I know that the pool of knowledge here at RO is ENORMOUS!

    I have this guitar (which I'm led to believe is quite rare- however I may be wrong)

    BUT, the guy who had it before the guy I bought it off, modded it to sh*t, badly.

    I want to give this girl a more SG style set-up, electronically (NOT visually), and get it sounding sweet. However - the dude who modded it routed out some rather disgusting HoLeS for the pickups he put in it, and a nasty big gash where this ancient looking floyd rose trem 'wannabe' bridge was sitting. I have since removed this and the pickup surrounds, which were also makeshift. - the previous pickups did not sit properly either.

    you may notice from the pictures that the hardware on the body is a little scruffy, volume nob missing, selector switches scruffy etc. All of which is easily replaceable. However I know nothing of changing the set-up of the electronics.

    I also would like to refinish the wood to a dark stain.

    I've successfully fitted/refitted pickups and so on in the past, so I reckon It shouldn't be THAT difficult to sort out by myself - I just need some advice.

    ANY HELP/IDEAS/SUGGESTIONS/ANYTHING?!


    ps. here are the pics:
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/front.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/frontzoom1.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/frontzoom2.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/frontdiy1.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/frontdiy2.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/frontdiy3.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/frontdiy4.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/switches.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/electrics1.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/electrics2.JPG
     
  2. killersoundz

    killersoundz Guest

    holy macaroni!!!!!! warwick!!!!!!!! WOW what an absolute amazing guitar. 26 frets!!!!!!!! 26 ^#$%ing frets. wow man mail it to me hahah
     
  3. tmcconnell

    tmcconnell Guest

    don't

    I'd punt. Get rid of it. For a million reasons. Its been cut up, abused by an idiot. The big issue is not the pickup routes because you can make a plate to cover those, but if the bridge you select does not seat correctly on the body you will have a mess.

    You might consider getting a 2tek bridge which has a massive route, and is so heavy it might work with a less than perfect joint to the body.

    Consider hiring a very good professional. I would recommend Pete Baer at Voodoo guitars, or Chris Meade. They will be able to computer route a custom repair for the new bridge, or fill the hole with epoxy and sawdust and remount a bridge. It will not be cheap. Also, they may simply refuse to do the work. The risks are huge when re-routing an already messed up bridge route. Wood and epoxy expand and contract at different rates.

    Basses in Particular fail in a bad way if any joint is not perfect, due to high energy low frequency resonances.

    Another option would be to salvage the neck and get another body from Warmouth. That would be cheaper in the end and you might get a better body than the one you have, and the fit and finish would be perfect, assuming your luthier put the neck on right.
     
  4. killersoundz

    killersoundz Guest

    tmcconnell, thats not a bass guitar...

    I 2nd the suggestion about getting a new body. That neck is amazing, but the body looks pretty chopped up, after actually inspecting the photos. The bridge is some old school locking tremolo. Definitely not a floyd rose but probably could be changed to a floyd rose. I didnt pay attention to see if there are pivot screws in there but i'd just say to get a new body. If all else fails i'll buy it off of you.
     
  5. the_gid

    the_gid Guest

    hehe yeah I know, it's cool as f*ck - look at the back plate - also notice that because it has a floyd rose style bridge in it that the strings don't come through the body of the guitar.. SO WHY THE HELL IS THERE A BACK PLATE?? - underneath it is a rectangle outline of where a cavity used to be
    but it is filled in with a big hunk of wood, very neatly.

    This to me says that the idiot who chewed the body up filled this hole in - like a dick! - so he could put his screwy bridge in.

    anyway - take a look:
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/back.JPG
    http://www.rgstott.f2s.com/warwick/plate.JPG

    ps. I've searched and searched for info on this guitar on the internet and can't find ANYTHING!
    pps. Is the damage really that bad?? I only paid £100 ($180 approx) for it, the owner was a family friend and I was quite young when I bought it so he took pity on me with the price ;)
     
  6. verbass

    verbass Active Member

    The Damage to this guitar can be repaired but it takes an inordinate amount of patience and compromise. First the bridge is an old Kahler "Drop In" tremolo system once quite popular in the eighties. They required an extensive body cavity, there once was either a Floyd Or Fender style Bridge on this instrument the plugs in the cavity are evidence of that. If you are going to completely repaint the body with a solid colour then you can fill the holes with a similar wood the body is made of make it as tight fit as possible ,
    use a good hide glue , then take a mix of 50% isopropyl alcohol and glycerin put a few drops along the edges of the plugs and allow the alcohol to evaporate (the Glycerin Makes the wood expand so it will snug up raelly well), let the glue dry and sand smooth.
    You can then re route the cavities as you need .
    REMEMBER THIS TECHNIQUE TAKES TIME SO BE PATIENT.
    You can only do this if you're willing to lose the transparent finish
    the other option is to get another Kahler trem and drop it in new pick ups and a pick guard blank and cut a custom pick gaurd.

    Lots Of Luck
     
  7. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    I've built a guitar or two. And the only thing I would say is... If you spent (roughly) $180 bucks on it.
    It stills sounds like it might need another $200 to $300 maybe a little more money invested in it. And what if after that you are not 100% happy with it? Then you've sunk $500 or $600 dollars in the guitar and wish you have just bought something sweet to begin with.
    Price it up! See if you want to take the risk, reguardless you can bet you will learn something. Or maybe the price is too much to fix it up, and another route would be better for you to get the guitar you want in the end.
     
