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anonymous 15 June 2002

I am looking for something to record bass directly into my daw and also use live, preferrabley tube. I don't need a lot of bells and whistles, mostly just a preamp and compression type piece. I've already tried the Pod Pro for bass and didn't like it. I want something simple but of high quality. My budget is $1000. I've been considering several options which include:

Summit Audio's TD-100 (di) and TL-50 (compressor)

HHB Fatmen processor

Demeter tube di with external compressor

Aguilar tube di with external compressor

Avalon U5.

Do any of you have any experience with these for bass? Or any suggestions I may have not considered?

Your suggestions are greatly appreciated.
Thanks, Abraham.

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Comments

coldsnow Tue, 06/25/2002 - 04:34

I recently tried the Summit TLA50 compressor on bass. It was very nice sounding. How about a Peavey VMP2, 2 channel mic pre with eq (all tube) makes a great bass Direct sound increadibly warm and dimensional. Plus you have a great mic pre to boot. DOn't let the Peavey name fool you, it isn't designed by peavey but a company called AMR, and Peavey just kinda produces them. They are in tons of pro studio's, one of the best deals in pro audio if not the best. They are around $700.

anonymous Wed, 06/26/2002 - 21:37

A while ago a friend of mine dropped off a “SansAmp PSA-1”. Told me he thought I’d find it useful and to try it out. If I didn’t like it to drop it back off at his shop.

Well… after about a week of dubbing around with it I ran into his wife at a local grocery store parking lot… I gave her a check. :D

While made for guitar for the most part… there is a bank of bass presets.

The “sample” settings, while maybe not “perfect” reproductions… were definitely workable. The “SVT” settings left a little to be desired but a little tweaking and leaning on the “drive” knob a bit more than shown gave me a decent enough tone.

In regard to the above statement I’d suspect it was in reference to one of the “stomp box” versions. The rack-mount PSA-1 IS a decent sounding unit.

Tech-21 has some good “sound samples” on their website: tech21nyc.com/PSASnds.html

“Street” price for the PSA-1 seems to be around $550-$600.

They also make a dedicated bass unit (rack-mount) the “SansAmp RBI” for around $300-$350 but I personally don’t have any experience with it.

Also, a few months ago I did a demo for a local rock act. The bass player brought his own pre-amp which I took a direct signal from. It was a Peavey “Max”. I was skeptical at first… but pleasantly surprised later.

He was sending me a very nice ever-so-slightly tube distorted tone that I really was impressed with. I figured there had to be an actual tube in the preamp. Also I suspected some sort of "filter” circuitry was on the direct output I was being fed. The lows were very tight and controlled and the highs seemed to have a natural speaker-ish roll-off to them.

This was confirmed in conversation after the session (turns out he’s a tech at the local Peavey dealer). The direct out is what they call “frequency compensated” simulating the response of a speaker (he noted that the normal unbalenced output could be used if the effect was not desired). Also the “tube” channel does have an actual tube in it, although he admitted he modified his by replacing the original 12AX7 with (if memory serves) I believe a 12AU7.

Shortly thereafter I logged onto 8th Street Music’s website & ordered one of my own (about $350). I DO highly recommend the tube swap though… I plan on taking mine down to him for the same mod in the near future. The 12AX7, although not bad, just doesn’t quite match the sound he was getting from his.

dpaton Thu, 06/27/2002 - 10:44

Originally posted by coldsnow:
DOn't let the Peavey name fool you, it isn't designed by peavey but a company called AMR, and Peavey just kinda produces them.

Actually, AMR (Audio Media Research) was (is?) one of Peavey's pro-line companies, like their Architectural Acoustics group. They made some pretty nifty things...they had a DI that I liked a lot.

-dave

RecorderMan Thu, 06/27/2002 - 14:21

Originally posted by Kirk Candlish:

Ditto...
It's outa the budget...but add an 1176 and it's a really hard chain to beat.

These days I never know if an 1176 is supposed to be a referrence to the UREI original or the UA1176N.

Care to enlighten me RecorderMan ?

Pretty much all the same. The only absolute that I know of is the speed of light. Eeryrthing else is relative to the reference of the observer. Any two 1176's sound slightly different. But by and large...they're the same animal. I own one 1176LN blackface that I had recapped&modified by Alactronics. Much quiter. It doesn't sound exactly like other black faces...but I like it alot...you can hit it real hard and it sounds great (sometimes-more these days-with very dynamic singers I wack it with 7 to 10 db of g.r. @ 8:1 with slpow attack (9 o'clock) and fastest release (5 o'clock). Works for me. So if I'm talkin' 'bout an 1176...I gues I mean the originals. But if I walked into your studio and all you had was a purple audio one or a bombfactory plugin I'd use them about the same...with pretty much the same results.

:p

anonymous Thu, 06/27/2002 - 15:32

So if I'm talkin' 'bout an 1176...I gues I mean the originals. But if I walked into your studio and all you had was a purple audio one or a bombfactory plugin I'd use them about the same...with pretty much the same results.

Well if that's the case then the Bomb Factory classic compressors package is sounding like a real deal at $500. Particularly since it includes the LA-2A along with the 1176.

