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Recording Studio Problems; Setup

Discussion in 'Recording' started by Subrecordingstudios, May 22, 2004.

  1. Hi, I have a problem with wiring my setup for multi-track recording. I currently am running a 24-track Behringer mixer, and mixing down into two tracks which run into a Delta 1010. Then, that runs into my computer via the PCI card included with the interface. All of the audio is mixed with Sonar 3 Producer Edition.

    Because of how it mixes down between the Behringer and Delta 1010 interface, I cannot record each track separately into the PC.

    For example, I would want to record each drum (i.e. bass, snare, hats, floor tom) separately into the computer via a digital setup, but the Behringer MX2442A mixer doesn't allow that very well.

    I was wondering, what style PCI card or mixer would I need that would allow me to record say 16 tracks separately onto the PC, and then mix each one on the PC? I was considering the Soundcraft Spirit 328 digital mixer to use as both a mixer and controller, but I am unsure of the PCI card that would allow at least 16 tracks of recording and allow the mixer to run into the PC.

    Basically, my setup is:
    Behringer MX2442A-----DELTA 1010 INTERFACE-----DELTA 1010 PCI CARD-----PC

    I am aiming for:
    SOUNDCRAFT SPIRIT 328-----PCI CARD (Not sure what would work)---PC

    Please, someone respond if this setup would work.

    ~John, http://www.subrecordingstudios.bravehost.com/
     
  2. mjones4th

    mjones4th Active Member

    According to behringer's documentation, there are several ways your could get more simultaneous channels out of your current rig.

    1. Using the insert point of a given channel to send that channel separately to the 1010. What you do is get a cable known as an Insert cable, its basically a Y cable. Take the stereo end and plug it into the insert point of the given channel on the MX2442A. Take one of the other ends, labelled Tip, and plug it into the 1010. That's it! Now that channel is sent directly to the 1010 and doesn't show up at the main outputs.

    You can have up to 8 channels going directly to the 1010 with this method. And if you need more channels, buy another 1010. The disadvantage is that inserts are usually pre-fader, meaning you can't adjust the levels of the tracks, at least not with the mixer, you would need to do it inside sonar. Another drawback (or benefit depending on who you ask) is that the EQ circuit is also bypassed.

    2. Use the Aux sends. the MX has 6 aux channels, which are usually used to configure effects routing. That's 6 dedicated feeds directly to your 1010, with the advantage that you can send several channels to one track in Sonar (as an example, recording all backing vocals onto one track)

    3. Use subgroups. There are six possible outputs for a channel: Stereo main output, and two stereo subgroups. By using the pan knob on a channel, you can use these stereo outputs as 6 mono outputs.

    4. You can use a combination of the methods above.

    Method 1 is the simplest but least flexible. the other two will take some head-scratching and a lot of tnkering
     
  3. Thanks for the help. I'll be trying out the first one today, as soon as I get hold of some cables.

    The only problem is, with the Delta 1010, on Sonar, it groups each two channels (it basically gives me the option of recording through 1/2, 3/4, 5/6, or 7/8.) If anyone knows how to solve this problem, please write back.

    I'll definitely try your idea out, though. but if I were to decide to switch to digital anyway, would you say the RME 9652 cards are decent cards to run with the Soundcraft Spirit Digital 328? I checked all of the documentation to see if they are compatible, which they are said to be recommended with use of the Soundcraft. I just have some questions.

    What do you use with the ADAT cables? Would that basically be sort of like the 25 pin cable that attaches the Delta to the card? I read about ADAT cables, and they say that they send 8 in/8 out.....so if I were to pick up two 9652 RME Hammerfall cards (on Ebay of course...I am on a budget), they would allow me to run 16 channels of audio from the digital mixer to the cards, and separate each channel like I was saying? (I basically have worked with analog equipment all of my life, so this digital stuff is a little intimidating.) The Soundcraft digital 328 mixer has 2 ADAT outs on it, and the cards have ADAT ins. Would that be sufficient for what I am trying to achieve?

    Plus, I would like to switch over to digital for the motorized faders and presets. You wouldn't believe how many times the faders get moved around when people bump into the mixer accidentally with their equipment. I do write it down, but its not always perfect each time, because I add a lot of gain to the kick drum, and it makes a fader a bit more "sensitive"..so it might be off a bit sometimes....but anyway, I'd like the preset configuration, where I am able to put it to the drum settings that I always have....plus, what's more fun than motorized faders?!

    Thanks again,

    John
     
  4. mjones4th

    mjones4th Active Member

    Sonar is probably defaulting to recording stereo files. I know the delta can treat each of its inputs and outputs as a separate entity. And I'm sure Sonar is capable of recording mono tracks. I wouldn't know how, as I've never used Sonar though.

    RME is one of the premier soundcard manufacturers. Its an excellent brand, and the 9652 is an excellent choice for dogotal recording, no matter what's on the other end of the cable. The 9652 has 3 ADAT ins and outs, so you would only need to buy one card, although it occupies two PCI slots

    Gotta run, I'll come back later and try to answer the rest of your Q's.

    Mark
     
  5. Alright, thanks. I couldn't find any way to make the Delta record separately, but I decided to go digital anyway. I am going to purchase a 9652 card with the Soundcraft mixer, and go full out with the digital setup.

    Plus, I just got a handmade Warrior guitar today, so I am a happy camper :)

    Thanks again
    John
     

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