  8. Tommy P.

    Tommy P. Well-Known Member

    Yeah, definitley e*b*y those remnants. Take the money and build your dream axe from Warmoth or USAG parts. We're in a golden age of do-it-yourself guitar building, and there's so many great custom suppliers around.
     
  9. killersoundz

    killersoundz Guest

    Floyd rose tremolos require a back plate and a cavity for the tension springs and adjustments to those. That style of bridge relies on equal tension and it's pretty cool how they work but it gets to be dumb. if you need to know anymore about those just ask.
     
  10. the_gid

    the_gid Guest

    yeah, i'm not interested in using a floyd rose...

    I am interested in using either, another Kahler, or a Tune-o-matic like on my sg voodoo (i think tune-o-matic is what it's called).

    I figured I could use a small scratch plate over the bridge cavity to fix the tune-o-matic to. Or would this not be strong enough?
     
  11. the_gid

    the_gid Guest

    in fact I think the 2mm deep edge before the cavity would be available for screwing in to... perhaps i'd only have to fill that edge upto body level..?

    also, is it conceivable to fill the entire bridge cavity?
     
  12. gambit

    gambit Active Member

    If you're serious about keeping the guitar then it might be worth your while having a word with my friend Paul at Arrowhead Guitars (http://www.arrowheadguitars.co.uk/). He knows his wood (oo-er!) and will give you a very honest opinion on what will need to be done.

    I picked up a rare Ibanez that was battered to sh*t, he transformed it into a beaut!

    Good luck!

    G
     
  13. SonOfSmawg

    SonOfSmawg Well-Known Member

    I have this guitar (which I'm led to believe is quite rare- however I may be wrong)

    The back plate says it all ... handcrafted for a Russian named Gorinich V. in 1991 by Warwick. It's a 1-of-a-kind custom instrument.

    I've successfully fitted/refitted pickups and so on in the past, so I reckon It shouldn't be THAT difficult to sort out by myself - I just need some advice.

    Refitting pickups is childsplay compared to the proper repair needed on this instrument. Unless you have damn good woodworking skills and a lot of time and patience, don't even attempt it.

    WHY THE HELL IS THERE A BACK PLATE?? - underneath it is a rectangle outline of where a cavity used to be
    but it is filled in with a big hunk of wood, very neatly.


    No doubt this was done by the guy who did the chainsaw massacre on this. I wouldn't trust it for a second. In fact, I wouldn't doubt that the wood he put in there is from a scrap 2X4. The "repair" will need to be removed and properly repaired when the trem cavity is repaired.

    The Damage to this guitar can be repaired but it takes an inordinate amount of patience and compromise. First the bridge is an old Kahler "Drop In" tremolo system once quite popular in the eighties. They required an extensive body cavity, there once was either a Floyd Or Fender style Bridge on this instrument the plugs in the cavity are evidence of that. If you are going to completely repaint the body with a solid colour then you can fill the holes with a similar wood the body is made of make it as tight fit as possible ,
    use a good hide glue , then take a mix of 50% isopropyl alcohol and glycerin put a few drops along the edges of the plugs and allow the alcohol to evaporate (the Glycerin Makes the wood expand so it will snug up raelly well), let the glue dry and sand smooth.


    That's pretty close. You will need to route-out the entire bridge section, inclusive of both the original and replacement bridges, so that the cavity you create can be patched with a single block of maple. Cut the patch to fit snugly into your routed cavity. Use a good wood glue, not white glue. As I previously mentioned, you will also need to repair that patch under the back plate with a single block of maple.

    I figured I could use a small scratch plate over the bridge cavity to fix the tune-o-matic to. Or would this not be strong enough?

    No, not at all.

    in fact I think the 2mm deep edge before the cavity would be available for screwing in to... perhaps i'd only have to fill that edge upto body level..?

    Again, no. The repair should be done properly or not at all.

    Once the patches are complete, and sanded even, the entire guitar will need to be sanded-down and refinished. The patches will stick-out like sore thumbs if you try to stain it, so it will need to be painted. Your call here, but if it were me, I'd put that back plate back on it after it's been refinished, because it has the guitar's info on it. Some new gold screws to attach it would be nice.

    I would use either a Badass 1-piece bridge on it, or a tonepros bridge with a stop tailpiece. I would not suggest trying to route-out your new patch for yet another trem, as a good trem mod takes special care, and should be done by a luthier with experience in doing it.

    Replacing the body is NOT an option. This is a nech-through-body design guitar. To salvage the neck and rebuild a body around it would cost more than having a new custom guitar built.

    Selling this guitar as-is (or for parts) on ebay would net you very little. Having it repaired by a GOOD luthier would cost you BIG bucks, so unless this guitar has some deep sentimental value, it really is not worth the expense. The true value of this guitar really lies with you ... and whether or not you are willing to do what it takes to repair it properly.

    As for the electronics ... you can either use the pickups that came with it, or replace them. There are 3 holes in the body, so it would be wise to go with master volume, master tone, and a 3-way switch. The parts are easily available online, as are the schematics to wire it up. A quick Google search will get that for you.

    There is much more that could be said and done, but those are the basics ... ball's in your court.

    Good Luck!

    Michael
    Guitar teacher
    Founder and former moderator of this Guitar & Bass Forum
    Former site administrator of recording.org
    Long-winded bastard
     
  14. the_gid

    the_gid Guest

    THANKYOU! Michael, That's exactly what I needed info/advise-wise.. I think I will fork out to have this guitar brought back to the realms of playability.. when that happens tho is a different matter all together.. I'm hanging on to it for a little while longer. :D
     

Share This Page