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KICK MICS - if you

Discussion in 'Drums' started by BassLiK, Nov 20, 2010.

  1. BassLiK

    BassLiK Active Member

    I have the AKG D122, BETA 52, & the AUDIX D6, if you had to let one go for other gear investment, which one would be the easiest to let go?, thanks
     
  2. Steve@Russo

    Steve@Russo Active Member

  3. TheJackAttack

    TheJackAttack Distinguished Member

    You can't have too many microphones. Just keep saving. If you need to rent a mic to fill a gap short term that would be better. That said, no one needs three kick drum mic's. Keep the Shure and save for an original AKG D12 which is completely different than the 122. The Audix could be used on floor toms as well so I guess if you had to pick one then I'd pick the 122 to sell.
     
  4. Spase

    Spase Active Member

    I would get rid of them all and get an EV RE-20. I actually just purchased one a few months ago for 2 purposes; micing kick drum live or in the studio, and recording audio theater. It works GREAT for both. Also, from my experience running live sound, my favorite of the "kick drum mics" - meaning mics made for the purpose of micing a kick and nothing else - I prefer the EV ND 868. I prefer the RE20 now over that, and it so much more than a kick drum mic.
     
  5. VIGUIER

    VIGUIER Active Member

    I have the Beta 52 and the Audix D6 ( and the Senheiser for the Kick, I don't remember its name ). I use always the Audix outside the kick and the beta 91 in the kick ( so two mics for the kick ).
    Paul
     
  6. BassLiK

    BassLiK Active Member

    I'm sorry for the typo, I meant the AKG d112, not 122 (LOL), so can we agree with others that I really don't need all three mics as far a kick drum mic?, how hard is it to purchase a AKG d12?, I imagine it would have to be ebay or something.
     
  7. MadMax

    MadMax Well-Known Member

    Unless a mic doesn't get used in 3-5 years, NEVER get rid of one. Keep the affliction of GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome) alive and well by ADDING to your collection.

    I've used all of the mic's mentioned at one time or another... and used none of them; based upon the merits of each mic's sonic character.

    I've used just about every mic in the locker for kick/drums... to wit; I do my best to use the mic and mic placement to capture the sound that best serves the song/musical style I'm tracking.
     
  8. TheJackAttack

    TheJackAttack Distinguished Member

    ROFL! Once you get GAS it can never be removed!
     
  9. BobRogers

    BobRogers Well-Known Member

    I have a D112 and can't seem to make it work. I keep hearing from people who like it for kick, floor tom, guitar cab. Somehow I can always find something I like better. If you are asking, your situation can't be like that. And another thing on Max's side - it's not like you're getting a huge amount for any of these.
     
  10. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    GAS is the word is the word is the word, Its gotta groove.....etc (think "Grease")

    D112's sound better on loud bass cabinets. I've never gotten a 'great' sound from a Beta 52 and while I like the instant-kick-drum-to-go part of the D6 its not my favorite either.

    I'm with the others on this question. You cant have too many mics. Ever.

    I can only assume that you arent going to replace one of these with another kick drum mic so I wont recommend anything for that purpose. Not knowing what you intend to buy and just how the sale of one of these is going to help you in that budget, I can only say......keep em all so you dont regret it later.

    BUT. These are quite plentiful and finding another one in the future should you miss whatever you part with, should be no problem and a patient person can always find a bargain.

    Try finding my favorite, the ATM25. The unfortunate thing for those who have all these mics you list is, if you DO happen across an ATM25 you will never use any of those other mics again. At least on a kick drum of any style or tuning. YMMV.
     
  11. MadMax

    MadMax Well-Known Member

    While I'm waiting for cup-o-joe #2 to kick in, I'll drop a coupla' random thoughts...

    If you're having problems with getting a kick sound you like, you might wanna try a coupla' things...

    Beta52 in the drum, up to the batter head, with a D6 about 1/2 way in the hole.

    Another variation is to put the D112 in the drum, up to the batter head with the mic in the REVERSE position, with a D6 or Beta52 about 1/2 way in the hole.

    The last coupla' sessions I've been working with a 421 in the kick.

    I've had good sounds from an R84 with windscreen about a foot out in front of the kick... Peluso 2247 in about the same position in a Figure 8 - lobed toward the kick... 421 in the hole and a D12e on the batter side (between the kick and floor tom)... D12e, outside; just off center of the kick about 4" away, with a 421 in the hole... and a lot of other combinations including a 4033 in a tunnel with a D6 1/2 way in the hole.

    The main thing to do is take your time and try to match your mic/pattern and placement to the song/style... which needs to work with your room as well.

    Moving mic's can be as little as 1/4" at a time. So, be meticulous when you gotta be dead on, and/or the budget/situation calls for it.
     
  12. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

    For all the more any of them will fetch at auction, I would also be inclined to hold on to all of them and delay the next purchase - unless you flat out dislike one of those mics.

    This thread just proves that mic aficionados like talking about mics as much as buying mics :)

    This is one of those rare cases where the OP is asking, which should I keep? Instead of, which should I buy? Seems like they should be able to determine which they like least better than anyone else.

