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recording drums with 4 inputs!!

Discussion in 'Drums' started by skankin, Jan 1, 2006.

  1. skankin

    skankin Guest

    i would like some recomendations on how to place my mics to get a nice "punchy" sound.
    my current set up is

    a akg 112 kick drum mic
    a shure sm-57 for snare
    and 2 akg c 430 over head mics (x y pattern)

    what do u guys think? is it really that bad if i dont mic the toms?
     
  2. not at all, depending on were you place the over heads, you should be fine
    i'm a drummer, and have my own little home studio started, and i've gotten a pretty good recording out of just one dynamic mic (like ur sm57) right up high over the bass drum, the only this was it was a little more difficult to hear the bass drum.

    right now i use a setup up 2 overhead mics one to the left side of th bass, and the other likewise to the right. i also have mic for my bass drum. if you wanna mic the snare, go ahead, but me pesonally i haven't ever found it necessary. your over heads should pic it up fine.

    i hope this helped you out.
    -Ron
    http://myspace.com/zpearldrummerz
    http://myspace.com/thealta
    http://purevolume.com/thealta
     
  3. Sidhu

    Sidhu Active Member

    Using the OV's in XY might just pose a problem.. espessially if ure drummer has a ride far off... I use 4 (often 3, or 2).

    I place the OV's (very vague and varies a lot) roughly above the outer rims of the two rack toms...

    A lot of effort goes into ensuring a spot where I get a good tom sound, and balanced cymbals (i usually move cymbals around a bit), including the hihat. Also taken into account is the stereo image, keeping the snare in the center. The OV's are not placed very high, max a foot and a half above the racks, almost at level with the crash cymbals... and the two mics have varied heights (this is to mantain equal distance from the snare).

    and then there is phase. Sometimes, i get the two OV's in phase to find the snare mic totally out.... inverting the phase on the snare mic does the trick beautifully.

    Also worth mentioning, a kit less than average sounding (thats the best we get here) and ure technique goes for a toss. If you are interested I can upload a short audio clip.


    Regards,
    Sidhu


    p.s. please criticise my method.
     
  4. Chappy

    Chappy Guest

    a method that i've been using lately is a blend between the recorderman technique and a technique I read about in "Mixing with you mind" (great book by the way). I get the drummer to walk around the room with his floor tom hitting it and listening for resonance. Where i find the best low end, the floor tom goes there and the drummer sets up around it. (this should only take a couple of minutes max) Once the kit is setup, i get the drummer to hit the floor tom again and I listen to where the "bloom" is (bloom = nice round low end) and the first OH goes there.

    From there the recorderman method takes over. I measure the distance the first mic is from the snare and place the second OH over the snare at the same distance. (sometimes i point the mic straight down at the snare, and other times i point it at the rack tom)

    That's just what I've been doing. I found that the low end from the floor tom is much more natural using this technique. The low end is allowed to blossum further from the tom.
     
  5. Reggie

    Reggie Well-Known Member

    Having used those particular C430 mics before, I can tell you they suck for trying to pick up the whole kit. If you use them to pick up plenty of snare or toms, the cymbals sound dull, and vice versa. I found the best way to use them is to have your left mic pointing through the near edge of the left cymbal to the snare (or rack tom may work best in your situation), and the right mic pointing through the edge of the right cymbal toward the floor tom. You pretty much have to have the instruments you want the mic to pick up in a direct line with the mic. I think they are better as just cymbal mics.



    Your method sucks, dude. It is no good. :lol: There. Happy? :D
     
  6. Sidhu

    Sidhu Active Member

    Jeez!!!~ I took you seriously there for a moment!!! :-?
     
  7. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    The 430 is an alright mic. I like em better on acoustic instruments as I find their pattern to be really tight. Where this is not a bad problem with any mic, its unlikely to cover an entire kit although the X/Y patterning should do you quite well. Its all I do with my overheads these days after years of the Recorderman/Mixing With You Mind method. Comparing many tracks using both methods have illuminated it for me. The X/Y virtually eliminates all phase problems and gives you a true stereo center image to deal with. I put mine up on a large boom with wheels so I can adjust them easily. Perhaps you are simply needing a touch more refinement in your set-up to make go as it should.
     
  8. Sidhu

    Sidhu Active Member

    Hi dave!

    I too have tried recording drums with the OV's in XY, but i find that unless we have th rest of the kit close miced, or we are looking at a very natural drum sound (which is mostly limited to jazz) Overheads in this configuration do not yeild a tight, close, rock/metal sound (one reason I believe is because we need to have the ov's, when in xy, to be at a good height). Could you please share your thoughts ?

    thanks

    Sidhu
     

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