I need help finding the right console!!!

Discussion in 'Location Recording' started by bombitty, May 20, 2011.

  1. bombitty

    bombitty Active Member

    I'm in a pinch. I'm reaching out to you strangers on the internet for help with my research project.

    Situation: a church has consulted you on the purchase of a new console for their main room. This church uses a medium sized performance group during their services. The console will be required to provide sound for the main room as well as several on stage monitor systems as well as live stereo recording. You have been asked to provide the musical director 2 options. One of which would be a console that provides the basic requirements and should be a lower cost. The other would allow for expansion and possible multi-track recording in the future. Other requirements as below.

    1. at least 24 mic. inputs and up to 32
    2. stereo mix outputs for PA and stereo recording
    3. 2 or 3 pre-fader aux's for monitors system
    4. 2 post fader effects sends
    5. adequate EQ.
    6. +4 dBv operational level
    7. the multi-trk option needs to have a combination of bus and direct outputs to record drums, bass, piano, 2 guitars, brass section (2 trumpets, 2 trombones) and at least 4 solos vocals and stereo chorus micing. (i think that would add up to 24)
    8. Price cap at $25,000

    I'm not asking for you to do my project for me, just please aid me in my search for consoles. every site I've been to either doesn't include enough information, or just doesn't meet all requirements.
  2. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

    Not knowing your location, where you've been looking, or what recording medium you want to use:

    Here are just a few of the many choices I'm familiar with that have everything you want, comfortably below your budget.
    24-56 Channel count / Stereo Main Outs + Bus Outs + Mix Matrix Outs / 6-10 Auxes / Analog Direct Outs on every mic input

    Analog: Soundcraft Live 8, GB4, GB8, or MH2
    Analog: Allen-Heath GL2800, GL3800, or ML3000

    Digital: Presonus StudioLive24 can record up to 24 tracks via firewire or analog direct outs - if you use the firewire to link two of them together for 48 channels FOH you will need to use the analog direct outs on each channel to some other recording device.

    The A-H GS-R24 also looks very interesting for recording, but I don't know how well it's suited to the live mixing world. And as far as I know it's not expandable beyond 24 mic inputs without cascading 2 mixers together.

    Best of luck.
  3. Boswell

    Boswell Moderator Distinguished Member

    Dvdhawk has a lot of experience in this area, and has suggested some good choices for higher-end systems.

    There are lots of ways to go with this one. One thing you have to take into account is how much part-timers will be operating the system, since this affects the amount of training needed. A digital desk is going to give you a bit more for the money, but is not as straightforward to operate as a fully-analog desk. On the other hand, a digital desk having protected push-button presets for sermon, hymns, small music group, full band etc can spare you and the rest of the congregation from gross mix errors.

    An alternative but adequate low-cost system could be put together for about half your max budget. This might be a (digital) Yamaha 01V96VCM, 3 off 8-channel ADAT-output external pre-amps, and an Alesis HD24 for 24-track recording. Using this, you could mix 32 mono channels from a choice of 40 inputs in addition to 4 stereo effect returns. You would have 4 aux outputs in the base system (selectable pre- or post-fader) for monitoring and/or external effect units, with another 4 more available to feed the internal effects or be sent to external D-A units.
  4. bombitty

    bombitty Active Member

    Thank you so very much! I used your recommendations (specifically the GB8 and the A-H GS-R24) and passed with flying colors!
    On a side note: This project was my instructor's way of providing an easy way to fulfill our school's requirement of one research project per quarter; since he feels the alternative, writing a xxxx word essay about the history of stereo recording or some other thing, doesn't necessarily teach much about actual audio engineering. This is the reason why the information provided was at a minimum.
  5. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

    I'm glad to hear I passed the class with flying colors.

    Thanks for wasting my time.

    I'll gladly help someone volunteering to help with church sound. I'm not interested in taking an a/v course to garner a virtually worthless diploma. Good luck getting a job (in any field) with no knowledge, no ambition to learn, and no work-ethic.

  6. MadMax

    MadMax Well-Known Member

    Thank you! - for being such a smarmy little spineless twit.

    You'll do fine as a lying, back stabbing, worthless piece of crap sales weasel at Banjo Mart... You should make a management position pretty quick.

    (and you guys wonner why the old farts around here are worried about the future of the industry, when so few have ANY ethics at all??)
  7. bombitty

    bombitty Active Member

    never intended to mislead or backstab anyone. i clearly said it was for a RESEARCH PROJECT.

    no matter what kind of $*^t you talk about me, I still appreciate the help.
    way to read. that is all.
  8. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

    And that is how a typical church functions, they appoint someone (who may or may not know the first thing about sound and sound gear) to research their options.

    Although I appreciated the sincere PM, the tone of this post kinda undermines that warm fuzzy moment. Like I said in my reply, if you want help with a school project - it will change the response to help you learn how to find the information, and see what methods you used (and how you might improve).

    And here's one more of little bit of absolutely free advice; If you're serious about being a professional in any related business, it's all about networking on some level. Burning bridges is rarely going to be in your best interest. When you pull a boner, take your medicine and move on. Of the people who succeed in the music business, very few of them are 'thin-skinned'.


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