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need your opinions on upgrading to 64 bit...

Discussion in 'Recording' started by Yunus, Feb 5, 2005.

  1. Yunus

    Yunus Guest

    Hi to everyone,
    This is my first post and my question is in regards to upgrading my current DAW system to a 64 bit one.

    -I am looking for technical specs of 64 bit DAW's that have been tried and tested with high stability (especially compatible MOBO/CPU/Soundcard combo(Drivers)).
    -I am currently using FL5 and Cubase SX3 (32bit) with various VSTs, DXi plugins and ROMplers.
    -My aim is to acquire more CPU power for additional VST, plugin integration and consequently increased creative control. I am not intending to record live inputs.
    -I also do know that many sound cards such as the one that I have happen to have conflicts with 64 bit systems (driver issues still unresolved) but I am not relunctant to swap it with a compatible card (heard that the RME drivers are rock solid on 64 bit, true?).
    -I also do wish to keep my 2 IDE drives for practical reasons but also because I have read (if not mistaken) that despite SATA drives' speed the amount of CPU usage employed for this type of transfer is larger than IDE types', thus breaking valuable CPU processing power.
    -Finally, maybe as not as related directly to Audio Apps I'd like know your general stability experiences through Windows XP 64 bit (Beta) OS.

    I am looking forward for your inputs, opinions and maybe even actual system examples. Thank you very much for your interest. Take good care of yourselves.


    My Current System:
    AMD Athlon 2500+
    MSI KT4V (VIA)
    1GB RAM (Kingston, can t remember bus speed but think 266Mhz)
    2 x 80GB IDE Hardrives (Seagate)
    RADEON 8500
    Plextor x56 CD-RW
    Zalman Ultra Quiet PSU 400W
    Zalman AL7000 CPU Quiet Fan
    EMU 1820 Soundcard
  2. AudioGaff

    AudioGaff Distinguished Member

    Feb 23, 2001
    Silicon Valley
    Considering there is no proven and stable 64-bit OS or recording programs or drivers, yet alone all of them being able to play well together, it seems clear to me that it would be very foolish and out right stupid to jump into a premature technology with the headaces, investment of time, and updates that have to happen for what very little you get back in performance and results. But go ahead, somebody has be the guina pig and it sure as hell won't be me...
  3. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Feb 10, 2001
    there most certainly is a stable 64bit OS.
    first server 2003 has had 64 extentions for almost a yr now or longer.
    not beta full release.
    the beta XP 64 has been available to the devopment comunity for almost as long. now MS has a full version downloadable for the last couple months to anyone. while they still call it a beta its release in May is here!

    Sonar 4 now has 64 bit support and works pretty dang good.
    M-Aadio has had drivers for 4 months or so, RME now has Beta.
    a few others have beta as well.

    while the software is very young the technology is almost 2 yrs old.
    nothing premature about it.
    Linux has been 64 bit for a long time.
    i have been running 64 bit hardware prior to it release to public.
    aside from a few first funky bios' i have never had a problem with it.

  4. Big_D

    Big_D Well-Known Member

    Aug 21, 2004
    Quakertown PA
    Yunus, Welcome to RO.

    There really are no tried and tested 64 bit DAW's outside of MAC's and even then most of it is recompiled 32 bit software not native 64 bit.

    This could be achieved with 32 bit as well.

    Whether or not SATA requires more processor power (BTW I have not heard this) has no bearing. The fact is most of your processor cycles are wasted waiting for data so the faster the data is transfered the faster it is processed and the more efficient the system performs. If you really want to build a fast and efficient system SATA is the only way to go as the vastly reduced throughput of IDE will only increase the biggest bottleneck in your system. Remember to look at the whole system as it's only as fast as it's slowest component.

    It's not bad and should be a very nice OS in time but it is still a beta. The only 64 bit audio app I've seen is still in alpha so it will be a while.

    If your really interested in a 64 bit DAW I would build it and use it as a second system or keep it 32 bit for now. There is some great 64 bit hardware out there that would make a fine DAW but the software is just not ready yet. You could build 64 bit hardware run 32 bit OS and apps for now until the 64 bit software is ready. That way you'll get great performance now and later. If you still want some hardware recommendations let me know.

