Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Sanity Inn, Aug 22, 2004.

  1. Sanity Inn

    Sanity Inn Guest

    Hi Gang,

    I caught a TV spot about this company and what they do,,,

    to sum up, they uploaded 3 plus million top billboard songs into a computer, assigned all characteristics of a song a mathematical #, ie, pitch,tone, key etc,,,,

    then they had the computer crunch all these numbers, and got a 3D cluster looking universe,,, within this universe were litle groups called " hit song cluster"

    basically they can, upload your song, compute it and see if it falls into a " hit cluster" ,,, a hit cluster of 7 or higher means track is highly marketable and falls inline with billboard chart material,,,

    it was interesting , thought I'd pass on the info


    Sanity Inn
  2. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Distinguished Member

    Jul 2, 2002
    77 Sunset Lane.
    I think this is exactly what is going wrong with the industry. How do you think Elvis would have scored on this system? Or The Beatles ... relying on what has been successful in the past is not very creative ....

    Either Tom Dowd or Jerry Wexler once said, (I can't remember which ... and to paraphrase) the problem is when you speak to a record executive about a note, what they think of is a BANK note, not a musical one ...
  3. Johnjm22

    Johnjm22 Guest

    Music isn't supposed to be about a science or hit song "formula." I agree with Kurt that this is part of what's wrong with the music industry today.

    Music is about emotion, expression, creativity, and originality. That's what makes a song good. Not some scientific formula.

    Furthermore, any song that falls into this so called "Hit Cluster," probablyl isn't a very original song, or anything to get excited about.

    This Hit Song Science crap is a total waste of time and won't be around very long. :evil:
  4. BarefootStudios

    BarefootStudios Active Member

    Feb 9, 2002
    Hey, what a great idea! Maybe they could do the same for movies! Or what about books! They could even do it with food! Then we could all watch, read and eat the same thing! (Not to mention listen to the same song!) Cluster me free.........uggg
  5. Sanity Inn

    Sanity Inn Guest


    it's a good thing i didn't
    invent this formula,,, lol

    just thought I'd share, but looks like it makes for healthy debate


  6. ramblinjam

    ramblinjam Guest

    totally agree with kurt and john, music is supposta be an expression, not a cluster of crap
  7. firebout

    firebout Guest

    You people didnt even go to the site and read the FAQ. The music only COMPARES to other hits. Every song you EVER liked has some kind of pattern that has been done before. Why dont I just play the chromatic scale up and down the neck of the guitar? Because it starts nowhere and ends nowhere. It dosnt just give you a high rating just because it sounds like another song that was a hit, it judges the over all mathematics of a song and how people have responded to simmilar ones before it.
  8. maintiger

    maintiger Well-Known Member

    Dec 3, 2003
    Whittier, California, USA
    Well, that's why the radio programming sucks, everything is done by computer, without the human touch, by a supposed yardstick of 'hits' and it shows- anyone remembers when we had the real dj's making decisions on what to play? there was a real interaction with the people and the lousy ones didn't last long anyway-
  9. tofumusic

    tofumusic Guest

    This for some reason reminds me of a post I saw a while back on the subject of psychoacoustics. . It makes sense and it's pretty interesting. .
  10. took-the-red-pill

    took-the-red-pill Active Member

    Jan 10, 2005
    Near Clagary
    Home Page:
    Might be interesting to go there and find out what to...

    "I'm just a poor boy
    I need not sympathy"

    ...do. i'm sure if we all follow a formula we'll end up with a better world with...

    "Mama mia mama mia
    momma mia let me go"

    ...much better, more original music to sooth our



    Yep, nothing like a formula to make things make mathematical sense

  11. Nemesys

    Nemesys Guest

    You can file this kind of mathematical curiosity as being similar to another really old conversation that people get into when discussing the quality of music in different genres.

    Whenever you have a discussion with somebody whos musical tastes differs from your own, the conversation always ends up with one person claiming that such and such kind of music is just "noise"...

    Well, the interesting thing though when most non-engineer / non-mathematically inclined people use the word "noise", they don't realize that the word noise actually can be quantified mathematically fairly easily. Its a simple matter of performing an autocorrelation process. Classical music for example has among the highest autocorrelations whereas rock music has the least (most noisy).

