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Discussion in 'Recording' started by AngelVivaldi1, Dec 7, 2006.

  1. Hey all, my name's Angel, (hi Angel!)- lol

    I have a dilemma and I'm sure all of you recording guru's can give me and my -fresh out of school- producer some tips.

    We tracked this record in Traktion, and the rest is done on protools. The main issue we're having here are the DRUMS. Point blank, they sound terrible. What can we do to rectify these horrible drums?!




    Thank you guys so much for all your time effort and wisdom-


    ~Angel V.

  2. jonnyc

    jonnyc Guest

    I can't listen to your stuff because I'm on dial up but if you need better drum sounds on something that's already been recorded then you may want to consider a replacement program like Drumagog. It can really save a crappy session.
  3. Thanks for the head's up- ill look into it, but we're more for mixing the snare and drums so that they can at least sound half way decent =)
  4. backinthelab

    backinthelab Guest

    Yeah, they sound pretty bad, like banging on a pot. How did you mic these?

    The snare definately has to go. I'd try to smooth out the horrible high end with a little eq and give it some reverb.

    Wait, I listened to the other two tracks. On those third the snare isn't bad, but your cymbals are washy. I think your all over the place with your mix, try tightening up on that first. All three songs have something different that needs tweaking.
  5. Thanks so much for youre response and help-

    I think he used either an sm57 or a q7 mic.. not sure. He may have even used the q7 for the kick. I quite honestly dont remember. Im just the artist lol =)

    Do you think it's at all salvagable or is it coming to a point where we'd need to re-record? To my knowledge my producer dude used the same formulas for each song- prolly the way the drummer played it possibly?
  6. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    Dec 10, 2001
    Pacific NW
    This is some pretty nice stuff. Love the guitar work....lots of range and very dynamic playing. The drums in general are doing you no favors. They are very papery sounding and have no real punch. Later tonight I'll burn a copy of this and listen to it in the studio. But on the computer speakers its just not right at all....I'd also like to hear a bit more edge to the bass sound. Dont know if its a bass guitar or a keyboard but it could use a tweek too. I'll have more later.
  7. eddies880

    eddies880 Guest

    I ran into a delema such as this one some time back,I spent a whole month trying get some drums tracks sounding at least half decent,after that ordeal,I swore I would never attempt the same thing again.
    Time wasnt taken to record the tracks (mics/preamps/mic placement etc..) correctly,so needless to say,you get what you put in :oops:
    However------I was able to fix the snare and kick via a drum module,,,simlpy put,I used the tracks as a trigger for the module,,,It may be cheating,,,but WTF,,,it worked!
  8. RemyRAD

    RemyRAD Guest

    Sep 26, 2005
    You know, if you take the awful equalization off of the snare drum (in your first posted song) and then stick a limiter on it with a hard Gate to tighten it up and take some of the awful ring out of it. Then add a tight large room ambient drum reverb to it, will probably help a lot?

    Your biggest problem is that you're not actually processing the drums enough in your mix. They are loose and flabby (kind of like me) and sound like you stuck them in the livest corner of an empty basement? Ug!

    A nice bit of equalization with a limiter and gate on the bass drum would also make it sound larger and fatter. This is not about dynamic range. It's about the sound. You get that sound by taking out some of the dynamic range from these particular drums, while virtually leaving the overheads alone. Go ahead and also gate all of the toms. Make sure the gate doesn't open when the other drums are played. It takes some tweaking.

    Otherwise, your guitars and everything else to me, sounds bitchin'!
    Ms. Remy Ann David
  9. mark_van_j

    mark_van_j Active Member

    Oct 28, 2005
    Maribor, Slovenia
    That actually sounds better than I excpected. I've heard far worse that was supposed to be "profesional".

    Is it me or is there a phase thing going on on the snare? Could it be the other mics creating this hi-mid resonance?

    Anyways, after dealing with these type of recordings for years, (even today) the easiest and best sounding solution is by far drumagog. It's a metal song, which makes it even that much better of a reason. If done properly, I have yet to meet someone who can tell the difference.

    Everything else is just a matter of mixing properly, but the snare really is a hopeless cause.

    Here's a good rule of thumb. You can either do damage control, or you can mix. You can't do both. If you are doing damage control, you will never be able to mix it in properly... It might sound better, but it won't sit.

    That's why I say go for replacing the sound.

    But if you guys are up for re-recording the drums, you might want to think on trying to make the performances a bit tighter... The kick is pretty much all over the place timing-wise.

    Hope you guys work this out!
  10. Eriksmusicproduction

    Eriksmusicproduction Active Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    Sounds to me like all the snare sound is coming from the o/h's? On the first song anyway.
  11. I can not thank you all enough for taking the time out of your day and helping me out- I truly do appreciate it. I was glad to see that there are musicians and music gurus out there willing to help another musician out in such a competitive era, (unfortunate but very true).

