Pigs

Discussion in 'Mixing & Song Critique' started by stevie_m, Nov 5, 2016.

  1. stevie_m

    stevie_m Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2014
    My band's version of the Pink Floyd classic "Pigs (Three Different Ones)", what do you guys thoughts with respect to:

    1.) General impression/How does the overall track feel? Does it move you?
    2.) Specific thoughts on the mixing/engineering (does it sound professional or amateurish)

    I realize some stylistic elements do not sound exactly like the studio version, but I want to know if still sounds proper and competent sounding as a new spin on a classic.

    HUGE thanks for listening through this 11 minute track! Special surprise for Trump fans on verse 3!

    Here is the link to the track
     
  2. audiokid

    audiokid Chris Staff

    Joined:
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    Location:
    BC, Canada
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    This track is private.

    Post the link so we don't have to leave the forum. See More Options. See Upload a File.

    upload.PNG
     
  3. stevie_m

    stevie_m Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2014
    Fixed, here is the link .
     
  4. DogsoverLava

    DogsoverLava Well-Known Member

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    I thought the performances were stellar and in general I liked the tones and general mix etc...

    If I had to get critical I'd say there still seems to be a slight disconnect between the vocals and the instruments though -- as if they're not quite in the the same sonic plane --- they're just slightly inhabiting different dimensions. I found this more likely to happen with my own mixes when I mixed with headphones on -- if I didn't mix at volume in the studio I'd find myself surprised when my listening environment changed from headphones to studio monitors. There are a couple of minor instrument levels I might play with here and there but I actually really really liked it - thought it was quite fearless.
     
    audiokid likes this.
  5. audiokid

    audiokid Chris Staff

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    my exact thoughts as well.(y)
    Nice work.
     
  6. stevie_m

    stevie_m Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2014
    Thanks for the feedback guys. Dogsoverlava, I'm quite surprised- I remember you delivered some soul crushing reviews of a few of my original mixes I posted a few years back (also available on my soundcloud above "Hell on Earth").

    I also agree with your observations on the vocals existing on a different sonic dimension than the rest of the mix. You've been the first to point that out. Though I am not really sure why since I recorded the vox and guitars on the same mic (Senn e609). I guess it gives the track some uniqueness (I wasn't going for a 100% replication of the original). You guys like the trump lyrics?
     
  7. DogsoverLava

    DogsoverLava Well-Known Member

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    How did you mix this one? Headphones? Like I said - I cued up Floyd and Your mix and played them both -- found myself turning off the Floyd -- it just wasn't necessary - yours was great and in some ways I might have enjoyed it more. I'm not experienced enough to tell you how to address that slight sonic chemistry that's keeping the vocals and the band from coming together on the same plane - a combination of level/and 'verb maybe?... maybe others can give you better advice.

    I still fee guilty about that one critique I gave you back then - I go softer on folks now but the intent is the same (to be as real as I can while still being helpful). What you've posted here is a fantastic track as far as performances go. Really good to hear from you.
     
  8. stevie_m

    stevie_m Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2014
    Haha no worries! The humbling review was character-building and drove me to improve at the mixing board. I didn't change a whole lot to the song (I think it was "Empire and the Damage Done"), but it proved a valuable lesson in sticking with my vision despite harsh criticism (and I could see where you were coming from with a number of the points). Believe it or not, some folks actually liked the track!

    I did 80% of the mixing on my Yamaha HS5" monitors, and 20% on a Sennheiser HD650 cans. There's very subtle reverb on the rythym guitars and I'm surprised it's become so noticeable - but I've listened to it so much I really like how the verb fills the guitar space (going for a bit of the live '77 Animals Tour feel). Do the 2 sonic planes hurt the song or can it be chalked up to artistic license? At the end of the day I just want to make something that sounds cool (and not wholly amateurish).
     
  9. DogsoverLava

    DogsoverLava Well-Known Member

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    The two sonic planes definitely hurt. What you are aiming for is "cohesion". Cohesion isn't necessarily homogeneous but it's about the sum of the parts coming together (isn't it interesting that mixing is also called "summing"?). You are really really close with this mix -- in terms of the vocals sounding cohesive you are (to my ears) about 15% away from achieving it. (Whatever that means).

    The consequences of non-cohesive vocals is that they end up sounding karaoke - like singing with backing tracks and it pulls the listener out of the song. To my ear you are really really close here. Close enough almost for me to consider replacing PF's version of pigs with yours on my iPod.

    The reason I asked about headphones is that on phones the disconnect is less apparent -- headphones can mask that difference (which is one of the reasons that mixing on headphones can be challenging to the end product. A good mix on studio monitors sounds good on headphones as well --- that's not (necessarily) true in the reverse.

    I hope others here might comment or give you direction on the specifics of how you might close that gap - is there a short answer here?
     

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