Guest Thu, 07/11/2002 - 06:23

Just another happy U-5 user. Cool thing is, given the size of the box and the fatness of the sound, the artists always think they're getting tubes, which makes them happy. No need to say anything to spoil it...!

I've heard excellent things about Evil Twin and Aguilar as well, but haven't tried them. That new little half-rack Summit also looks like it might be cool.

RecorderMan Wed, 07/17/2002 - 06:59

Originally posted by Kirk Candlish:

So if I'm talkin' 'bout an 1176...I gues I mean the originals. But if I walked into your studio and all you had was a purple audio one or a bombfactory plugin I'd use them about the same...with pretty much the same results.

Well if that's the case then the Bomb Factory classic compressors package is sounding like a real deal at $500. Particularly since it includes the LA-2A along with the 1176.

Caveat:
I'm High when I say the plug "really" sounds like the hardware version. It doesn't (meaning: you'd pick and use the hardware version over the plug everytime). But, it's a good aproximation, and adjusting it (the plug-in) gives predictable results.
There's no free lunch (2nd law of thermodynamics)

anonymous Thu, 07/18/2002 - 20:22

Thanks RecorderMan for the clarification on the Bomb Factory plugs.

I was about to purchase a number of their products but recently I have been reading posts by Erik, the owner of BF, in the Digi forums. The guy is a real piece of work. I have lost any interest in his products and would go out of my way to buy any alternative.

RecorderMan Fri, 07/19/2002 - 07:17

Originally posted by Kirk Candlish:
Thanks RecorderMan for the clarification on the Bomb Factory plugs.

I was about to purchase a number of their products but recently I have been reading posts by Erik, the owner of BF, in the Digi forums. The guy is a real piece of work. I have lost any interest in his products and would go out of my way to buy any alternative.

I use them (regardless on the owners peculiarities). They make sonic mangling fast and familiar. With a little more learning curve I think the MacDSP stuff (compressobank & filterbank) is as good if not better.

My FAVORITE plugin is echo farm. I JUST LOVE SLAP (even well done fake slap)

anonymous Tue, 07/23/2002 - 09:51

Hey R.O.~

I have an 737, anybody have any good suggestions for that compressor? I can't get a good sound out of the thing on bass, flat out can't get the hang of it. I bought it used (has scratchy pots) and might even send it back to Avalon to be calibrated. Everything else sounds good on it, but I have had nonstop trouble with the lower spectrum. Any ideas? Something I am missing??

RecorderMan Wed, 07/24/2002 - 07:27

Hey Corny,

As far as setting suggestions. Maybe what your after is some old school color on the Bass. If that's the ticket...try a high ratio (8:1 to 10:1); more limiting than compressing. Hit it pretty hard (at least 6db od gain reduction), with a medium to slow attack and a fast release. It could help bring some life to your bass.

anonymous Wed, 07/24/2002 - 13:36

Thanks Kirk!

I contacted Avalon...5 bucks a pot to replace and calibration for free, you ain't kidding when it comes to service. I am blown away. I am not even the original owner, I was honest and told them.

Thanks RM, I will try those settings tonight!
speaking of 1176's, I am building an 1176 clone, the parts are kinda tough to get, but I can't live without one. I'll send you one of my clones sometime RM so you can compare it to the real deal. I need an objective ear!

RecorderMan Thu, 07/25/2002 - 07:13

Originally posted by Corny:

Thanks RM, I will try those settings tonight!
speaking of 1176's, I am building an 1176 clone, the parts are kinda tough to get, but I can't live without one. I'll send you one of my clones sometime RM so you can compare it to the real deal. I need an objective ear!

Hey...those settings work really well with an 1176.

Here's two 1176 settings Bass.

old school:
Ratio 8:1
attack 3
release 7 (full clockwise=fastest)

new scholl
ratio 4:1
attack & release:5

Also I'd be glad to check out anything you want to send me.....(that go's for all of you...EveAnna anywhere?......)

KurtFoster Sun, 07/28/2002 - 08:39

Evil Twin or the Matchless D.I. box ( they don't make the Matchless any more, sob Matchless folded up). Both killer. I regularly use the DI on my SWR Studio 300 amp and it sounds great also. For live I would be reticent about taking an 1176 on a gig and I personall prefer an LA2a or LA3 on bass anyway (I'd be scared to take these on a gig also). The Peavy mic pre is an excellent choice and you get 2 killer tube mic pres to boot. Fatss

RecorderMan Sun, 07/28/2002 - 09:06

Originally posted by Cedar Flat Fats:
For live I would be reticent about taking an 1176 on a gig and I personall prefer an LA2a or LA3 on bass anyway (I'd be scared to take these on a gig also). The Peavy mic pre is an excellent choice and you get 2 killer tube mic pres to boot. Fatss

Excellant point CedarFlatFats...that's why I put some more thought in to it and suggested the two devices That I put linksd to....gauranteed to make an impact,easy to carry around (it'll be about one rackspace total, as each unit is of the half-rack variety & within the budget).

Do check out...the Little Labs D.I. is a hidden treasure.....

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