1. Register NOW and become part of this fantastic knowledge base forum! This message will go away once you have registered.

school or equipment?

Discussion in 'Recording' started by doulos21, May 26, 2003.

  1. doulos21

    doulos21 Member

    hi guys im new to this form. Im 22 ive been mixing since i was 15 ive had 2 internships on my own and im starting in project studio recording.

    I curently have a 001 waves plug ins presonous digimax a blue tube art pres an 4 akg mics.
    a pair of c1000s a akg 4000b 3000 an 2000b
    an a nady drum mic kit that sucks. Im using alesis point sevens moniters and an old digital 20bit 8bus mixer similar to the 01v without moving faders. Im pretty much working on keeping everthing portable. heres my question ive worked over 3 years with the 001 and ive mixed 4 local albums that have sold very well but i want to get out of this home recording "label" and start to become a professional and im not quite sure what to do ive thought of going to full sail for education but thats at a cost of 34 grand for 1 year and a cost of a mackie d8b is what 5 grand? now for 30 grand i could have a very nice project studio for sure is there anything besides how to run a neve consol or ssl consol im goign to learn that i can justify spending 34 grand on that i cant learn else where? i just want to make music the rest of my life just dont know how to go about it lol
     
  2. Ethan Winer

    Ethan Winer Active Member

    Doulos,

    Excellent question.

    What you should do depends on how much you have already achieved on your own. Do you already understand all about signal flow, how to use an aux bus, what a compressor really does and how to use it to full advantage?

    If you already have a good grasp of the basics - "how audio stuff works" - then I suggest you continue on your own. When you want to consult with a pro to learn more about mixing and related skills, just buy some time in a pro studio and have a "real" engineer mix one of your projects while you watch and ask questions.

    --Ethan
     
  3. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    Also keep in mind that loans for an education is usualy alot easier to qualify for than loans for studio equipment.

    I would seek the rout of getting my foot into a pro facility as a runner. You could use half that $34k for living expenses :)
     
  4. doulos21

    doulos21 Member

    yeah i do have the basics and 3 years of electronic engineering under my belt. The idea of paying for a mixing engineers assistance is an awsome idea thanks thats what im lookin for. I have got the basics but im having a hard time finding info on some very important fundementals like getting good bass and kick seperation other then that my mixing skills are well above average "natural talent" so thanks for the feed back :)
     
  5. doulos21

    doulos21 Member

    i really dont need loans for studio equipments thats what my crap job is for in fact thats all its for lol ive going to invest about 8 grand into my porject studio this year alone
     
  6. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Distinguished Member

    What I do is I usually put a bit of a narrow dip in the eq on the kick at about 180 hZ.. and the add a narrow boost on the bass at about 220 hZ... that usually does it... Kurt
     
  7. vinniesrs

    vinniesrs Active Member

    Here's another tip for you. Once you get a good kick sound in the mix, roll off all the bass On the bass guitar from 180hz and down. Bring the level of the bass guit up until the midrange starts to articulate the bass in the mix. Some times a narrow boost between 800-1200hz(2-4db)can help. Once this is mixed nicely, bring that 180 and down back into the mix until it blends nicely.

    Good luck.
     
  8. Ethan Winer

    Ethan Winer Active Member

    Doulos,

    > The idea of paying for a mixing engineers assistance is an awsome idea thanks thats what im lookin for. <

    Glad to help.

    I have done that twice myself in recent years. One time I had a semi-famous pro mix one of my pop tunes while I watched, and the other time was with a mastering engineer who specializes in classical music, to assess my mix of my home recorded cello concerto. I got a lot out of each $200 session.

    Here are the highlights:

    On the pop tune I learned not to make the low mid range around 400 Hz. too thin. I tend to do that in an attempt to gain clarity, but I was going too far and made the mix less "robust" and "fat" than it should be.

    The best tip I learned from the classical engineer applies to all music, and was surprising because we usually think of classical engineers as purists who avoid processing and trickery. I think this is freakin' brilliant:

    The goal is to cut out the narrow range of "pain" frequencies that make music sound irritating when you turn it up. This engineer set a parametric EQ for a fairly narrow but substantial boost at about 3.5 KHz. Then he swept the frequency until it sounded terrible, to identify the "pain" frequency. Then he set the Q very high at 10, and changed the boost to instead be about 4 or 5 dB. of cut at that frequency. This made a huge improvement, and I have since done that on pop music tracks too.

