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Question on Sizing Corner Bass Traps

Discussion in 'Acoustics (Live Room, ISO Booths)' started by tga$ound, Jun 15, 2015.

  • AT5047

    The New AT5047 Premier Studio Microphone Purity Transformed

  1. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    The radio shack digital spl meter.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/RadioShack-Digital-Sound-Level-Meter-CAT-33-2055-with-New-9V-Duracell-Battery-/181737546974
     
  2. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Well-Known Member

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    77 Sunset Lane.
    i think all studios should have a Real Time Analyser and calibrated mic as well as a tone generator capable of sine waves and pink noise. .
     
  3. Brien Holcombe

    Brien Holcombe Well-Known Member

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    A Behringer ECM8000
     
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  4. DonnyThompson

    DonnyThompson Well-Known Member

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    When I measured my room, I borrowed an Earthworks Omni from a buddy who does a lot of classical recording work ( apparently the Earthworks Omnis are also good mics for this type of recording) - but, I have another friend/studio owner who recently rebuilt his control room, and he used the Behringer to measure his space that Brien mentioned ... and he said it worked out just fine.

    Considering there's roughly a $500 difference :eek: ( I've seen the Behringer on Amazon for around $60) I think I would at least give the Behringer a shot. ;)

    According to the specs of both mics, both are very similar in frequency response, SPL, and phase.

    In terms of recording applications, I have no idea. I've used EW mics on acoustic guitar - but like maybe only 2 or 3 times over the last 30+ years - and while I don't remember being knocked out by it, I don't recall that it sounded bad, either.
    I've never used the Behringer for recording, so I can't say.

    Regardless... if Brien is suggesting it, then I'd take it as solid advice.
     
  5. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    Knowing berringers design philosophy, they probably copied the earthworks, closely as patent laws would allow, and filled it with the cheapest components possible. Lol, I'll probably be picking up the Berlinger mic at some point.
     
  6. Brien Holcombe

    Brien Holcombe Well-Known Member

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    The key word that elicited the response was "cheap". Everyone has opinions on Beringer, I get it, but price is always a stop word in respect to, well, anything. So an omni by beringer while it may not fit the criteria of a more exacting technician, it fits this scenario perfectly.
     
  7. Brien Holcombe

    Brien Holcombe Well-Known Member

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    But I could have just as easily recommended this one:
    http://www.daytonaudio.com/index.php/test-measurement/emm-6-electret-measurement-microphone.html
    At only 20 or so American dollars more then the Beringer, it might even be a better overall mic for home studio acoustics testing and measuring.
     
    kmetal likes this.
  8. Kurt Foster

    Kurt Foster Well-Known Member

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    don't bite the hand that feeds you ...... :rolleyes:
     
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  9. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    Just curious what leads you to belive that this mic would perform better than the berringer offering? I only ask because I don't any one mic of this sort, and would like to add a semi professional mic of this type to my collection. Something like a b&k is out of my range price wise, and above my level at this point.
     
  10. Brien Holcombe

    Brien Holcombe Well-Known Member

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    I think it should because I believe the marketing sheet. If I had to choose between the two, I would take the DaytonAudio mic simple because it isn't a Beringer and still fits the criteria. If money was the breath in my mouth, then Earthworks it is. But as I see it, unless you are measuring more rooms than simply your own then why put in the money. The fact that the plots are gonna mess with the mind when someone on the first time out looks at them, errors and all, why bother? This is just another of a multitude of areas in residential acoustics that either gets messed up, starts messed up and/or the attention to detail is not placed on the importance of what it is that you are doing so no one reads up enough to get it right.
     
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  11. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

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    Kyle, Dayton Audio is a private-label brand offered by Parts Express. I'd have no reservations about using any of their stuff. The Dayton things I've used over the years (raw speakers, horns/drivers, bulk wire, crossovers, video mounts, video cables, outdoor speakers, grill cloth, small utility amps) have always met or exceeded my expectations. Parts Express began as a company aimed at DIY customers who taking building their own custom speaker cabinets seriously and I think you'll find they still take RTA and anything that measures speaker performance very seriously.
     
