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r&b sound

Discussion in 'Recording' started by joshua m.d., Dec 2, 2002.

  1. joshua m.d.

    joshua m.d. Guest

    hey... for those of you who do r&b recording... looking to record male vox. Please suggest some mic/pre's that have that sound...
     
  2. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Distinguished Member

    Neve 1073, 1081,Api pres, Akg C12, C12a or Neumann U87ai. Fats
     
  3. Bob Olhsson

    Bob Olhsson Distinguished Member

    I don't think the mike pre is nearly as big a deal as the mike and the studio acoustics because you are talking about people who can really sing. It's a lot closer to recording opera than rock and roll.

    The classic setup is either a good quality condenser with the singer moving between six inches and five feet from the mike in a well isolated studio or a dynamic such as an RE-20 or SM-57 used up close.
     
  4. joshua m.d.

    joshua m.d. Guest

    considering good mic technique and good room acoustics.. what gear would you use?
     
  5. Bob Olhsson

    Bob Olhsson Distinguished Member

    My first choice mikes would probably be a U-67, a Schoepps, a Beyer condnser or one of those expensive Sonys. I'd also have an RE-20 and an SM-57 handy because some people just plain sound better with them.
     
  6. suspec57

    suspec57 Guest

    I use an Avalon 737Vt with my BlueBerry and it sounds great for RnB. If I had the money though, I would invest in a M49 or the M149 with either Massenburg or Neve pres.
     
  7. Pez

    Pez Active Member

    If I was serious about R&B then I would get a bunch of the Atlantic/Stax stuff to use as reference CDs. Analog tape is a big part of that sound IMHO. Also get Duck Dunn to play bass and record the drums so that you can't hear the kick ;-)!
     
  8. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Distinguished Member

    I am a BIG Atlantic Records freak! Actually I can hear the kick on that stuff just fine. It just doesn't sound like a basketball hitting the floor. Most those drum tracks were done with one overhead and one in front. Duck Dunn does have the groove and he keeps it in the pocket!
    When I was a teenager (and I didn't know better) I went to the Fillmore to see Frank Zappa. Booker T and THe MG's opened and BB King was the headliner with The Mothers as the middle act! It turned out that Booker T and The MG's backed up BB King and in the middle of his set, BB King brought ALBERT King on stage to play!. WOW! Booker T and The MG's backing up BB King and Albert King. Best concert I ever saw! If you're into the Atlantic Records thing, check out recent articles on the late Tom Dowd that have appeared in Mix and EQ. Also available is "The Atlantic Records Story" on video. Yep Atlantic Record, Stax w/ Booker T., Muscle Shoals and The Swampers! Probably some of the best stuff that will ever be recorded. Rock On!
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to!
     
  9. Fats... what a concert! 1st time I saw the Mothers it was with The Paul Butterfield Blues Band (w/Elvin Bishop and Bloomfield) .. great show, and then I was sitting outside the Boston Tea Party, and an Olds Vista-Cruiser wagon drives up with the James Cotton Band .. helped load the equipment in, and then we ended up seeing Big Mama Thornton (she wrote the original Hound Dog),James Cotton, and Albert King. $6 for both shows (1 hr each band x 2 shows =6 hrs of what it's all about).
    BTW, I have some Atlantic test pressings of Aretha, and Ray Charles stuff... some released, one never released.. there was a guy named George who cut 90% off all of those records. He never let anyone in the room with him... Smart Man! Stax, Atlantic .. some of the best, you bet.. Booker, Steve, and Duck.. what can you say? It's a lesson for anybody.
     
  10. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Distinguished Member

    I got to see Butterfield at Provo Park in Berkeley at a free concert!. They use to have a free concert every Saturday Afternoon. I saw Country Joe and the Fish there too. I was real fortunate that I grew up in the 60's and 70's in the SF Bay Area. A lot of good music...
    I saw Cream in the Farewell Tour at Oakland Coliseum and the Jefferson Airplane and the Original Santana at the Maritime hall in SF. When I was 13 I went and stayed in the Haight Ashbury. That was in '67 "the Summer of Love".. Fats
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    Tannoys, Dynaudio, Blue Sky, JBL, Earthworks, Westlake, NS 10's :D , Genelec, Hafler, KRK.
    Those are good. …………………….. Pick one.
    It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to!
     
  11. Marty Gilman

    Marty Gilman Guest

    K-sound,

    Interesting seeing you mention the Bosotn Tea Party. My former band, the Bagatelle, was the house band there for quite a long time. We played with the Velvet Underground and many others that came into town.

    Do you remember the band?

