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please help me go the right way

Discussion in 'Recording' started by music9090, Mar 5, 2009.

  1. music9090

    music9090 Guest

    hey everyone,

    Im considering on getting digidesign 003 factory... ill be using pro tools for mixing and putting it all together. for the production i was thinking of ableton since ive read that it comes with pro tools and used it couple of times pretty straight forward for me. ive been using logic pro for the last little while and im getting used to it and like it.

    basically i would like people input on:

    1) digidesign 003 factory good investment or is there something better or as good for cheaper price

    2) pro tools? or ableton? or logic? or all have their own special thing and use them all?

    3) or what would you recommend as the best set up from hardware to software.

    basically im up for anything thats good and will get the job done. with budget around 4- 6grand...

    Thank you all.
  2. ouzo77

    ouzo77 Active Member

    Jan 16, 2006
    Nuremberg, Germany
    Home Page:
    if you like logic and are already getting used to it, then why change it? i'm not saying it's better than the other daws but it's definitely a very powerful program.
    if you're not going to exchange projects with studios you will have no advantage by using pro tools.
    ableton has some very powerful real-time functions, which are great when using it in a live or onstage environment.

    i'd say stick with what you've got and get a good interface.

    just my thoughts...
  3. FlyBass

    FlyBass Active Member

    Oct 31, 2007
    Central Indiana, USA
    Do you work in the box or do you like to work with a control surface mixer?
  4. music9090

    music9090 Guest

    control surface.
  5. My vote is for Logic if you want to do the production in a program besides PT. Ableton is good for what it does (I have both), but Logic has better quality content IMO.

    The new PT has some decent content also, but I think Logic is built a little more around the production of music rather than just a replacement for and analog sys.

    All the DAWs are kind of aligning their features, so you'll probably be happy with any. If you are going to record lots of live drums, I'd roll with PT because of elastic audio. Otherwise I prefer Logic.
  6. rockstardave

    rockstardave Active Member

    Mar 3, 2006
    get an M-Audio project mix and use it with Logic
  7. music9090

    music9090 Guest

    i looked into the the m-audio project mix and i cant remember fully but i was told something about that you have to convert files if i wanted to say do the same project on a different hardware or something i cant really remember it was awhile ago. does anyone know what im trying to get at?
  8. FlyBass

    FlyBass Active Member

    Oct 31, 2007
    Central Indiana, USA
    First let me make the following assumptions: You have a good Mac, are using Logic Pro 7 or 8, you have good monitors, good headphones and good microphones. And have a good recording space (acoustically treated, good cables, mic stands, et al.).

    Since you have the money to spend ("...budget around 4 - 6 grand...") and are interested in good sound, here is my recommendation:
    Stick with Apple's Logic Pro, it offers everything you could need in DAW software and you already own it. For your interface, an Apogee Ensemble ($2,000). That would give you 8 channels of high-quality 24-bit 192K AD/DA conversion with 4 great microphone preamps and 4 hi-Z inputs. Add to that a great preamp for 1 channel strip of golden audio for vocals ($800-$1,200 for your choice of one of the many great preamps out there). For the control surface, a Euphonix MC Mix ($1,000). That gets you to about $4,000.

    After that you can add another preamp if you would like (+$800-$1,200) or just start out with a dual channel preamp (+$1,000). Or you can add a Euphonix MC Control ($1,500) for complete control over your DAW. That will tap you out at about $6,000 with tax and/or shipping.

    Of course you realize that is my best guess for a good quality recording chain. The Mackie Onyx 400F ($800) and a Mackie Control Universal Pro ($1,300) is a lower priced alternative that some like. It has 4 preamps (+4 other ins) and 10 outs to your DAW. Another choice would be the PreSonus FireStudio Tube ($800) -- 8 preamps, 8 other ins, 8 outs. Then pair it up with the Euphonix MC Mix control surface ($1,000). Plus you can still add that "golden channel strip" to either of these interfaces.

    Check 'em all out to get a sense of what I'm suggesting here. Good luck and have fun.
  9. robcranmer

    robcranmer Guest

    There is a host of new stuff just hitting the market at lower pricepoints....if you don't NEED to get going right now, holding off a month or two to see what rises as the best is CURRENTLY advisable. As for DAW's we use Logic in my studio, as do the majority of major studios, many have it running "over" or "under" other systems...ours runs over MOTU's operating software flawlessly...it's been sooo long since I had to change anything that I.ve forgotten the name of MOTU'S software(cuetime or cue desk or something like that I believe) also Logic comes bundled with a good enough group of plug-ins that you don't have to make any additional Major expenditures on software.
  10. pmolsonmus

    pmolsonmus Well-Known Member

    Jun 23, 2003
    Hopefuly you understand DIGI is a hardware company. PT8 comes w/ the purchase of the 003. For the home studio, if you made that purchase, there really isn't any reason to use Ableton or ....unless there's something specific that PT doesn't do terribly well. (e.g. MIDI - better but not a wow factor) or???
    In the right hands even PTLE is a powerful enough tool that can be used to mix and master.

    I'm not dismissing either Logic or Ableton or whatever. It just may be overkill. Spend your $ on mics/pres. The 003 is clean but not sexy.

