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RecorderMan's Take on PT HD

Discussion in 'Pro Audio Equipment' started by RecorderMan, Jan 25, 2002.

  1. RecorderMan

    RecorderMan Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2001
    I'd like to go out on a limb here and make a prediction. I believe that the reccent release of Pro Tools HD at the winter NAMM is just the opening salvo in the launch of PT HD.
    1. If you do a search for digidesign on a Mac with OSX, you'll find three empty folders. (as a side:I've heard rumours that digi is working closely with Mac on Mac's soun card) What gifts will these trojan horses bring?
    2. They haven't released there Midi interface untill OMS2 is ready. Which is probably of OSX.

    I believe that the big changes we want in the software are going to be implemented when digi moves to OSX. It makes sense. Why make revolutionary improvements on 9.x when you HAVE to also spend time getting prepared for OSX. It just doesn't make sense to do a major changes in 9.x; They couldn't come out with both now. So rather than wait they decided to do it in two parts. New Hardware now...next the new software. They wanted to start the ball rolling, shore up market share, and amke the bottom loine look better for Avid, especially in the midst of the recession.
    It will be then that they have a level of OS stability and inprovements that they'll Launch PT 6.x . I'll bet at Summer NAMM .

    Probably a little after the June30 deadline to Update. By that time all the third parties will have gotten there stuff mostly in line.

    The HardWare just released is only the prelude.....mark my words


    ....anyway...what do you think?
     
  2. I think that the smartest thing I ever did was to go freelance and let the studio owners worry about all of this upgrade stuff. All I know is that I take my work to the best place for the project I am working on. All of the announcements of new software, new hardware, upgrades, compatability issues, etc..., don't phase me in the least. It is the studios job to sort out these things.

    I don't bring in as much as I used to when I owned a studio, but I take home a lot more, and I have a lot more fun. Every studio owner in the area treats me very well because they want my consistent business. And my work sounds better because I am not limited by the particular studio I am stuck in. The funny thing is that I am actually able to complete a better sounding project for less money than I used to.

    To sum up... 1)I am happier because I don't have the expense of keeping a studio running and on the cutting edge of technology. And I keep more of the money I make. 2)My clients are happier because I can make a better product for less money. 3)The local studio owners are happy because they have a new customer, a former competitor, who brings them regular work.
     
  3. RecorderMan

    RecorderMan Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2001
    Originally posted by Lord Alvin:
    I think that the smartest thing I ever did was to go freelance and let the studio owners worry about all of this upgrade stuff. All I know is that I take my work to the best place for the project I am working on. All of the announcements of new software, new hardware, upgrades, compatability issues, etc..., don't phase me in the least. It is the studios job to sort out these things.

    I don't bring in as much as I used to when I owned a studio, but I take home a lot more, and I have a lot more fun. Every studio owner in the area treats me very well because they want my consistent business. And my work sounds better because I am not limited by the particular studio I am stuck in. The funny thing is that I am actually able to complete a better sounding project for less money than I used to.

    To sum up... 1)I am happier because I don't have the expense of keeping a studio running and on the cutting edge of technology. And I keep more of the money I make. 2)My clients are happier because I can make a better product for less money. 3)The local studio owners are happy because they have a new customer, a former competitor, who brings them regular work.


    ...I think you have an amazingly good point there...
     
  4. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2001
    But little of it is about PTHD! I USED to feel like that (how great it is not to own a studio) I am SURE I will again sometime! (but hopefully not SOON!)

    :)
     
  5. Julian Standen wrote:

    But little of it is about PTHD! I USED to feel like that (how great it is not to own a studio) I am SURE I will again sometime! (but hopefully not SOON!)




    I think I was on topic, I just have a different point of view, that's all. If more professionals would choose freelancing over studio ownership, the studio owners could more easily afford to keep up with the constant upgrades. I can't wait for all of you to upgrade so I can use your PTHD systems and make some money. :D
     
  6. I don't see how OSX can sound any better than OS9x with a Pro Tools TDM Mix or HD system. It all comes down to front end tracking with high quality converters and tight digital clock syncing which we have had for sometime, along with high quality mics, pre-amps, compressors, and a great sounding room. This is where 99% of high quality audio is produced. IMO all of this HD high sample rate stuff is pure BS, and nothing more than a means in order to try to get studios to spend more money on worthless crap.

    I think the most worthwhile computer based tools to come our way in recent times are the TDM Sony Oxfordplug-insand Altiverb for DP3. Both of theseplug-insare truly amazing and don't get any better than this! The soon to be released Logic version 5 appears to be a major and worthwhile upgrade and an excellent front end for Pro Tools, along with Emagic's ESB/TDM bridge, which gives access to both TDM and otherplug-ins

    Just look at all of the millions of people who think that MP3's sound great! That has to tell us something.

    Kip
    Bardstown Audio

    http://www.bardstownaudio.com
     
  7. RecorderMan

    RecorderMan Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2001
    ...believe me Jules (and you can ask Mixerman about this)...being positive is not something I'm known for. But I do feel positive about the future of this format. Or maybe your right...just wishfull thinking. I'm not a computer or math wiz (although that was my one of my majors for a while...).
    Anyway, I've got to run to a session...will cognate more on this later.

    P.S. If you liked the Oxford?GML plug in WAIT till the Massenburg EQ plug in comes out...HF up to 29K....
     