    I am definitely going to try all of your suggestions. I will be in the studio next Wed, so any additional notes you have by all means throw 'em on up here! I do remember eq'ing it with him a bit.. We tried lowering the highg, boosting up the mids a bit as well as the bass. Nothing sounded better, still had that Lars Ulrich, "St.Anger Trash Can" set lol.

    Youre actually not the only one to say that the snare sounds like it was only the overheads being used. That may be the case.. but i hope it's not! But I've physically seen the snare track and it looks too normal to be just the overheads.

    Also thank you for the comments on the music- Your support means a lot!


  12. djrr3k

    djrr3k Guest


    Don't take this the wrong way because I'm definitely trying to be constructive here. With that said, in the future you might try tuning your snare different. Also a little trick that I do both as a drummer and engineer...

    tune your snare to your liking, then hitting the drum in the center put your thumb about 1-2 inches inside in front of the lug and hit it. When you find the right lug you'll notice ring disappear. I then turn to Moon Gel, and cut a tiny piece of it, maybe a 1/2 inch square, and put it where your thumb was. If you use small pieces and only a couple pieces for the whole drum you can get rid of the ring without killing the tone of the drum.

    For recording heavier rock and metal I also use big cymbals to help cure the "AYS" as I call it (Adrian Young Syndrome). To my ears 16" thin A-customs just don't fit a big rock sound. On the record I'm recording right now I'm using 15" hats, 19" & 21" crashes, and a 22" ride. The sound is great, loving it. Just suggestions. Like the tunes, good stuff. Keep it up.

  13. Not taken the wrong way at all! Thats what I'm hear for- I definitely wanted some advice on what to do with that snare. See, for this song I was just informed a short while ago that my drummer may have used a different snare on ALL OR NOTHING, (the worst one with the snare)- Live it sounds incredible. But on the record- yea well liste for yourself!

    He has maybe about 12 different cymbals he uses and again they sound great live. I htink his gear is great but we just need better drum mixes. HOWEVER- the probalem could also be the tuning of his snare/kit. So i'll menitont hat to him no doubt- thanks again for all your comments and inpu!

  14. ABozung

    ABozung Guest

    AV's Drum Probs

    I would have to agree that it appears its all Overheads. I can't hear anything even close to a SM57 range at all. It may have been too far away or something. Somehow you have to find the sweetest frequency, bring it out more and work around that with the remaining EQ bands above and below it. Its going to take some work, but explore the range. I couldn't hear the tom's either. It my be possible to work with the tom mics to inheritantly get some more tone with the snare. I would see what I have to work with for the toms and find out whether or not changing the tom frequencies gives you some more to work with on the snare. Actually, the entire drum mix isn't there. As I listen to it the kicks aren't EQ'd either. You know, you may have something there to work with after you focus on the entire kit EQ'd. You can't change bad tuning or Mic placement probs, but I have worked with enough drum mixes to tell you that changing one tom or kick can have drastic effects on other drums and most importantly, the snare. I will have to tell you that given the presence and huge sound you have on the guitars etc..., it is unlikely that your going to bring the drums up to that quality the way they are recorded unless you missed a few Mute buttons that are on. Your drummer sounds good though.
    For whatever its worth.
  15. Sidhu

    Sidhu Active Member

    Mar 22, 2004
    New Delhi, India
    There is something very wrong with the stereo imaging of the OV's.. might want to look into it too ???

    But... im really curious to know ure guitar chain.. sonds real nice..

  16. I had just sent my producer an email about this situation. We're talking about redoing the entire drums again- POSISBLY. We'd all much rather not- however we need to do whats best for the album- not our laziness =)

    In regards to your inquiry about the guitasr setup- It's actually quite simple yet VERY effective. I run my arsenal of Ibanez's through a Line 6 Pod rack mount- which is then fed through a 362 Sonic Maximizer- which makes ALL the difference. Set the delay- run it through the board- and thats it! =)

    Again thank you for all your help everyone!


  17. Hi (this is my first post here by the way...). What you can do in case you have recorded bassdrum/snare/hh/toms/overheads separately is to go back to the original recorded (unprocessed) drumtracks and put the tracks which you need to get to sound better through a ddrum module (you can do it also with another trigger module but nothing beats ddrum at this point). It's not possible for open hihats or whatsoever and certainly not for overheads, but you can do a pretty good job with bassdrum/snare/toms anyway. You can mix the new tracks with the original sounds which are bleeding through on the overheads to get a good sound so you won't have to record new drumtracks.
  18. dogbiscuit

    dogbiscuit Active Member

    Dec 19, 2006
    Wow you are the only other person I've met so far who uses Tracktion! I love it!
    I would also suggest drumagog as you may be able to alter the snare sound with this.

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