    What do you hope to record??? Add'l inputs via lightpipe may be necessary. Again more $. The 003 definitely has limits.

    What is your signal chain/monitoring chain/ mixing chain/mastering chain like?
    Again even more $.

    More details needed.

  11. music9090

    music9090 Guest

    ive looked at the euphonix awhile ago didnt look into it too much... now that you have mentioned it i looked into it more and i like what i see. thanks flybass for you input and if you have any more suggestion im willing to looking into it.

    im planning on getting something in the next month or so...

    basically i want to set up a studio with:
    - mac book pro 2.53 ghz / 4 gb ram < have
    - 2 KRK RP5 - 2 KRK RP6-G2 - and KRK RP10S < have
    - Axiom Pro 61
    - and some sort of synth

    what are the essential things that will be beneficial for the studio?

    and also for the first little while im not going to be into much of the vocal aspect.
  12. If you are going to stay in the studio I wouldn't get a synth. Unless you get an Oasys, synths use compressed samples and have tiny (in comparison to soft synths) wave ROMS. Different story if you are planning on playing out and don't want to bring your computer along.

    It kind of depends on what you want to do. If you are doing strictly in-the-box electronic music (without vocals or external instruments) than you would probably find PT to be less intuitive than Logic. PT isn't only a hardware company. I imagine that the bulk of their profits come from selling PT upgrades and M-Pwrd Pro Tools. Obviously hardware is a big part of their business, but hardware doesn't make as much gross profit as software.

    Either way, there is better hardware out there in terms of raw quality. 003s are nice, but nothing to scream and yell about. I second the Apogee stuff if you want really pristine quality. The Mackie 400f is also a great little interface for the money if you are going to stick with Logic.

    Its funny to watch how many people buy 003 control surfaces, but you go to a mix session and they are doing everything with a mouse. My band recorded at a studio with a D-Command with extra fader packs, and the engineer hardly touched it. Not saying that people don't use control surfaces...I've met plenty of people that do, but they are a big mouse/convenience/wowfactor item...they have no bearing on your end sound quality.
  13. BTW the 003 comes with a light version of Ableton. You'd have to upgrade to get full functionality. That would add like 250 to your price.
  14. FlyBass

    FlyBass Active Member

    Oct 31, 2007
    Central Indiana, USA
    Since you are doing just the studio recording, consider something like a M-Audio Keystation 61es. It has 61 keys, but no sounds built-in, it is just a controller for the synth and sampler modules in Logic (or other DAWs).
  15. intchr

    intchr Guest

    What kind of music are you producing? If it's electronic I'd encourage you strongly to take a look at Ableton for production. The session view in particular makes Ableton a fast and efficient way to sequence out material, and imho it feels as much of an instrument to me as it does a DAW. Then again I've been doing a lot of instrument tracking in it and even that goes by pretty effortlessly. I would just be concerned with processor load though, running Ableton, Logic/PT, softsynths and effects may weigh your system down a bit, but this may not end up being the case either.

    I think the best piece of advice in this thread has been to be very careful to not blow your whole stack on software and look at some good outboard gear for your signal chain. You're getting comfortable in Logic so maybe for now that would be the best thing to do, stick with Logic and get yourself a nice preamp. I'd also advise to go the route of a solid softsynth. One that you may want to look at is Reaktor 5, it offers many possibilities out of the box and the user library is gargantuan. Buyer beware though, some of the synths you get out of the box though are load-intense, as well as more than a few of the user-created synths.

    Again though, it comes down to what exactly you're trying to produce. If you'd shed some light on that, I think that would help you get some narrowed-down advice.
  16. music9090

    music9090 Guest

    i want to produce house. im going to stick with logic pro
  17. music9090

    music9090 Guest

    i need a daw controller with midi. or what are my other options....
    any inputs on Tascam FW-1884 or Tascam FW-1082? or dont bother with these?
  18. FlyBass

    FlyBass Active Member

    Oct 31, 2007
    Central Indiana, USA
    Two things.
    1) Producing house music seems to indicated that you will be using all synths. Logic has some great softsynths (software synthesizers) and the killer EXS24 software sampler and player. When I gave you my suggestions I thought you wanted to record real instruments and vocals. You won't need an audio interface if you are working in the box with softsynths. If you later on want to record instruments, see my suggestions.

    2) The Tascam FW-1884 or Tascam FW-1082 are okay, but they don't have the high-quality A/D converters or preamps of the Apogee or the Mackie. But then again, it sounds like you don't need those.

    Either Tascam will provide you with a control surface, power for headphones, control for your powered main monitors and preamps and an interface should you want to record live someday. Perhaps the only outboard hardware you will ever need.
  19. music9090

    music9090 Guest

    the mackie Control Universal Pro and the mackie Onyx 400F doesnt look like a good combo. and this will give me full control and later when i decided to use really instruments and mics im set?? i can hook up a synth and what not...

    there is so much stuff its all so confusing when your just starting out...
  20. intchr

    intchr Guest

    It's at least worth playing around with the Ableton demo for a bit then, electronic music and Ableton are like bread and butter. Either way good luck man :)

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