  8. dave-G

    dave-G Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2001
    Location:
    Florida
    Home Page:
    I'm not sure on what your optimism could be founded. Certainly there will be incremental improvements in PT software over time as there has been in every previous incarnation of ProTools. However, this hardware seems to have many of the same limits as the current Mix systems, thus preventing it from being "completed" by software revisions in a way that would satisfy folks with concerns about the sound of mixing in PT. Many of us were hoping for HD to significantly upgrade the sound of mixing "in the box", and yet as I understand it, the "new" TDM II bus is still a fixed 24 bit data path. HD's only major sonic refinement is in what the higher sampling rates will give you, and maybe the converters ... as far as I can tell. (Of course, we haven't heard the thing yet....

    To me, looking forward to a forthcoming software redesign is essentially looking forward to a cosmetic and perhaps ergonomic changes. HD's harware restrictions and "TDM II" makes it seem pretty much assured that HD at 24/44.1 oughtta sound a lot like a Mix system with the dithered mixer. It seems likely that the only sonic improvements will come from higher sampling rates, and possibly better conversion. Yipee.

    -dave
     
  9. RecorderMan

    RecorderMan Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2001
    wow...I guess call me "alice"...as I appear to be living in wonderland.

    Well...How about this. I just keep my Mix+, and put more money away for retirement?

    Is it purely a Bit issue...meaning...we can't get better quality unless we go to 32bit, etc?
    Won't the ability for Plugs nad Digi software to work at 24bit /96K internally give us better resolution?
     
  10. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2001
    I may stick at Mix + but look to exploration of external / analog summing of my rigs outputs as the "missing link" ..

    See here

    http://dangerousmusi c.com/2-bus.htm

    Or I may try to make my own.... from neve parts.

    The quest continues for the hip, easy to use, feature packed and low operating cost and good sounding recording system.

    :)

    Jules
     
  11. Jon Atack

    Jon Atack Guest

    Howz the saying go? Quality, fast, or cheap....choose two.

    Actually, it's more like choose one...and hope for a bit of a second one.

    Oh yeah, PT HD. I was excited for a couple of days, but now it's like HD rhymes with BFD, at least for the moment.

    Jon
     
  12. Hi Jon & Jules,
    How's the SSL? I'm about to get the Amek any day now and I'm getting quite excited. Hope it works out like I expect it to. I'm getting a 1/2" to go along with it. I'll keep the PT rig, non upgraded, on the front end. Hope you are doing well. Hey Jules I will let you know how I end up sonically once I'm online. This board is quite cool. I played with it in Nashville last month and was quite impressed. I took my SPA .9 67 with me. The eq/pre was nice and headroom appeared abundant. We will see.

    Thanks,
    Ted.
     
  13. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2001
    Which Amek?
    :)
    :w:
     
  14. Sorry, the Media 51 44ch. It really does sound good. In fact everyone I've talked to says it sounds much better than the Rembrandt at over 1/2 it's cost and it's certainly much quieter. It has the same full blown Supertrue auto ver.4(pretty much everything in vca recall) that the 9098i uses and it uses the same exact power supply as the 9098i except there is only one instead of I think 15! that come with the 9098i. Also, It's only 5' wide w/o patch bay.

    It's kinda funny, Neve designed the pres/eq, etc... in the 90981 and on the other end of the spectrum did the pres, eq, high pass filters(which is very nice for a board at this cost) on this little board. I guess they had some problems with the Rembrandt w/RN modules overheating and headroom problems with the Bigs but this is a completely different animal even though it lives in a Big chassis. I think, for the price, it will be a good board for them. Total recall and 5.1 ability for less than 80K RETAIL makes it the only game in it's price range. I guess I will know how good in a couple of weeks or so. I just can't wait to get back to some knobs and buttons. I seem to do better in that environment.
    Thanks,
    Ted.
     
  15. RandomGuest

    RandomGuest Guest

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2001
    How many channels? (I wasnt folowing the other thread on it much, sorry)

    I had a great 3 year run on an Amek Hendrix with Super True automation / dynamics. I used ext pre's all the time, but your channels will be way better...!!!

    :)
     
  16. 44 channels/108inputs. I have quite a bit of outboard as you know and I probably ought to get the frame extension and the patchbay. I haven't had one for PT and it hasn't bothered me much. I sure hope this board makes the difference I'm looking for. I talked to John French At JRF Magnetics about a 1/2", souped up, Studer he has for sale to mix to from the Media. That's about as far as I'd like to get into tape machines. Any thoughts?
    Thanks,
    Ted.l
     
  17. erockerboy

    erockerboy Guest

    Hey Ted,

    I would love to hear all the juicy details about this setup once you get it running. I am contemplating a very similar move myself (was actually looking at a Media 51 too!) and I'll be particularly keen to hear your impressions of the DAW front end + Amek back end in terms of sound quality, recallability, ease of use etc.

    Good luck!!
     
  18. Thanks! if you want to fly out when I get done you are certainly welcome. It will be in my new house. I will keep you posted.
    Thanks,
    Ted.
     
  19. I will be tracking and mixing a demo for a local band at the end of this week on a Media 51. It will be recorded to PT and mixed to 1/2". I can't wait to hear this board. It looks fantastic. I will tell you what I think of it when I am done.
     
  20. spp

    spp Guest

    Originally posted by RecorderMan:
    I'd like to go out on a limb here and make a prediction. I believe that the reccent release of Pro Tools HD at the winter NAMM is just the opening salvo in the launch of PT HD.


    I agree. And I'm surprised at all the comments that the changes to the system were not "big" enough.

    Bottom line -- if one can't get a great sound out of Pro Tools - using the dithered mixer, good converters, and good pres -- then it's not the fault of the system.
     

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