Thread: Summing - What track sounds better to you?

My final words on all this, In my most humble opinion , It really isn't worth considering OTB unless you are investing in gear specialized for your stems and style of music. That's what I take home from this. early in this thread I established how NULLING an analog file a few times degrades the track to a point where you cannot tell the difference between ITB and OTB summing ( I'm not talking about additional hardware added). To my ears, digital summing changes analog with NULL processing. PLUS, By the time we smash the crap out of music, and it goes on MP3 ear-buds, who cares right. This is where most people are today. We are conditioning our hearing to appreciate high volume and the In-Your-Face sound. A sound that doesn't warrant investing in highe end converters and specialized analog gear.

But if we are trying to be better than that, speed up our ability to mix faster and enjoy music like it used to be valued, there is no doubt hybrid is my choice by a long shot.

More fun coming , I have an Orpheus here now and a DSD recorder coming this spring.

OK...I'll put you down for Sum1
I liked Sum2
So were tied...maybe more people will post and we'll get more of a preference sample.
This wasn't meant to be a trick test...it was more about analyzing and comparing my own hearing to others and this whole process of different renderings and the techniques...if you know what I mean.
I definitely learned something here! and it was a lot of fun!

It's very interesting to me to listen to different techniques applied to the same pieces and learn something about what you can hear.
It's too bad there weren't more people with similar equipment like yours (or even different) who could process the two different sets of tracks (or even their own tracks) and see how one picks out different approaches or equipment.

I also want to say that I'm not in any position to own or use this sort of high end equipment.
So for me it was a real treat to be able to transfer files around and actually listen to audio tracks.
I think that is a real component that this new section of Track Talk should continue to do....not just talk about tracks but post and listen to real tracks and compare and discuss the equipment used in processing and recording them...
I would hate to see this section turn into text only post or someones mix asking "how's my track sound" !!

Now you've got me wondering, hehe... I suppose I should import them into my DAW.

Track Talk should catch on, why wouldn't it eh?
John Todd has been kind enough to share his tracks with me. Lots of tracks and a great song!

You could if you like, but at this point I think were just beating a dead horse! Hehe.

More tracks in a new thread here with John's examples would be great.
If you plan on messing with more tracks I hope you post them if possible!
I will surely tune in!

Could be why we're having our own party here lol. New tracks will make a difference. But I really think we are learning all sorts of stuff here.

Posting is up to John, their his song and I will happily share what I did if asked.

Back to your tracks, I see what you did now, and I trusted my ears before I looked at the files. You did a marvelous job getting the levels close. Volume has the biggest effect on us doesn't it. If something is slightly louder, we generally think it sounds better, but, louder does not mean we will stay focused on it as long. Big topic.

I see I chose the slightly compressed track, interesting. It does sound tighter and i like it because I know what you can do with tracks on there own like this. Makes mixing complexed music easier to say the least.

Here is an angle you didn't think of. Sum1 has less peaks and a tighter bass. You may like Sum2 more because it is a gentle overall mix (duller ) and the way you intended it to sound. But, if you were in my studio and we were building the song, mixing OTB while we worked this song, we would mix that bass a bit lower like you want. The question is, how would it sound then. Most people who mix OTB claim that you really start hearing differences with more track counts.
It will be fun to start experimenting with Johns tracks next.

Well they are two completely different mixes....I think. Sum1 was your LA2A pass.
But you are right about the way it sounded to me!
To me I thought Sum2 was less harsh and yet more open and airy which was more of the "feel" of the tune to me.
The second thing that was a big question were these warbled artifacts in Sum1 which I kept thinking I heard distracting me in an annoying way...I didn't like the feel, it sounded like little digital artifacts.
I think you'll hear them in Sum1...the reverb tails...it sounds like a compressor pump...sort of a unk unk unk sound...very faint, but I hear it. I'm using headphones though.
So then I found an older original mix of mine that didn't have that sound at all which is what Sum2 is.
The reverb tails in Sum2 sort of ping pongs and they drift away, but for some reason they don't do that in the Sum1....they warble and make that sound...again very subtle.
I kept hearing that and thought it was the summing action or something with my cans.
It turned out that those 2 stereo tracks I sent you HAD the same warblely artifacts in them so it was there the whole time we were doing this.
So now I'm trying to figure out if maybe this was something that I mixed out of in Sum2 when I was making a final version and whatever I did is lost now...I only have this stereo wav file as a result...
I don't think I've ever over analyzed a piece of music this way...so that's why it was interesting...
Like you've said before...I don't think it makes much difference to the kids out there these days for this kind of stuff...it's funny how the technology has changed everything....
When I was young it was all about the sound and the speakers and the amplifiers and the technology was good but it's better now and yet the kids don't care about the sound....so it's weird how technology changed one thing to make things easier and better to create real high end sound but nobody's listening!

The warble definitely isn't because of my summing or the LA2A, that's precisely was it doesn't do! Its a very slow leveling amp and will not react quickly like that warble. I'm very glad you pointed that out. Its part of the track beyond my control. I knew this but didn't want to focus on that for fear our trigger happy dude... IIRs would yet, derail another happy topic. I refrained from discussing it at all costs, even if it looked like it was caused by me. If you listen to that ending, I can hear the fader pulling out on that patch.