    Hope this helped.
  5. AudioGaff

    AudioGaff Distinguished Member

    Feb 23, 2001
    Silicon Valley
    Ok ADK, I'm going to burst your little 64-bit bubble.

    Ya, there is 64-bit stuff out there but I would hardly call a premature technology of two years that has not even been released to the mass public as being stable or proven. Beta is Beta no matter how good it appears to work to those few that are testing it. And just because something is released, that does not make it proven and stable to the mass public.

    Server 2003? Server software is hardly something that is consumer mass market or even commonly used for pro audio. Doesn't count.

    Linux is still a bastard stepchild and is not yet a serious contenter for pro audio in the mass market. Mabe one day, but not in the near future.

    Sonar-4 being brand spanking new at 64-bit and "working pretty good" is still along way from being proven and stable. They still have unresolved issues with perfecting 32-bit.

    And just because M-audio has 64-bit drivers for their 2x2 I/O product, doesn't make it proven and stable when there is nothing proven, stable and released for the mass market to use it on. Watch as those 64-bit drivers will have many updates before they are truely proven and stable.
  6. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Feb 10, 2001
    no bubble busted here!

    too funny i hear ya, i tried Ardour 4 yrs ago, nothing but a glorified Adat machine then.. things have got better but still no way..

    ok first let me restate something. if he is looking for a complete 64bit setup as in software and hardware i have to agree its in its infancy.

    but let me remind you of what you posted without qualification.

    fact: there has been for sometime, may not be for the masses until May, which in reality means wait for the first service pack. Like Sept.
    but none the less there has been several stable 64bit OS for some time now.

    the technology (read hardware) is AMD 64 bit, 2 yrs old which in the computing world is a very long time. (i wont bother mentioning Intel itanium which was a flop)

    Fact: both the dual opteron and single 939 64 on a 32bit OS have trounced Intel from Day One and continue to do so.

    now had you said this:

    considering the lack of drivers for 64bit OS, and the lack of tried and proven 64bit recording Software i would stay in the 32bit realm for awhile, but at least by a 64bit ready computer for when its ready.

    i would agree 100% .

    however this is not what the guy was asking... he is well aware of Beta
    so his question is what 64 bit motherboards, processors etc should i buy.

    not is the 64bit OS and driver ready for prime time...

  7. AudioGaff

    AudioGaff Distinguished Member

    Feb 23, 2001
    Silicon Valley
    While I didn't answer the original question, I answered the main question that should have been asked.

    I would suggest the the poster buy nothing until it is all worked out as there are likely to be hardware changes before all is said and done. Buying now doesn't really gain you anything but does put you at risk of not being able to easily or cheaply update.

    And although 64-bit hardware or processors have been around for two years, that is not how tech time gets counted. The tech clock really starts when everything involed with technology is all working and released to the mass public. If you really want to be accurate with the actual tech age add at least two more years as that is about how long it takes to go from design to first silicon, which is the real birthdate
  8. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Feb 10, 2001
    ok here are 2 easy questions

    1)would you recommend A dual Xeon or a Dual Opteron

    2) would you recommend a P4 (and what chipset) or an AMD 64 939.

    i am starting to think i know where your coming from.

  9. Yunus

    Yunus Guest

    Thanks for the warm interest,

    I am substantially learning a lot from this discussion. Again my aim was to have a stable yet very powerful non live recording DAW . Currently the debate takes shape within this form and while someone mentioned dual systems, could buliding a 32 bit double cpu DAW be more suitable for my aim (i.e. dual Athlon 2800). If so I d be sincerely grateful if you could also supply some thoroughly tried Mobo/CPU/SoundCard combo for such kind.


  10. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Feb 10, 2001
    HI Yunus,

    i guess i never did answer your question.

    for amd 64 system you want a 939 pin processor
    i prefer Nvidia over Via although the Via chipserts have improved

    my fav boards are Gigabyte K8ns Ultra 939
    and the MSI Neo 939
    i dont know of any audio cards that have issues with this or software.
    i know for fact RME, M-Audio, Lynx, Presonus, Frontier,Echo, Tascam work with it.

    duals are great but only if you need the power.
    and no the dual MP Athlon 2800s are not a good choice.
    very out of date.
    while they were the rage 2 yrs ago, in fact Summer 2002.
    they are outperformed by most any new single processor system, for VST etc.


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