Discussion in 'Recording' started by mberry593, Apr 12, 2012.
.....just in case you missed it, 10.1.2 is (finally) available.
So, Mike, do you consider this to be a worthy update? And why? Is it more of an operational improvement or an improvement of audibility? Maybe operationally better for Windows 7 over XP? Though it appears that Windows may not benefit as much as Mac?
Just curious I guess?
Mx. Remy Ann David
Probably the biggest consideration is the (hopeful) improvement in the 'audio suddenly stopping' bug. That alone made it very important.
Yeah there are a great number of people complaining that the windows users didn't get the AAX plugs. I don't see that as a big problem yet for the natives (that's me) but I understand why the HD people were anxious.
Really, I'm happy now. I never do anything big enough to need 64 bits. I intend to stay with 10 for a long time as the way I understand it, it will be the only way to run AAX & all my RTAS which I don't want to pay to upgrade.
EDIT: Perhaps I should explain this some more for people who may not have followed the issue. There is a painful thread over at the DUC that is 37 pages long with 362 posts from people who have had PT 10 stop playing in the middle of a session. Some have had the embarrassment of having clients walk out. Hopefully this maintenance update will address that problem. Please read issue PTSW-157510 on page 2 of the update notes.
This looks like it may be the fix.
Well, let us know if it actually fixes anything. While we respect PT around here and for some it is their DAW of choice, we all take Avid with a very large grain of salt to soak up the marketing kool-aid.
That's great! ....wait a minute....
But all can't be lost can it?
I am the Pro Fool who really doesn't Pro Tool. I'm still utilizing version 7 when I utilize it at all. I mean it's cool and all that but I really never liked their hardware and still don't. I don't believe any so-called professionals that don't include proper documentation of their product material for maintenance purposes. Proprietary microphone preamps my ass.
And I've got a big one.
Mx. Remy Ann David
You do realize that since ver 9, you no longer are required to use Avid hardware.
+1 on the documentation issue.
BTW, A thought came to me about the gain structure of the Mbox 3 Pro. (Here I go off topic again. Mods: please forgive me) There is one application for which it comes close. If you use a console just for the preamps when tracking and take the signals from the insert points it can come out close to ok. Many consoles run their insert points at -2. If you take that into the line input of a Mbox 3 Pro, it comes out in PT at -16 dBFS. That's still a little on the hot side but now we are getting close to something usable. In any case, if that is what Avid had in mind........WHY DIDN"T THEY LABEL THE JACKS THAT WAY?!?!? (My apologies for yelling. I know it is bad etiquette, but this bugs me.)
EDIT: Remember the old Avid Newscutters? O = -14 I remember the first one I saw. KING had it at their Washington bureau. This must have been about 1993. Even back then that hit me as a really bad idea.
The analog of the MBox is garbage and that includes the internally padded "line" input. There is no advantage to PT over any other DAW when one takes away the HD hardware so no real reason to upgrade unless PT is already one's preferred program OR if one's market area demands having PT visible whether utilized or not.
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I'm staying 9.something for now.
The worst thing about this is that I have a feeling the next major update will be an upgrade and that will be the release of 10.2 or PT 11 which will finally support the HDX cards. So there are users out there who paid big money for their HDX cards and can't use them.
Is this some sort of cruel joke?
So they won't be able to use their hardware's full potential until the next major upgrade which will be paid if they didn't buy into the Avid Advantage. And if their Advantage service has expired, they will be paying full price for the upgrade, in which case they will have paid nearly twice the retail value of the upgrade(if you factor in the price of the Advantage service). The shareholders love this. It's a huge advantage for Avid(pardon the pun). It's fleecing the users though. I find it quite offensive.
The HDX situation is so bad that I believe that I must be misunderstanding something. Someone please tell me what I have wrong.
As I understand it, HDX can not use TDM plug-ins. Yes, it is a good thing to get beyond TDM as in many cases it was inferior to RTAS even though the plugs cost more. But how does Avid expect anyone to convert all of their TDM to AAX? Even if you consider cost-no-object, many of them are not available at all. Please understand that there will be 2 flavors of AAX....one for the natives and one for the HDX people. Here is the real kicker...Although they have committed to native AAX, Waves has not even announced that they will do HDX AAX plug-ins at all!
Listen to this brief interview...
NAMM 2012: Waves Respond To AAX Concerns - Pro Tools Tips, Tricks & More... - Pro Tools Expert Blog
Like them or not, you have got to admit that Waves plugs are in use at a vast number of studios and most can not continue to work if they convert to HDX. That's just one of many problems.
