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New on forum NEEDS help!

Discussion in 'Recording' started by sethlit, Apr 8, 2004.

  1. sethlit

    sethlit Active Member

    HI, first of all this is my first post so nice to meet ya all. Thanks for all of the great info here. okay,

    MY setup is---PC,soundblaster live, cool edit pro, yamaha MG12/4 mixer with phantom, GT 55 (groove tubes) condenser mic without a preamp, 2 older dynamic mics (they sound okay not great), 3 pairs of headphones, computer speaks for monitors (but learned to get okay mix on them), and one main room (14'X12") with a smaller room attatched (6'x4').

    Now here's my situation...I recently had a guy approach me about investing in $2000 to $3000 in my music and recording ventures. I am fairly new at the recording thing but an experienced musician. SO before I waste away that sorta money I NEED some advice from you guys.

    My goal: to be able to record bands live and not track by track. Thanks ahead for any help!

  2. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    Welcome to RO...As for your dilemma....2000 to 3000 bucks is not very much money when it comes to recording equipment.This is not meant to dissuade you in any way, but my cable budget for my VERY modest 24 track facility was about twice that amount.Think about how much you have invested right now in your rig and you'll see what I'm getting at.A budget of 20K will get you somewhat closer to your goals but really only enough to get started.....
  3. sethlit

    sethlit Active Member


    I appreciate the reply, however as much as you and I both would like more money to invest into our projects...for me, this is it. So with that in consideration, what creative ideas could you suggest into helping me manage for now. Of course, I plan on adding in the future as much as possible. But with 3000 what would you suggest to get by?

  4. maintiger

    maintiger Well-Known Member

    If the goal is to record live bands, spend it first on mics- you need drum mics- get a akgd112 for kick and 4 to 6 '57's for snare/toms- get a pair of small condensers for overheads- studio projects has a pair that get good reviews- (C3's, I believe) this should set you back a little over 1K-

    Now do you have a way to bring in multi-tracks in your computer- if not you'll have to address that- If you have a way to bring 8 to 16 tracks in the computer already, skip this step- if you don't you'll have to address it. Boxes are made by companies like motu that are pretty good. I have an 828mkii fire wire interface and I can get 20 inputs from it- 2 w/buit in preamps. 8 more analog, 2 spdif and 8 more via light pipe- look around, if you need it you can find used boxes on ebay- an 828 mkii will run you $750 new and this is not the only box, there are many out there.

    next you'll need preamps w/phantom power - you can spend a lotta money here (and need to to get a great sound) but we don't have a lotta money so lets improvise- A Yamaha mla7 is an often overlooked, 8 ch good sounding preamp for drums (or anything else) When you can find them on ebay they go for about $200- if you get two you are set up 16 tracks for live bands in your studio- add other quality pre's when money comes in-

    If you have any money left I recommend a vocal mic. You can get a decent condenser, a SP C1 or a rode NT1 for about 200 bucs- you'll be glad you did as it will improve your sound-

    now mind you, this is only a begginning. This is not the best of the best but its equipment you won't toss later- the mics you will keep as there is always use for the d112, the 57's and the small condensers. The interface box you will always need- I since upgraded my converters to apogee but the 828 is still the interface box. The mla7 preamps are like I said overlooked and underated. I still use my mla7 for drums, eventhough I have better preamps now. This is pretty good equipment as far as money goes and evnthough we are not talking Neumanns and api's here you should be able to get good results out of it- especially for band demos- after you get the minimunt equipment you need to record bands and you are getting paid recording gigs you should seriously condider getting some decent monitors. I know you say that your current mixes are translating well in your current speakers but you'll be amazed as how much better they will be with decent monitors-

    Good luck to you and happy tracks!
  5. sethlit

    sethlit Active Member

    maintiger, u da man.

    Thank u, thank u, thank u.

    However, I have two questions about your post...if you don't mind.

    As far as the the multi-track into comp. is concerned...would you suggest getting a box for my already sound blaster live card...or buying a better card which would allow 8 inputs...I am not too familar with the boxes.....if go with upgrading the soundcard which one would you suggest??

    Also....as far as the monitor system for the bands I record....how would you address that? 4 headphones into a cheap mixer? I'm not quite sure about how to handle this the right way.

    (oh i lied one more question) :lol: Is my GT-55 condenser not good enough for vocals? I have had some pretty good results in the past with it. But I haven't really had the opportunity to use the next price range of mics. Also I plan on gettting some monitors soon too...I'm thinking the Yorkvilles but...any input on that would be greatly appreciated as well!! Thanks so much everyone,

  6. maintiger

    maintiger Well-Known Member

    Hi seth-

    I am not sure what to recommend as to the sound card as I have a mac and a motu 828 box- perhaps someone else can advise you better on that. If you are going to record drums, though, you do need at least 8 inputs- preferably 16 if you are also gonna capture bass, rhym guitar, scratch vocals, etc.

    And yes, your Gt55 should be as good as the C1 or the NT1 for vocals so you can put off a quality condenser for later- as to monitoring for headphones, there's a few companies that put out inexpensive headphone amps that are adequate for tracking- rolls has a 4 ch mini one for about $75, Carvin has a 4 ch rack mount one for about a hundred bucks and of course the infamous B-boys have a 4ch one for a hundred, an 8 ch one for $120 or so. carvin has a special this month where you buy 3 headphones and a headphone amp and you get one headphone free- I don't know how good they are but I got the literature yesterday-

    I've never heard the yorkville monitors but all I can say is to let the music store let you take them back if they don't work in your room- that's the best way to buy monitors, trying them out in your work environment- Maybe they will let you check out a few so you can decide what suits you best.

    At anyrate like I said before, start with the mics- you can't go wrong with a Akg d112 and you can get them on e bay new for about $150- I just got one last week- the '57's is best to buy them new for about $90 a piece as they don't lose their value much and they go on ebay used for 60 or 70 bucs anyway- I wouldn't want to take the chance for that little savings as sometimes 57's that have been dropped too many times don't sound too good.
    A pair of small condensers and you are set for drums and recording your bands!
  7. sethlit

    sethlit Active Member


    Maintiger...u are da man!

    Thanks so much, I appreciate your help greatly! I am now going to put together a little list and do the math. As far as the soundcard is concerned I am sorta leaning toward the M-Audio 1010LT, but I am still trying to figure out why the M-Audio 1010 is so much more than the 1010LT...ah well. I will make sure to post back about my results. (probably with more questions :lol: Thanks so much!!!!!!!!!!!

  8. Rhythmschism

    Rhythmschism Guest

    The Delta 1010 has had a very positive response among home recer's, and is probably one of the most popular entry level cards. I think it would suit your budget well. The LT is basically just a condensed version of the regular card. As far as the actual quality goes and differences in technical specs, you would need to consult their website. But the main difference is that the 1010 has a rackable breakout box and the LT does not.

    Also, I think the small diaphragm condensor microphone maintiger was referring to is the Studio Projects C4, not the C3 (which is a large diaphragm condensor, and twice as expensive). A pair of C4s is probably what he was referring to for use for drum overheads. They have a good reputation for this application from what I've heard. If you buy them as a matched pair they are also good for doing stereo (coincident, etc) miking for acoustic guitars and such, but I'm guessing you wont be doing much of this in live situations.

    Also consider the Sennheiser E609 Silver. Some argue it can achieve better results in certain applications (close miking cabinents, snare) when using lower quality preamps compared to the SM57, and its about the same price. Either way, it is a different mic with a different sound and its always good to have options. If your getting several 57's, you may look at picking up one of these just to have another option.

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