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Recording guitar cabs - post production

Discussion in 'Guitars' started by Clowd, Oct 3, 2006.

  1. Clowd

    Clowd Guest

    Hey guys, I'm looking for advice on recording guitar cabs, mainly in regards to production... compression, eq, etc... I have my mic placements and things figured out and everything, but I can't seem to get a really powerful sound.. what do the pros do when they record guitars?

    Any advice is appreciated.

    Thanks.
     
  2. MilesAway

    MilesAway Guest

    They spend a lot of time on mic placement... :wink:

    1 - Get the sound you want FROM YOUR AMP. If you can't get it here, you're SOL from the get-go... think about renting/buying new guitars/amps.
    2 - Spend however long it takes with mic-placement to get the sound coming out of your monitors to match what's coming out of your amp.
    3 - Record.
     
  3. Clowd

    Clowd Guest

    That's all it takes to get a super powerful guitar sound?
     
  4. moonbaby

    moonbaby Mmmmmm Well-Known Member

    Well, you really DO have to start there. If the sound coming out of the amp doesn't cut it, then you have to go back and start over...
    There are also many other factors to consider, as well. Room acoustics, mic choice and placement (previously stated), recording media, blah,blah, blah.
    But the numero uno is the player, the ax, and the amp. Until you get that right, all the EQ, compression, and digital widgets ain't gonna matter.
     
  5. Clowd

    Clowd Guest

    Well I have all my parts rehearsed 100%, and my gear is definitely all set... an LTD ec-1000 through a mesa single rectifier, it sounds incredible through the amp, but once I record it, it just looses a lot of power. I'm fooling around with mic placement right now.
     
  6. pr0gr4m

    pr0gr4m Well-Known Member

    Can you give us an example of the type of guitar sound your looking for, like a band or guitarist?

    Anyway, one thing people will do is record multiple tracks of the same guitar part. Then they will blend them together using panning or a small bit of delay to one or more of the tracks. This can help to spread the sound out and give it a more full sound.

    Another thing you might want to try rather than moving the mic around is try using a different mic or multiple mics. The sound you hear from the cabinet is the combined sound from all speakers. One mic on one speaker will most likely not get that same sound.
     
  7. CoryX

    CoryX Guest

    If you are using two mics to mic the cab, such as a condenser and dynamic. swivle the condenser around for the reason of phase. if phase is your problem, you will immediatly hear the tone beef up once the condenser is in its 'hot spot'

    and also. Dont eq your mics with alot of treble.... geh... but thats just my advice man
     
  8. alimoniack

    alimoniack Guest

    Ah those fizzy mesa's.

    Saturation usually equals lack of "chunk" as far as a '57 is concered, look into alternative/double micing for an answer. Make sure the cab has no oddly cut metal grille and spend time ampside wearing cans, inching mics around.

    Use less distortion/saturation than live, it's always intensified on tape...be prepared to boost low fundamentals if you wanna hear a tune! Is it heavy music? To hell with how good it sounds live, what's hitting tape? Change sound accordingly.

    Heavy gtrs are always a tricky production call...good luck!
     
  9. separation

    separation Guest

    kinda depends on what you are using to record with too. If you are going to a 16 bit soundcard its not gonna have the same sound as a 24 bit card. What kind of A/D converters are you using? This will change the sound that you are hearing. Recording at 16 bit and 44.1 kHz is not going to be the same as 24 bit and 192kHz where I would suspect most of the pro studios are doing.

    As everyone is saying mic placement is a huge part of it. The room will be an issue especially if you are using a condensor mic set back away from the amp. What someone mentioned about spending time with cans moving mics around the amp is so true. I spent days with cans on and people playing my rig (Ernie Ball John Petrucci music man, Mesa Triple Rectifier Head, Mesa 4x12 Standard Cab) moving different mics in place and using different mics through the 4x12 cab to get the sound I wanted. I ended up putting tape on the cab so I could mark the spots of the sweet spot of the cab. I was shocked to hear how different each speaker sounded like through my cab. They all have their own sound and then as a whole they have their own sound. I basically decided that since each mic has its own sound that I would use the capabilities of each mic along with mic placement to find the right sound. NO EQ. Just moving the mics around is like moving an EQ knob.

     
  10. cusebassman

    cusebassman Active Member

    As far as compression and EQ are concerned, go with what people have been suggesting... work with the amp sound, and if that is in fact all well and good, work with mics and mic placement. Playing an archtop or Les Paul through my Fender tube amp, after I get the sound I want, its all about the mics. I just monitor what's coming through the signal chain and out to the mixer and try and get that sound as close to what I want as possible. I am usually able to get a great sound using a Sennheiser e609 and an MXL 604 with the high-pass filter enabled (That's one high-SPL dynamic mic and a small-condensor cardiod)... it gives me a rich high end but also maintains the low end that I had been missing using only a condensor (large OR small diaphragm) mic.
     
  11. Rokoko

    Rokoko Guest

    Separation, what kind of grill do you have on Mesa Cab? Did you tried removing the grill? Is there any difference?

     
  12. THeBLueROom

    THeBLueROom Guest

    if you have the stock, put two different mics (i use a 57 and a 421) at the pretty much the same location(no phase problems) just different angles & run them thru two different high quality mic pres (I use and API 512c and an A-Designs P-1), get the sounds you want from the amp and blend the two signals accordingly. I find I have a LOT more sound to play with and get right later if I need to. Your guitar sound will sound different in context, meaning when all else (drums,bass, vox) are going, than the guitar will sound just from listening to it by itself. I always record two guitar tracks along with processed drums and a bass track for about a minute, pan them full stereo and then listen back. If that doesn't sound like you want it to, change the mic positioning. Context is everything. Bass tracks are as important to your guitar tone as the amp you are using. Get them right as well.
     
  13. Davedog

    Davedog Distinguished Member

    Blue room has hit it right. All in fact have got it spot on.. I hope you're not listening to the sound soloed up and thinking that this is where you need to change it.....IN CONTEXT..this is where the actual use of the sound is going to be.
    It sounds to me like you are recording fairly loud...Loud in that it sounds great out in the room but gets smaller after hitting tape...or DAW...or whatever..Its situations like this where the guitarist needs to get OUT of the recording area and play the parts from the booth. You'll get a broader sense of where the sound is at when you arent part of the large spl's permeating your body and phones..It takes some getting used to, but it makes making decisions about the sound so much easier.
     

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