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muddy, dull, and harsh

Discussion in 'Recording' started by jackson413, Jan 17, 2006.

  1. jackson413

    jackson413 Active Member

    Nov 7, 2005
    is the sound i seem to keep getting over and over while tracking dist. rhythm guitars. i have come to the conclusion its because im micing the cab w/ 57's even though i have a decent pre (vmp2ke) and am isolating the sound w/ packing blankets. the tone im looking for is clear, tight distortion. some mics work better than others for different instruments/tones. Can anyone point me in the right direction for a mic to capture high gain distortion. ive read lots on e609's and 421's however cannot a/b any of them. im sure it also has alot to do with my micing placment/technique and eq will certainly help yet i would like to get a decent tone down before i start shaping it. would compression help heavily distored tones sit better before the signal reaches the daw in the chain???

    heres what i have to work with:
    2 57's

    thanks in advance!
  2. sushifish

    sushifish Guest

    I like the 609's. More than the mics you use, I'd say the settings on the amp, type of guitar, and the guitarist are more important. I usually crank up the mids always! Keep you gain, treble and presence lower than you prefer. You can try blending an amp and a DI together and come up with a nice tone. Alot of the people I work with always want to crank there gain and don't understand why there guitars get lost in the mix. Less is more! Good luck!!
  3. jackson413

    jackson413 Active Member

    Nov 7, 2005
    about blending the DI signal with the miced signals...are you referring to a bone dry direct signal(gtr>board) or a dry signal ran through a mic pre before the board? if this is the case are there any mixing tips that might help me blend the dry and mic signals?
  4. moonbaby

    moonbaby Mmmmmm Moderator

    Feb 23, 2005
    First, you need to clarify your problem. Are you getting the sound you want from the guitar and amp in the room, but not able to translate that to the recording medium? Or are you having problems getting the sound you want from the rig?
    If it's not happening at the amp, in the first place, you are spinning your wheels. You will have to learn to get THAT right first. And "turning down the treble and presence controls" on most amps will muddy-up the tone even worse.
    If the tone you're getting from the amp is "on the money", and your problem is that it isn't getting tracked like it sounds, then....
    I find it hard to believe that a "properly-placed" SM57 can be the problem. A Sennheiser 421 is agreat mic for a Marshall-type 4x12 cab, but the difference between that and a 57 is pretty subtle.
    Have you tried positioning the mic at different points along the speaker cone (towards the center gives you more top, less "mud"). Is the speaker you're mic'ing up a good one? Have you played with those load impedance selectors on the Vipre? That's an awesome mic pre, but the options it provides can be a bit overwhelming at times. Different mics have a drastic tonal response change when they "hit" a different load than they were designed to "see". That KSM44 is a great mic, too. How about trying it as a "room mic" to add some "size" (after you get the mic'ed-up cab right)? Put it up in the air about 3-5 feet above the cab and lay it down on a seperate track so that you can blend the 2 later on. As far as DI is concerned, you can DI a modeller (POD, Vox, Boss,etc) to another track, or a "dry" guitar (thru a DI box)...there is no rule.
  5. jonnyc

    jonnyc Guest

    Compression IMO isn't really that big of a deal on distorted guitars. Distorted guitars are kind of naturally compressed to begin with. The wave probably looks more like a square and clean guitar waves should dance all over the place. I honestly never use compression on my distorted guitars, used to but never really seemed to "help" the sound in any significant way. Some might think I'm wrong but like I said it never "helped" my sound.
  6. jackson413

    jackson413 Active Member

    Nov 7, 2005
    thanks for the replies...

    I have indeed dialed in the tone i want tracked from the amp, i think the
    real problem im having is that the tone im capturing sounds thin and dull.
    Ill try and track the "room" sound with the 44 as well and mix it in as suggested for a larger sound...will this work effectivly for a room sound if that mic is 'inside my blanket barrier' as well? To my ears mixing in an amount of the signal from the gtramps preamp out gives me that edge im looking for. Since ill be blending 3 different signals together (all on their own seperate tracks) for esentially one main rhythm guitar track is there any summing/mixing techniques that might help me get it all on one track or is it more common to leave those 3 signals all on their own tracks while eqing/applying effects??? (I'm using a 002 so only have around 32 voices available and still have vocals, lead gtr, bass, and drums to record :) )

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