A little help please on the future of music...!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by SEFS, Oct 2, 2009.

  1. SEFS

    SEFS Guest

    Hey guys,

    The short version:

    Please can you complete my survey!

    cord blood banks &

    The long version:

    For my final research project for uni, I'm exploring different ways artists can make money in the new economy. I'm of the opinion that illegal downloading can't be stopped, and that the only way to not lose money due to piracy, is to not make most of your money from exploiting copyrights, i.e. (in simple terms) give all your music away for free and make your money elsewhere. How an artist could do this, is what I'm trying to figure out...

    I should also mention, my concept (and survey) has small unsigned bands in mind.

    I do realise there's a lot more to it, but I wouldn't want to bore you too much right now, but if you're interested, here are some links to some of the concepts I've been studying (you may have heard of a few already), with the point of my research being to create this 'super concept' that will save the industry...

    All you need is 1,000 True Fans who spend $100 to earn a living:

    on the same note of giving music away cheap or free to 'casual fans' and cashing in on True Fans who will pay more for specialised more personal releases:


    (click on the different album price packages)

    Buy shares in your favorite artist's new album:

    http://heheheheheheheeheheheehehe.com/2008/07/i-am-offering-60-of-us-royal ties-of-my.html


    Street Performer Protocol - once band gets target amount of donations they release album for free:

    cord blood banks /583

    http://www.kickstarter.com/ - - - this one looks like it will be pretty good, a bit like fundable

    Also Bowie Bonds:


    There are more, but this is getting long lol

    Basically my new concept takes the best parts from each, whilst studying human behavior, along with online spending and interaction, to determine how successful it will be.

    Anyway, I hope you complete my survey to help me out!

  2. SEFS

    SEFS Guest

    I would *really* appreciate any answers to the survey, thanks!
  3. MadMax

    MadMax Well-Known Member

    Mar 18, 2001
    Sunny & warm NC
    Home Page:
    There... filled out your survey...

    Now... lets get down to brass tax...

    There's a difference between an artist making money, and an artist making money.

    The above scam... errrrr schemes, as it were, are stick and carrot things that will ultimately end up screwing the artist as all corporate venture's are.

    The only way for the "industry" to survive, is for the public to stop being spoon fed all this BS about music being a commodity. The model doesn't work.

    You cannot be truly profitable until the public stops stealing your products. The only way to stop it, is to stop creating a commodity item/theft of IP atmosphere.

    Giving your music away and then charging $100 at the door or $65 for a T-Shirt model, ain''t gonna work either.

    The margins are really small, and the fact that anyone with a computer can now call themselves an artist, only cheapens the value of the market depth.

    If you think I'm kiddin' about a $65 T-Shirt... think about a real high end production album. An artist can easily spend $120,000 just on studio time... then $15-20k on mastering... another $250,000 for CD duplication, then the tour support, transportation, insurance, travel expenses, advertising, promotion, etc.... PLUS interest! Then all of your profits are gonna come from merch??

    Lets say an average good sized budget for an album and tour is $500,000. The music is free, right... lets say you DO sell CD's... autographed, and T-Shirts, mugs, etc...

    500,000/365(days)=$1,369.86 you have to pull in EVERY SINGLE DAY for a YEAR... just to break even. Obviously, that ain't gonna happen... so lets be more realistic... Lets say you gig 200 dates for the year. 500,000/200=$2500 each night, just to break even. All the while, that half mil is costing you interest. If you were lucky enough to sell 100 t-shirts each night, that would be $25/T-shirt and you're STILL loosing money... assuming that you would then be getting all of your profit from the door.

    That door money is gonna get cut by at least half, cause you're gonna have the venue needing a cut. Since we're talking about a breakout band, you'll not be headlining and thus, split at least half the remaining door with another band.

    All the while, you still need to be making a profit so you can make your next album.

    The only thing you can do is raise the prices on the merch... by at least double. That makes it less likely to sell that many units. So, you have to make it an elite item with higher quality merch... which costs more, and you gotta go up on the price again.... thus, you get to a $65 T-Shirt that few will buy, and you'll go into bankruptcy and have to sell your copyrights to the investor's to square up what you can.

    Net result... the artist is screwed even worse than under the old system.

    Sorry... wanna rethink it again?