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  12. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    That's music to my ears man!!!! Got a new item on the growing purchase order. Good call fellas!
     
  13. tga$ound

    tga$ound Active Member

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    Brazil
    Hey dudes! Thanks for all the replies, there's always something interesting goin' on.

    It just happens that the rate of US$D x BRL is too high...So in this case I think I'm really pick BehringerECM8000, bc it's the only one I can find in freakin' Terra Brasilis.

    Searched for every other recommendation and nothing. Not even one seller in my country.

    This week I'm gonna finish making the bass traps, and we're gonna install it. Then it'll be time for measures etc. I'm gonna send you guys some update when the traps placement is finished, plus I'll need some help analysing it.

    See ya buddies!
     
    kmetal likes this.
  14. tga$ound

    tga$ound Active Member

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    kmetal, I've been searching for info about cloud building(found it), but I haven't really seen anything about their placement and usefulness. Since it's a panel with rock wool inside it(the same way you build the rear panels, with the difference of roof positioning), Correct me if it's needed, but by looking at some pictures it looks like the clouds must be built as a barrier to keep some frequencies from bouncing off the roof and 'ricochet'.. Am I wrong?

    How do I size the clouds? Is there any rule about proportions to go along with room dimensions or such?

    Since the ground where I'm preparing the room is really a reflecting surface, I'm thinking about carpeting it all. But I'm afraid this would make the room totes dead.
     
  15. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    Yes the cloud is used to absorb certain frequencies, in most cases it's mids/highs. If it's in the control room, you'll want at least the area above the listening position to be covered by the cloud.

    The most common cloud, would be a basic wooden frame, with 3- 2'x4' panels of rigid fiberglass, or rock wool. Since the cloud is hanging, rigid Fiberglas/Rockwool are usually preferred to prevent sagging, and keep a nice sharp look. A few eye bolts and hooks, and some stranded steel wire, and your in business. You want to make sure they are fastened securely, and you may want to angle it for astchetics, and to seek some depth under it. You gain more absorbsion in the low mid/low, as you space the could further off the wall.

    Some designers have an array of clouds throughout the room, others prefer one large cloud, cover the majority of the room.

    The general rule of thumb for placement, is to cover the 'mirror points' on the ceiling, just as you would the walls. Any additional absorbsion is really design/room dependent.

    Carpeting- in general most studios opt for a reflective (usually wood/laminate) and an absorbent ceiling. Carpet is often placed under the console/listening area in general, if it's included.

    Tracking rooms, are more about taming the ugly, and enhancing the the pretty (acoustically) so it's much harder to give rules of thumb.

    I think most rooms designed from the ground up are %60 (of the overall cubic footage) acotusically treated, with about %40 of that being bass trapping and 20-25% mid/high absorbsion.
     
  16. Brien Holcombe

    Brien Holcombe Well-Known Member

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    "...I'm thinking about carpeting it all. But I'm afraid this would make the room totes dead."

    Carpet in general is selective in the frequencies that it absorbs, mids and highs. Depending on the carpet depth and room size the carpet may even convert some lows at the upper region. Still, carpet is selective so is not specified unless a designer has a real good reason.

    Low, really low nap carpet might work but a better thing would be to use area rugs underneath microphones if the track brings too much of the ambiance of the room with it. This allows you to control where the mic is, where the voice position in the room that you know to be a sweet spot is and to modify that spot and only that spot, as needed.

    If you wind up with rugs in every square inch of the room after your mic tests then by all means put in some carpet :)

    The idea is to flip the environment that you are used to being in. Like the overhead cloud helps to remove first reflection points, it is also part of the package to create clarity in the mix position to enable us to make better decisions.

    Hard floor/soft ceiling works in this respect.
     
  17. charlie

    charlie Active Member

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    Jun 25, 2020
    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    But it would have no disadvantage either right?

    In my case, my space is limited along the wall, isn't there some advantage of an arc being slightly deeper at its center given the same length of the other two legs of the triangle? That is to say it would be deeper than the straight hypotenuse, no?

    Thanks
     
  • AT5047

    The New AT5047 Premier Studio Microphone Purity Transformed

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