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Tascam 16x08 vs. ps 1818vsl etc, need some input please!

I read a post from a while ago about the 1818vsl and us-1800 . I really loved your insight. (Donny Thompson)

I am buying my 1st pre and looking at the PreSonus 1818vsl, Tascam 16x08 and the tc 2020.

I am using AKG clip mics on the toms, D112 /bass/ sure 57s/snare/sure condensoers for hi hat and over head.

the kit is 8,10,12,14,16,22,14, total of 11 mics all tolled.
I would like to know in your opinion if the 16x08 will be able to push the mics (gain) based on your comment about how 57s need more "boost" from the preamp as compared to some other mics.

I dont want to screw the pooch on my 1st purchase and any input you have is much appreciated.

Rich "the new guy" moses, red bank NJ.

ps I have been playing and recording for over 30 years but this is my 1st foray into digital recording, mostly for youtube,students, sit auditions etc.

Comments

Boswell Tue, 07/04/2017 - 03:33
Rich Moses, post: 451203, member: 50681 wrote: I am buying my 1st pre and looking at the presonus 1818vsl, tascam 16x08 and the tc 2020.

I am using akg clip mics on the toms, d112 /bass/ sure 57s/snare/sure condensers for hi hat and over head.

the kit is 8,10,12,14,16,22,14 , total of 11 mics all tolled.
I would like to know in your opinion if the 16x08 will be able to push the mics (gain) based on your comment about how 57s need more "boost" from the pre amp as compared to some other mics.
I would be a little hesitant about recommending any of those three interfaces primarily for drum kit capture, although I've never used the https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00HM9KL1A/?tag=r06fa-20 They would all do a job, with the Presonus probably being the pick of the bunch. It's very hard to give any recommendations of other units to consider without knowing your price limit.

Pre-amp gain is not usually a problem in drum kit recording, even using low-output microphones, but what was your proposed way of capturing all 11 mics using these 8-mic input interfaces?

Thomas Hood wrote: They went and told the sexton, and
The sexton tolled the bell

pcrecord Tue, 07/04/2017 - 05:26
I too would probably pick the presonus if it wasn't the fact that it has only 1 adat input.
What that meens is if you want to put an external adat unit (ex: 8 preamps unit) you would need to record in 44khz for 8 inputs or only use 4 inputs at 96khz.)
In that regard, I would favor the Presonus Studio 192 which has 2 adat inputs. That is, if you ever want to record more than 8 mics at the time.
One of my first choice would be the Focusrite ISA 828 with digital card, for drums and most acoustic instruments. It's a blast !!

Boswell Tue, 07/04/2017 - 06:01
Yes, an interface that has two ADAT input connectors (to allow 8 channels at 96KHz) gives greater flexibility in the choice of expander pre-amps.

The ISA828 is indeed a great pre-amp, but for drum kit recording I find transient response of the Audient ASP880 very hard to beat at the middle price range. As well as having similar impedance control to the ISA, it has variable HP filters and balanced inserts.

I know we are talking a different price bracket from the OP's original suggestions, but drum kits simply don't sound good through low-end pre-amps, whatever type and quality of microphones are used.

Another way of approaching the problem of recording 8 - 16 channels of instruments including drums is to go for a recording mixer such as the Allen and Heath Zed-R16. The pre-amps in that unit are in my experience every bit as good as those in even the best audio interfaces in the middle price range, and you get individual track recording via FireWire as well as mix recording. I don't know what Zed-R16s go for in the US, but over here they are very good value, and they also crop up on Ebay pretty regularly.

DonnyThompson Wed, 07/05/2017 - 02:23
Rich Moses, post: 451203, member: 50681 wrote: I read a post from a while ago about the 1818vsl and us-1800 . I really loved your insight. (Donny Thompson)

I am buying my 1st pre and looking at the presonus 1818vsl, tascam 16x08 and the tc 2020.