    People buying shares doesn't work either. So far, the majority of the bands that have gone down that path are left without enough investor's to do anything... all the while, the guys that are holding the money, are makin' serious change churning those funds in other markets, or they're ready to shut the doors and make a jump to a country w/o extradition, where they live out their lives in comfort... again, leaving the artist twisting in the breeze.

    BZZZZZT... thanks for playing...

    No, sorry, the sngle best way to actually earn a decent living as an artist is to band together and inform the people that illegal downloading is the exact same thing as stealing food from a restaurant... only a more chicken-$*^t thing to do, than be daring enough to do a dine-n-dash.

    Also, getting the music into an affordable media is essential. Whether it's bands forming consortium's to do their own broadcasting or selling subscription services, who knows at this particular juncture. But the approach towards content delivery has to be cheap and easy... at least as cheap and easy as illegal piracy.
  4. Bondsjl

    Bondsjl Guest

    Though I do not know the exact direction the music industry should go to next to improve itself, I was very drawn by the two very different opinions stated above.

    I do think that making an individual impact on the world, and making a living while doing so, is a much more reasonable and doable achievement, I don't know if that is the final step.

    And though it may seem negative, I do agree that illegal downloading is inevitable, at least for our near future. The current young generations, of which I am a part of, are generations of hustlers. The mentality is more along the lines of: "you can pay if you want, but in the end, your the one with less money." And that is logical. Why pay when you don't have to?

    Some may say that the answer to that questions is ethics. But there is an obvious wrench in that thought-process. For, ethics don't pay the bills. And even though many who download illegally are not of financial hardship, why spend money on something that can be bought for free? That money can then be spent on something else pleasurable.

    Though unfortunate, at this point and as of this date, this is the reality that the music industry faces.

    How, then, should the industry improve? I suggest one thing: think outside of the box. Though I repeat that I am in no way attempting to know all of the answers, the knowledge I have been exposed to and my current university studies have made it clear that it is those who think outside of the box are the ones who succeed.

    Music is a worldwide phenomenon. It changes every ear that it reaches. With this being said, the industry needs to starting thinking bigger than just getting the highest rotations of a radio station; thinking not just of radio and charts.

    And the world, itself, is changing. More and more people are volunteering to aid third-world countries or choosing greener lifestyles to save our planet. The ability to aid in the end of world hunger is now just a click away. The questions is, will the music industry change with us? Or will it continue to be a businessman's ideal for striking it big and quick with more concern for money than for quality?

    A common quote is to "think globally, but act locally." Though artists can start a movement by living sustainable lives fueled by true fans, it is ultimately the industry that needs to jump on board with the rest of the world and think outside of the box. All it takes is a little looking and I'm sure that the answers will comes and that rest, including the money, will follow. It worked for Einstein- why not us?
  5. jammster

    jammster Active Member

    Nov 30, 2008
    Lake Ki-Chi-Saga, Minnesota USA

    Thanks MadMax,

    Its refreshing to hear that you feel this way because its the truth, the people that are illegally downloading everything are are just not aware of what consequences are in wait for them down the road of life.

    Plain and simple.
  6. EricIndecisive

    EricIndecisive Active Member

    Jan 4, 2007
    I understand the illegal downloading thing from your guys perspective most definitely... this is your living. But I'll give you another perspective, which is actually quite selfish, but hey, it's how a lot of other people see it I think. There's no need to argue with me and my post, cus I know it's wrong, I'm just trying to say it how it is..

    Let me also state this much less applies now where you can buy single songs. Back when downloading music was actually difficult (I used to run my little bootleg CD ring for the hot girls in high school), you could only buy CDs. Who wants to pay $13-18 for a cd when all you want is one song? Like I said, it applies much less today. I also do think that a lot more people pay for music if they want it on their ipods. But with youtube and those free online radio stations, people have grown so accustomed to not paying for the music.

    This is how I see it, there are three options:

    1) I like it! I'm paying for it, now I get to enjoy it.
    2) I like it, but not enough to pay for it. The artist should be happy enough that I'm just listening to their music, greedy bastard.
    3) I don't like it. Would not download.

    Also, people want something tangible but are too lazy to get it. If they want the whole CD, they want it from the store with booklets and lyrics, not some online thing. But then I have to go drive 2 miles down the roaddddd

    Again, with dollar songs, this doesn't really apply as much today... But I thought I would share anyways...

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