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How to make pro sound with the Firepod!?, Soundclip...

Discussion in 'Recording' started by marsvolta, May 21, 2005.

  1. marsvolta

    marsvolta Guest

    I'm the happy owner of a Firepod, after I got it working correctly, though.
    I'm wondering if I've got the neccessary gear for doing real pro audio.

    I have my iMac G4 1.25, which handles applications such as Logic and Cubase very well. I use for the recording of kickdrum a Beta 52, for the snare a Shure SM57, besides these two mics I've used two Shure SM57'ere as overheads, 4 mics !
    It seems to me that the mics are fine, maybe the SM57's arent very appropriated as overheads, but I've also used two AGK condenser mics on another project, and the sound is somewhat similiar, so the pro sound isn't absent because of different overheads, that's not the deal <- I think it's something in the mixing...

    But, what am I doing wrong? Here's a clip I've recorded with the setup;

    http://state-of-art.net/anders/Via Wonder.mp3

    The drums are compressed with af standard comprosser of Logic plus they are EQ'ed. The vocals in 1. vers is 3 vocals at the same time, one track with a lot compression and EQ, another simple and plain. third another male voice, also quite plain with a little compression.. I think the sound is "okay", but I'm missing something...


    Hope you have some constructive comments wich I can use to improve my sound !

    Regards marsvolta
     
  2. stickers

    stickers Active Member

    i think the compressor on the drums are pumping too much especially on the cymbals . very good start though.
     
  3. YamahaAndy

    YamahaAndy Guest

    I heard the demo clip you had posted. Overall it was an inspring peace of music, nice drums! I started thinking about how to improve the sound.

    I think the compressor effect on the drums is applied too heavily causing pumping delay especially on the cymbal. I would also exchange the cymbal into some other better sounding one, for instance a good Zildjan.

    The weak point in this mix I would say is both the bass sound in itself and the low ends of the frequency range. I also think the bass drum is miced wrong. It all sounds muddy. It might help by using cutoff techniques and increasing the distance of the mic/lowering the bass setting for bass drum. The muddyness might partly also be caused by the ADC and DAC quality of the Firepod.

    In order to get a pro quality sound from here you need to improve the mixing techniques. The bass drum and the cymbals need to sound better. Also experiment with a pro level reverb when it comes to the overall mix. However, even though you would follow my advice I think some of the muddyness will still be there. So I would recommend you to update the ADC and DAC as soon as possible. Try finding a good Apogee like for instance the Rosetta series.

    But you have a good platform to work on! Nice job and thanks for the clip you posted!
     
  4. YamahaAndy

    YamahaAndy Guest

    Also try using another bass+amp+mic combination.
     
  5. YamahaAndy

    YamahaAndy Guest

    BTW, I think the Firepod sounds a little better than my RME Fireface...
     
  6. KyroJoe

    KyroJoe Guest

    For starters, your "oopsie" at 9-10 seconds just kills the whole
    tune for me!
    You really need to FIX THAT! Reversed sample?

    In fact, you can do better on the whole intro with a few simple corrections. (left is weaker than right)
    If it is YOUR song then remember to make an instantly recognizable intro.
    (mistake free ! :) )
    A listener will usually recognize great songs within the first 5 seconds.
    I would consider eliminating or re-working some of the repetative bulk
    of the tune as well.

    Try muting the first fraction of a second of the song to eliminate
    the hi mid noise from the gain boosting before the count-in.
    However, some creative EQ work at 1.5KHz - 6.5KHz and gain reduction
    could make it an interesting way to start.

    When you were recording into the Firepod it also sounds like you
    had some clips! You've really got to watch on a Firepod that
    you DON'T get any red LEDs with even a quick or slight glow.
    Instant artifact & distortion!
    You'll need to clean up the clicks.

    A little creative panning (filling in the void between center and
    hard left and right) will smooth out some of the "L-R channel pumping",
    which will be quite irritating to any listeners using headphones (think iPOD!).

    The cymbal sound and technique don;t do it for me. Try getting the drummer
    to play cymbals softer, rather that smashing them and carving drumsticks
    to toothpicks. They record better that way too!

    The OH's are being overcompressed & they're breaking up in
    the original recording a little too much for my liking.
    Try a decent tube-based mic pre and condensers.

    Vocals are a touch off center with a slight favor to the right.

    Other than that quick review and my fatigue-eared 2 cents, I'd say you're
    off to a very decent start.






    KJ
    ------------
    Kyro Studios
     
  7. marsvolta

    marsvolta Guest

    thanks...

    Thank you all for your replies!

    I'm the drummer myself, so I can ask myself if I could smash the cymbals a bit softer ! ;) The cymbals áre good cymbals, actually good Ziljdians, AC 14" and 15"... I think the whole cymbal thing is caused by bad overhead micing... (the OH's where just above both cymbals..)

    KyroJoe, I'm totally aware of the many guitar mistakes.. man, did I really miss to tell you that ?! :O sorry... That's gonna be fixed ! The vocal track needs a re-recording also...

    But OK, I'll try to eliminate the pumping effect from the compressor, reduce the crash-cymbal sound, and play around with the EQ on the bass and maybe some panning effects !

    It was really helpful guys !

    Thanks again all !

    marsvolta
     
  8. KyroJoe

    KyroJoe Guest

    MV,


    No problem! Happy to help.
    Post again when you've got things as you want them.
    I'd love to hear it!





    KJ
    ---------------
    Kyro Studios
     
  9. killersoundz

    killersoundz Guest

    Usually the sound of the cymbals depends on the room. Cymbals always seem to sound so much better in a live room rather then a dead room. Yeah probably the only thing with this mix is the compressor on the drums. cut that. I would've also like to have heard a more upfront snare sound. I doubt you had the mic very close to the snare.
     
  10. marsvolta

    marsvolta Guest

    the room, the snare...

    The room was dead as hell, but the mic was close to the drum !

    I've now eliminated the use of compressor on drums, and in fact it sounds good !
    But I'm still missing the PRO audio... the depth, clarity and power of the individual instruments and their relationship with each other in the mix.

    Maybe I can accentuate my point by another observation I've made.
    When I listen to electro rock or just anything electronic music, the synthetic/computer made sounds/audio still have the PRO sound. But even when I use computer-generated samples and audio I'm not getting the sound I want, the sound that pro's make. In that case the recording is not the problem, because the samples are of like 100% good quality... Hope you understand my issue ! :)
     

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