    So we could get into this whole discussion here about which types of music have the greatest degree of self correlation. Unfortunately though, this mathematical certainity doesnt really put an end to the debate since obviously we're really talking about psychoacoustics and just plain differing opinions in general.
  12. therecordingart

    therecordingart Well-Known Member

    Jul 28, 2004
    Me personally....I'd rather write a song that just rips you a new ass emotionally and have it not be a hit. I like listening to music that feels like it is yours and yours only....that the band is playing for you! The type of song that hits that button which makes you feel lost for a few minutes while you are listening to it. Music today doesn't do that....especially the hits.

    I may only be 22 years old....but I'd rather listen to some Sinatra and say "holy $*^t" when the song ends than listen to the majority of the mindless, corporate molded drone music of today.
  13. BitBurn

    BitBurn Guest

    I gotta say man, I'm not tryin to put you down or step on anybody's toes... but music is a business... there will ALWAYS be hit song science, because pressing a gazillion discs and paying to have them shipped across the country to be put into stores costs money, and you simply can't do it for free... hit songs pay the bills, plain and simple! its a pretty destructive downward spiral to be honest...

    The internet sort of helps, because you are able to "ship" your songs all over the world at pretty much no cost and you don't have to deal with the politics of deadlines and sales in general, but at the same time a band of four or fives guys still have to eat! led zeppelin didn't write and put out "4" in thier spare time between flipping burgers...

    Hit song science isn't new, and won't die untill the music industry dies, or untill music recording and distribution become completely free... guess which one will come first :roll:

    I gave up on radio a LOOONG time ago because of this... all I hear sounds the same and almost nothing is safe, even hardcore is starting to become commercialized...
  14. what about image? do you upload your picture with it? isnt 70% of today's "hit" music based on how you look? Cause i hear some really pretty pots and pans.
  15. Jbon

    Jbon Guest

    since this does break all the rules about ART..............?

    Its just not right and its illegal, too, though I forget where I saw that law...and I just don't wanna talk about it except that it just ain't fair! and its wrong too! I can't afford it and so i am mad ashell cause there are those who can and I still sit here all broken hearted...

    please forgive my sarcasm folks but i am so bitter it ain't funny and no fault but mine etc etc etc

    I wish I could afford many things, and, including at some point maybe, this service.. I would indeed give it a go-when and if it became an obviously useful tool... which is already so... I guess I just wanted to say... I would have always wanted this ... as I did before it arrived, anyway... and boy did I ever... all my life I tried to be as aware and conscious of recurring "like characteristics" in "successful music" of all genres..as we all do as well, also I am sure..
    But I am simply grateful to be allowed participation in such an active and respectful group of undoubtedly very lofty levels of proficiency-level-talented personel, here on this swell forum and enjoy all coments offered and certainly appreciate the experience!
  16. mud5150

    mud5150 Guest

    I've come to believe that there is no exact science. Some people say that to have a hit you have to have flawless vocals, like the rolling stones right? If you hadn't noticed those perfect vocals your hearing are perfect antares plug-ins. Some people say that to get signed your music has to sound perfect note for note live. Go today a popular rock bands concert and tell me everything sounds perfect. Wouldn't they love it. Even with each concert production costing 10's of thousands most of these guys still sound terrible. Of course most sound guys just turn the kick drum up so loud thats all you can hear so that kind of helps. It seems to me to just be luck, because it definately isn't good music. As far as the look and the awesome sound its definately a good thing to have, but I've also seen record companies rub their ass cheeks together and spit out a great looking band, and studio magic is the word of the day. The only thing that makes me happy is I look at the bands that are making it today and I figure if these $*^t houses can make it it should be a snap, but in the end it all comes down to who you know.
  17. tedcrop

    tedcrop Guest

    Well if you think about it...

    If you had a million songs from unsigned artists, loaded them into a program that screened:

    1. Songs under 4 minutes
    2. Songs that are in time
    3. Songs that stay in tune and key

    You could probably weed out tons of BS before you had to waste your time listening to it. One or two hits may slip by but who cares.

    And in the end there are people who are artists and people who are into business one wants to make money the other usually starves. But every now and then an artists gets paid what they are worth.
  18. Sanity Inn

    Sanity Inn Guest


    I'm curious if anyone has tried this service since i posted it???

    let us know


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