Question: A Whole New Level?

Discussion in 'Mastering' started by Eric B, Jul 14, 2004.

  1. Eric B

    Eric B Guest

    Here's one for the Rock & Rollers,

    I've recently been coming across a few commercial records that seem to have brought a whole new level of play to the volume war game.

    These new recordings aren't any louder that the going rate (-10db RMS - Damn Loud). What's impressive is the fact that the sound waveforms maintain most of their transient info. There is only a miniscule amount of the square wave chop normally associated with mastering this loud.

    The best example I can think of would probably be the new album from Velvet Revolver (Featuring esteemed alumni of Guns & Roses and Stone Temple Pilots) Mastered at Sterling by George Marino.

    The new Thornley record is like that too.

    Check it out - It's really starting to make me wonder if there are a few new secret weapons out there...

    Cheers,
    Eric
     
  2. huub

    huub Guest

    the nerd and justin timberlake stuff is LOUUDD!! but it sounds really clear and not squased!! some serious mastering magic is going on!! the foo fighters albums is loud, but sounds clipped and pumping..
    no answer to your question, just wanted to share my enthousiasm...
     
  3. Eric B

    Eric B Guest

    Hey Huub,

    Yeah, that Foo Fighters is loud and the waveform is really clipped - Sounds good, though, like you said the pumping is really audible - I'll have to give the Nerd and Timberllake a test drive soon. Thanks.

    Cheers
    Eric
     
  4. mixandmaster

    mixandmaster Active Member

    Could be M-S technique or "parallel" compression. :? It's not too tough to get that type of result using parallel - just more work. You got to be EXTREMELY careful to keep everything in phase.
     
  5. Ben Godin

    Ben Godin Active Member

    what is this parallel technique, could you elaborate? :cool:
     
  6. mixandmaster

    mixandmaster Active Member

    Here's a short explaination from the waves website...You can use it with any compressor/limiter.

    What they don't tell you is to make sure the resulting processing is IN PHASE with the original - I know I said this in the other post, but it's crucial to using this technique. Also make sure you don't clip the main bus. :cool:

    It's simple but will take some experimentation on your end. Be patient, it DOES work.
     
  7. Ben Godin

    Ben Godin Active Member

    i have used the compressor pump technique on many snare drums, yes set the thresh to -30 ratio 10:1, now what do you mean by making the two tracks in PHASE, does this mean that they need to blend into each other or what?
     
  8. Eric B

    Eric B Guest

    Indeed, parallel compressing works great - we used to do this trick on analog desks on the drums and vocals - we called it "back busing".

    There's a full explanation of the process at

    http://www.nthelp.com/mastering/faq/specialtechniques.htm

    In the digital world, this trick works just as well. As Mixandmaster says, this second track must be in phase with the original.

    Keep in mind that plugins sometimes create a certain amount of sample delay, and this can cause the compressed track to be out of phase with the uncompressed track. You will immediately hear if there is phase problem, it's drastic...

    To quickly remedy the situation, simply use another instance the same plug with a neutral setting on the unprocessed track. All the plugin does is delay the uncompressed track to delay it by the same amount as the compressed one.

    Also, M-S techniques are very effective at getting more level without hurting the stereo image - they even enhance the stereo spead somewhat.

    Cheers,
    Eric
     
  9. mixandmaster

    mixandmaster Active Member

    The phasing will almost sound weirder the closer you get it. If you're way off, it will sound like slapback delay. When you're about 4 samples off the high end will be hotter, once you get around 1 or 2 samples, it will be midrangey, then.....you get it locked in.

    To be safe, bounce the processed tracks to a new track, and visually line them up. Then bounce the mix together without any plugins in the chain. :twisted:
     

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