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PROTOOLS 6.4 & OSX - Major Midi dilema - PLEEASE HELP

Discussion in 'Pro Tools' started by Trudy, Apr 23, 2005.

  1. Trudy

    Trudy Guest

    Hi browsers & helpers
    I'm having a major midi dilema -PLEEEASE take the time to read on:

    I have recently upgraded from OS 9 - protools 5.1.1 to protools 6.4 - OSX - on a G4)
    I have an audio cable connected..from digi001 analog3 to a Roland JW-50 keyboard
    Plus midi out from digi001 to midi in JW-50 and midi in digi001 to midi out JW-50
    I have configured my AMS to connect to an external device (ie Roland JW-50 keyboard), transmitting & recieving on 16 channels
    Ports = digi001 on port1 and JW-50 on port1

    When I click on test studio it works, but when I import a general midi file the channels defalut to 'none' they will work if I set each one up manually (ie drums = JW-50, Port1,channel 10)

    When I was running Protools 5.1.1 each time I imported a midi file the channels defaulted to the right one (ie drums on channel 10), since the upgrade this is no longer the case they default to 'none'.

    I emailed my problem to digi design technical support and their reply was as follows:

    -----------
    Hi,
    what you are describing is normal under OS X and Windows XP. I believe it has to do with changes the occurred in QuickTime and the move from AMS to OMS. Under OS 9 .mid files would open with the correct QuickTime musical instrument. Under the newer OSs they open with the outputs set to none.
    Best regards,
    Digidesign Technical Support

    -------------

    This is REALLY bad news for me, considering I use general midi files downloaded from the net for learning new songs for live work and recording, It is going to be a real hassle to have to try and work out which instruments to manually channel on each track.

    I did have someone say to me on another forum that their channels defaulted to the right ones each time they imported a midi file and I'm pretty sure they use OSX & 6.4 they were going to check their settings, but they haven't got back to me yet.

    I don't know how I'll know which instrument to use for each channel, all I know is drums are generally on track 10.
    I thought this midi info was included in the midi file ie in track 1. There must be a way around this, it is too inconvenient for it to be feasable.

    What should I do???
    I've spent a lot of money upgrading my system simply because I brought an ipod which required OSX or later.
    Please some-one help - :cry:
     
  2. Kev

    Kev Well-Known Member

    I'm sorry Trudy but the news is probably not good.

    This situation is very typical with many of the PT upgrades and I have never got used to it.

    Many things can trigger the loss of midi routing and the change in the midi port it the one that does the most damage.

    I know the midi port hasn't changed !
    It is still the 001 !!
    BUT that is not the way PT sees it.

    I can only advise that in the future you keep a record of your songs and midi units and sounds being used on each track.

    " IT'S A COMPUTER !!! I shouldn't have to write things down with a pencil. "
    :roll:

    I have a go at my Digi Rep at every oppotunity I get about this and couple of other pet grips with PT that date back a very long time ... PT3 time.
    They just don't get it !!!!!!
     
  3. Trudy

    Trudy Guest

    Well Kev it seems that digi design is not my fave at the moment.
    I have played around with importing a midi file today and routing the midi channels mannually, and I did get it to work OK, who ever programmed the midi file added some info that showed up at the bottom of each track to give me an idea of the patch number.
    I have to admit I am green when it comes to midi, I like to import and play with out having to worry about which sounds I'm using, the most I do is mute a couple that sound crappy.
    I think if I route each one to channel 1... 2... 3 etc it should be pretty close...I'm still confused about the little patch button at the bottom of the track - how come if I change the channel number the sound changes yet the button at the bottom lets you pick a sound?
    I still haven't worked that one out???
    :?
     
  4. Kev

    Kev Well-Known Member

    Every one sets up there midi differently

    General Midi was supposed to help people get into it easier and allow for a standardisation of sounds and patch numbers ... then came SX GX GS and so one as eash company tried to put their stamp on things.

    Rebirth and Fruity Loops and so on brought another dimension that makes it even harder to integrate without a degree or
    Re-Building in your system.

    The P is for patch changing and in the time of OMS and OMS names things did work well as you could put your synth into the equipment list and then your current names into the name list.

    I won't overcomplicate this now as it is all out the window with the OSX and XP.
    That puts our OMS and OMS names web sites all out of the loop.
    Many of us had downloadable files and list for many of the popular synths and their expansion cards.

    Routing to channels 1..2..3.. is only cool if you don't use the similar sound in each channel.
    What if you were to have a different number of bass guitars or 4 violins instead of two.

    I'm not explaining this well ... :roll:

    EACH midi track can have any one of the available 16 midi channels.
    Each track can have a patch change infomation and automation.
    on the edit screen ... look at the block /notes/volume/velocity .... patch change
    is there info in this area ... this is very similar to the P button infomation.

    Channel 10 is often the drum track BUT not always and if you want volume control of individual drum sounds then using up a whole midi port for 16 tracks of drums on 16 midi channels is common.
    well not so common now we have things like Reason.

    These softsynths are also why the P is not helping as it should.

    I recommend keeping good notes with each song. It's the only way to be sure - long into the future.
     
  5. Trudy

    Trudy Guest

    Hey Kev,
    Your a great dude thanks so much for your advice. I think as I work with it some more along with your advice I should be able to get it together...you nwver know it may end up being a good thing by getting me upto date ewith my midi side :shock:

    I'm currently looking at getting a software synth, mabe something like "reason" with provitamin general midi sounds
    I'm not sure how much reason is to buy, I'm yet to look into it but I know I can get the gen mid sounds for around $34 Aust
    What do you think??

    :cool:
     
  6. Kev

    Kev Well-Known Member

    The full version of Reason is a world of it's own so expect it to have a high price.

    If you must live in a GM world then an extra $34 is cool
    I may look into that myself as i did like to have GM versions of the stuff I was working on as a quick reference and archive for years later.

    It is cool to work on arrangements and send to any computer and have the sound-card play a version of the song.

    The trouble is that .. not everyone will now have a GM set to play these songs and it may be better to fully label your tracks so people can assign a sensible sound choice.

    You could set up a basic GM drum map to suit the usual Reason Adapted that now comes with PT.
     

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