I am using akg clip mics on the toms, d112 /bass/ sure 57s/snare/sure condensoers for hi hat and over head.

the kit is 8,10,12,14,16,22,14 , total of 11 mics all tolled.
.
At this point, I'd like to know more about your room. This can play a huge part in the sound of the kit (along with the quality of the kit itself).
The mics you mentioned are usable, but in my own experience, I wouldn't try to mic every single tom. That's a lot of hot mics.
The Presonus would do a good job. Are there better? Yes. But I'm assuming you have a limited budget based upon the gear you've mentioned, and for that ballpark price range, the Presonus is your best bet. I've had a VSL1818 for quite some time now, and it's been a good pre/I-O ... but Bos and Marco ( Boswell, pcrecord) both brought up solid points regarding the number of input channels vs the sampling rate. The VSL does have an optical i-0, which makes it expandable, but I'd be wary of the tascam as your second/slave interface. If you can do it, you'd be better off with another VSL.
Again though ... your room is really going to play a big part in the ultimate sound you get.
It would be helpful to know what your space is like, measurement wise, along with the basics of its construction (plaster, dry wall, brick, etc).
If your room has issues, or is too small, then even if you could afford the best preamp on the market, you would still only end up with a great sounding recording of a drum kit in a bad-sounding room. ;)

Boswell Wed, 07/05/2017 - 02:37
pcrecord, post: 451208, member: 46460 wrote: Nice suggestions (ASP880 and Zed)
I haven't had the pleasure of trying them, but I hear good words about both of them !
I wonder how the less expensive ASP800 compete to the 880...
From the SOS review of the ASP800:
The ASP800 costs around 20 percent less than the ASP880. The production cost has been lowered not by corner-cutting — it shares the same highly regarded class-A preamp circuit design as its elder sibling — but by employing a different power supply and by simplifying the facilities provided for most input channels. The first two ‘Retro’ channels, though, also offer something more, notably the HMX tube saturation emulator (used in some previous products) and a brand new ‘Iron’ processor, which introduces transformer saturation.

Boswell Wed, 07/05/2017 - 03:00
pcrecord, post: 451214, member: 46460 wrote: Thing is I never read negative reviews on SOS. At some point, I'll have to try it by myself ;)
Well, yes, it is a review, but in SOS the factual reporting is normally separated from the subjective opinion. One thing I like about their reviews is that they are fair about pointing out any shortcomings they encounter in actual usage as well as (usually) saying how good the item sounds.

DonnyThompson Wed, 07/05/2017 - 03:28
Boswell, post: 451215, member: 29034 wrote: Well, yes, it is a review, but in SOS the factual reporting is normally separated from the subjective opinion. One thing I like about their reviews is that they are fair about pointing out any shortcomings they encounter in actual usage as well as (usually) saying how good the item sounds.


Agree on SOS, I've come to trust them over the years as a good, clear and unbiased source of info.

Rich Moses Thu, 07/20/2017 - 16:53
DonnyThompson, post: 451211, member: 46114 wrote: At this point, I'd like to know more about your room. This can play a huge part in the sound of the kit (along with the quality of the kit itself).
The mics you mentioned are usable, but in my own experience, I wouldn't try to mic every single tom. That's a lot of hot mics.
The Presonus would do a good job. Are there better? Yes. But I'm assuming you have a limited budget based upon the gear you've mentioned, and for that ballpark price range, the Presonus is your best bet. I've had a VSL1818 for quite some time now, and it's been a good pre/I-O ... but Bos and Marco ( Boswell, pcrecord) both brought up solid points regarding the number of input channels vs the sampling rate. The VSL does have an optical i-0, which makes it expandable, but I'd be wary of the tascam as your second/slave interface. If you can do it, you'd be better off with another VSL.
Again though ... your room is really going to play a big part in the ultimate sound you get.
It would be helpful to know what your space is like, measurement wise, along with the basics of its construction (plaster, dry wall, brick, etc).
If your room has issues, or is too small, then even if you could afford the best preamp on the market, you would still only end up with a great sounding recording of a drum kit in a bad-sounding room. ;)
the room is 10x18, carpet on the floor, sheetrock walls, drop ceiling with acoustic panels...
x

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