    If circumstances dictate one of them has to go - I'll give the standard (but highly accurate) RO answer "it depends."

    It would depend on what kind of music I did and what kind of kick drum sound I preferred. Death Metal, Country, Alt Rock, Big Band Jazz. Am I looking for more boom, or more beater? I own the 52 and 112 [among many of the other alternatives mentioned] And I have used other folks' D6 enough to know I should add one of those to my arsenal too. All of them are very well suited for the jobs they were asked to do.


    Some things to consider:
    Some people (like me) don't like buying used mics without a chance to test them - even dynamics.
    Just because the voice-coil is in tact doesn't mean the diaphragm is in good shape. (which will drastically alter the tone)
    The way a dynamic mic has been cared for will have a profound effect on it's sound over time.
    A friend bought a D112 from a local music store that was blowing out gear from their rental dept. (which should raise 2 red-flags)
    After the hell it had been through, it sounded like the $39 he paid for it.
    After fighting the rental 112 mic for two weeks I brought mine from home and it was night and day difference.
    All these kick mics are widely used on-stage, so that opens the door for a lot of cumulative damage.
    Despite all that, I'd consider an ATM25 from eBay, but I'm convinced Dave's constant praise of it is artificially driving up demand/price!
     
  13. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    Oh heck, nobody listens to me...........I shoulda bought four of em when they were being blown out a few years back as a discontinued item. Why they're discontinued I have NO idea but nothing they were replaced with has quite got the sound they have. As for buying those used.....much like a 57 they seem to be indestructable.
     
  14. BassLiK

    BassLiK Active Member

    I lust for other gear, but I have to admit you all make sense, couldn't fetch much anyways for the mic and might as well keep it.
     
  15. declaps

    declaps Guest

    max says:
    The main thing to do is take your time and try to match your mic/pattern and placement to the song/style... which needs to work with your room as well.

    Moving mic's can be as little as 1/4" at a time. So, be meticulous when you gotta be dead on, and/or the budget/situation calls for it.[/QUOTE]

    This is so right, playing around and listen back is the key. Try xperiment with condensers as well and playing with the phase can give some stunning results.

    And dont forget the ambience....
     
  16. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    I forgot to mention my 'other' most favorite kick drum mic and certainly one that will cure almost anything missing from any of the mics mentioned so far..........sub-kick. I have one with a 6.5" speaker suspended in an 8" latin tom (steel shell, shallow, timbale sorta thingy) ....In conjunction with the aforementioned ATM25 (which doesnt really NEED the help) I get size and depth of a 26" kick with a 20" tuned nice and tight. Clik and boom.....with air movement and speaker excursion ......aint this what its supposed to do?
     
  17. RemyRAD

    RemyRAD Well-Known Member

    Here is something else to ponder. Think about this. When the sound of the bass drum hits the microphone diaphragm and your microphone is halfway in the front hole of the head. Which way is that microphone diaphragm going when they kick gets kicked? It is pushing the diaphragm in on the microphone. Given correct studio wiring and phasing which direction should your woofers be going on playback?? Now wait and think about all of the other microphones on the drums. This is where the phase button on the console and proper polarity on your speakers is so critical. I want that sound punching out from the woofer & not sucking in. This generally requires a phase inversion for the kick drum. And I'm one of the few people I know who does this. You can certainly make a cool kick drum sound with its " suck/pump" sound which a lot of guys that I know do. I do sometimes depending on the musical genre. But generally I'm phase inverted when mixing in kick drum which really gives you a harder pounding sound than that in phase " suck/pump" sound that is still quite popular. And while I have most popular kick drum microphones with the exception of the D 6 (which I'm still considering in a later purchase) my favorite is the Sennheiser MD 421 for everything but the overheads and even that sometimes. But most of the times it's just a bunch of SM57's and that's just fine. On the snare, on the bass drum, everywhere. So it's really not what you've got but where you stick it.

    Pick it & Stick it
    Mx. Remy Ann David
     
  18. MadMax

    MadMax Well-Known Member

    Right On Remy!

    I forgot to mention that little phase button thingy... it's become such a 2nd nature decision for me, I just do it and when it's right, I just go on about my bidness.

    I'll flip phase on a mic in a heartbeat and listen, and that's not just true with kick, either... snare, snare top, rack toms, OH's, bass, plank, swirly box, room, mando, pno... it doesn't matter what the "rule" is... other than the rule that you make it sound good.... right?
     
  19. BassLiK

    BassLiK Active Member

    10-4, I see this will be a handy approach on all the mics and will give them each a try. Now the d112 in the reverse position, will that capture more of the air?
     
  20. RemyRAD

    RemyRAD Well-Known Member

    No, it will catch more of the audience. So you really want to aim a cardioid microphone in the wrong direction? When you sit on the toilet, do you face the tank? Actually, I had a gal pal that used to do just that. Her reasoning was that the flush lever was more accessible that way. Of course it'll give you a whole new outlook on wiping.

    20 inch bass drums can sound bigger than 26 inch bass drums on recordings
    Mx. Remy Ann David
     

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