    -Marty
     
  12. Pez

    Pez Active Member

    I love that Booker T stuff. I've always been a Hammond freak. I remember hauling a B3 and two huge Leslies up two flights of stairs when I was gigging in college. What a pain in the ass but there is no way to duplicate that sound without the real thing.
    Fats, sounds like you were in the right place at the right time. I didn't make it out to San Francisco until the early 70's. Remember Country Joe's "Electric Music for the mind and body" LP?
    Arthur Lee and Love? I was also always a big fan of John Cippolina when he played with Quicksilver. I didn't listen to that band much after he was gone. Anyway- we digress. I also love the Atlantic records stuff and have no problems with that drum sound whatsoever. From what I've heard Cropper seldom changed his strings. He liked the sound of the old strings.
     
  13. cjenrick

    cjenrick Active Member

    Does anybody know who was hangin out at the Shoals when Duane was a studio musician there?
    My first concert was going to be Cream after the Disraeli Gears album. Had a ticket, but my mom wouldn't let me go. She didn't want me to be around any uncontrolled substances. Darn!
    So CTA was my first show at the San Jose County Fairgrounds, 1971 ?

    Just a little too young for Jimi at the Filmore, but had friends tell me about it. Mainly the volume, and all the different stuff being ingested by Jimi backstage!
    Many Winterland shows. Bill Graham used to videotape every show there. I wonder what happened to those tapes!
     
  14. Doublehelix

    Doublehelix Well-Known Member

    Ahhh...the memories! My first concert memories were of a concert at the outdoor ampitheatre at Stanford University. My friend and I were walking around outside after hearing the music (I grew up 2 blocks from the campus until about 3rd grade), and the guys at the gate just let us in for free! Those were the days of "peace and love", and I guess they knew we didn't have any money. This was probably...geez...1967-1969ish??? I saw both my older sister and older brother there...jumping the fence...hehe...those were the days!

    The headliner was The Chamber's Brothers...they were on a roll with their big hit "Time has come today", but there were about 5 or 6 other bands that played that day...including Quicksilver and the original Santana. I was really too young to know what was going on, but I do remember that at one point, everybody was standing, and we couldn't see, and a couple of big hippies picked us up and put us on their shoulders so we could see...pretty cool!

    You're right Fats...growing up the Bay Area in the 60's/70's was pretty cool! I remember lots of free concerts in Golden Gate Park (people that at the time I had no idea who they were...), and being dragged around in a VW bus with my older sister and her boyfriend while they smoked weed...hehe...long hair...beads...bell bottoms...sheesh! What great memories!

    Alvin Lee and Ten Years After at the Fillmore...I became a lifetime fan of Alvin Lee after that show, and started playing guitar just because of watching him! :)

    Then came the 70's...I remember seeing Led Zeppelin at the Oakland Colosium on July 4th/5th, 1977 along with Rick Derringer and somebody else...those were the famous shows when Plant's son died or got sick or something...I remember waiting for about 3 hours for Zeppelin to take the stage on the 5th, and when they finally did, they really sucked!

    Peter Framton at Winterland, and then later at the Oakland Colosium...by then, he had gotten way too commercial for me...

    We should probably move this converstation to a new thread, since it is starting to move pretty far away from the original intent of "r&b sound".
     
  15. Screws

    Screws Active Member

    Ahhh, 60's and 70's music. My favorite memories...

    The Chambers Brothers at the Electric Circus in Greewich Village. Pass the acid.

    Iron Butterfly at the Fillmore East. This was right after the release of "In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida" and they were appearing with a new, unknown, previously unheard opening act that proceeded to blow them off the stage. Led Zeppelin!

    Cream "Goodbye" concert at Madison Square Garden. I've never heard Clapton play with this much fire since.

    Deep Purple at Allentown Pa. Speedway. Sheer volume. NRBQ was also very cool, alas, too cool for the crowd that came for the volume.

    Bootsie's Rubber Band in Warren Ohio. As loud as Deep Purple, but with moments of amazing death-defying instantaneous stop-on-a-dime changes of max volume to almost dead zero silence, followed by the slowest ramping up to loud I've ever heard. Funk with fire and outstanding musicianship, including Macio Parker and the JB Horns.

    Just the highlights.
     
  16. e-cue

    e-cue Active Member

    In general, The Night Pro, A 1073 ( just the pre, NO eq which sounds too phase shifty to my ears) into a LA 2A (dark), or a 737. Try to consider the entire chain. A Sony 800g or U67 tube are my current favs for male R&B vox into an MP-1, the a designs version, into a distressor which gives me a lot of options, into an Avalon 2055 or a GML 8200 depending on the darkness/brightness I'm looking for and if I need to do some carving out.
     

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