I'm a native and therefore I don't care but this has got to be wrong. I have other problems. I'll put them in a different post just to make them clear.
OK. Please, tell me what I misunderstand. Please!
OK, for the natives, I believe we are sort of being forced into PT 10. Here is why. Again, I believe that I must be misunderstanding something. Please correct me.
AAX is the Avid 64 bit plug-in format of the future. Some third-party plug-in companies have already coded new versions of their products and many more have announced their intentions to do so in the near future. We can expect to see no more development of 'obsolete' RTAS plugs. There will come a day when in order to purchase a new plug-in for PT, it will be necessary to be able to do AAX. At that point, PT 9 and older will not be adequate.
Whenever Avid does go 64 bit (I assume that will be version 11), the understanding is that RTAS will no longer work.
"The RTAS and TDM formats will continue to be supported in the 32-bit versions of Pro Tools but will not be supported once Pro Tools is released as a 64-bit application." source= A New Plug-in Format, Really? Avid Answers Our Questions About AAX and Pro Tools (note: TDM already has problems!!! See above post.
So in order to use your old RTAS plugs & be able to use any new plugs, you must have the transitional PT 10. 9 or earlier won't work. 11 or later won't work. If you don't buy PT 10 now before 11 is released, you will be reduced to finding a copy of 10 on ebay if you want to continue to play. In that way, we are being forced to buy 10.
Someone tell me what I misunderstand.
Well I'm looking forward to this thread.
I'll start by saying I don't think Avid has a choice if they are to keep tight in the hardware business. We all know DAW's sound the same, right? They have got to get better, or pretend to get better, or there is no reason for the new DAW generation questioning all this hype, to spend hard to come by money on anything that smells like BS or trouble. And if it will convert TDM/ 32bit then what is it really. I bet there will be a lot of noise over that.
I don't think its going to roll out that clean and simple.
And this all being said, why are we trying to get better sound when the majority of the music buying generation is not even listening to the sound. Its really quite ironic. I have no need to go beyond 88.2 and I love how audio sounds through high end analog so this is going to get interesting.
mberry593: I don't think you are misreading anything. I've been to a couple of Avid presentations and they push a lot of hype but when you start asking questions, they get defensive real quick. It's funny how they revel at the fact that you can now have more than one plugin open at one time! More than one! Of course the way they presented it was " finally after ten years of requests, you can have more than one plugin open at one time!". As if this was some sort of revelation.
Don't get me wrong, I would love to have an HDX system with all the bells and whistles but I think for the price, I could have a pretty smokin analog console with digital capabilities, a nice interface, a new set of monitors and still have some change left over for a mic or two. That and I would bet it would run a lot smoother with Cubase,Sonar or just about any other DAW. I love the workflow in PT but the DAE errors get annoying. 24 tracks at about 20% cpu and I'm running out of power? Don't waste my time Avid.
64 bit plugins won't work with PT10 because PT10 is a 32 bit application. If you read between the lines PT10 is only AAX ready.
That and they were so proud that you could now do fades and dissolves without the program creating tons of little files. DUH, wow like Sony Vegas and others haven't been doing that for years already. I laughed when I heard that at their presentation this past October at the AES. I don't think that's anything to be proud of? It's like telling people at age 56, I no longer piss in my pants anymore.
I'm not saying anything about take two.
Mx. Remy Ann David
FWIW 10.2.0 is now available although they seem to be keeping quiet about it. Check your master account for the installer. I haven't done it yet.
I really want to invest in the basic Pro Tools again, for importing purposes, but I just can't bend over that hard yet. WTF are they doing to us. I think this company is way too top heavy. Hueseph, I always have a chuckle with you on these. I'm sure we are not the most favorite tag team when it comes to PT here. ROTF.
I'm trying to accept this all. Maybe I should buy a few good bottles of 18 year old scotch to help push me into PT 10. What do you think?
I can tell you that I'm in the good books with Brian Carter :tongue:. Yup. Asked one too many pertinent questions at the HDX presentation. I asked two questions. 1: Will PT support RTAS when it is 64 bit? 2: What will happen with all the current plugins that we've already paid for? Will we get AAX versions or have to pay for them? He was not happy with me.
I really want to like Pro Tools but I can't get over the DAE errors. It's a bit of a joke. I shouldn't be having issues at under 24 tracks. Maybe it's because of the UAD card but it works fine in Sonar.
This was posted at the DUC.
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