    You can also use this trick on the obnoxious range around 600-800 Hz. Set a lot of boost and sweep the frequency to find where it sounds worst. Then change the boost to cut, using a high Q so you don't remove too much overall midrange.

    That tip cost me $200, but for you no charge. :D

    --Ethan
     
  9. RecorderMan

    RecorderMan Distinguished Member

    Definetly equipment...and a gig(intern &/or runner) at the biggest studio you can get into.
    Afetr that...just leran from your envoirment, the net, books and mags. There's enough material there to compete with anything you'll learn at a school...and the real learning is A.what you're doing now, and B. What you'll learn assisting on sessions at the biggest studio you can get into. B. won't happen for a while...but you have the plus of your own "room" to work in untill that day comes. Something most of us didn't have back when I was starting out.
     
  10. RecorderMan

    RecorderMan Distinguished Member

    Definetly equipment...and a gig(intern &/or runner) at the biggest studio you can get into.
    Afetr that...just leran from your envoirment, the net, books and mags. There's enough material there to compete with anything you'll learn at a school...and the real learning is A.what you're doing now, and B. What you'll learn assisting on sessions at the biggest studio you can get into. B. won't happen for a while...but you have the plus of your own "room" to work in untill that day comes. Something most of us didn't have back when I was starting out.
     
  11. vinniesrs

    vinniesrs Active Member

    This is a creative profession, and you need to experiment and make mistakes in order to learn, no matter how good you already are.
    Buy every peice of gear you can get your hands on, and indulge all of your wildest sonic dreams. Record every sound you can think of, and distort it in every way scientifically possible.
    Record things the wrong way on purpose and see what happens. Listen to your work everywhere.
    If you do this, then all of your creative visions will come to reality out of instinct. Once you have your own "chops" you will amaze yourself and others.
    Word gets around.
    Buy the gear, build your ear, record a career.
     
  12. doulos21

    doulos21 Member

    this is what i wanted to hear thanks a lot. Im doing just that minus the internship. Im working on a mix portfilio before i go for an internship and i figure im gonna have to move to nashville,
    as far as creative goes i totaly agree i try to do a lot of weird things and remember what sounded cool for future production use and listen to wacky ccm producers like monroe jones etc.
     
  13. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    theres nothing better than watching those who do it *do it*, those days you need to normal out the desk to setup for the next days session....how do you think you see and learn things like EQ settings and comp settings.

    Books, forums, mags etc are all awsome sources of information but by all means hook up with a *vibe master* and observe his skils :)

    . Most will learn more in one month of assisting than they would learn in 6 months of reading books. Just get out there and do it! :)
     
  14. anonymous

    anonymous Guests

    I'm biased, I went to school and think it was the best thing for ME. Everyone is different. I thought it was awesome to go to school and go from a to b to c to d etc... I had decent skills in the studio before school, but my understanding of everything afterward made everything so much easier. Plus I got my first studio gig as a direct result of where I went to school, and the fact that I went to school. (the head engineer also went to Full Sail).

    If you go to school, you have to be prepared to ignore all of the bull $*^t that's going on with the most of the people in the class, and be focused, on time, and interested. I found that most of the people in my class were far more interested in parties than recording, and as a result most are no longer doing music. So if you really love it, and you want to start out with a nice base to grow on, go to school. If you don't think you'll do well in that situation and would just prefer slowly aquire the knowledge through others, then find a job interning.

    Just keep in mind, coming out of a school like that, you will not be a recording or mixing master, but you will know how everything works, and can start to concentrate on honing in on your skills. Engineering is really an art once you get past the gear.
     
  15. whitie

    whitie Guest

    Hey- I dont know if you have heard of the recording connection. http://www.recordingconnection.com. Thats what Im doing, its only like 5 grand. What it is, is you like do an internship/apprenticeship type thing right there in a local studio. You have a book and stuff where you read and do questions like school, but your "class" is time in the studio one on one with the engineering. And say the last chapter or whatever you read about was on EQs then the whole hour or two your there with the engineer, your playin with the EQs. Im just beginning so itd proly be different with you, you might do more advanced stuff. Its really cool you should look into it. It wil save you money that you could use towards equipment.
     

Share This Page