Thanks for sharing your recipe
I would have liked some preamp consideration in there. Let say a ISA One ; a preamp for the mic, an instrument input and a digital converter in one unit.
Or a UA 610. Common audio interface DI input are relatively transparent and some are quite dull. Using a DI within an external Preamp unit can give you a more open and punchy sound. (depending on what you are looking for) It may also, save you a lot of processing if the track sound good to begin with
Also, nothing above 250hz ?? Common, don't kill that slap player !
Depending on the song, you may need those Higher frequencies to keep the bass presence and punch. (specially on small sound system and computer speakers)
I always try not to follow rules or recipes. Doing what the song needs is far more important.. But hey ! You listed a great lists of options
I'm starting to ask people sharing their mixing tips for examples of their work so we get a better idea of where each and every one of us is coming from. I'd love to hear some examples of your work here. I think it would serve you well. Please feel welcome to post something that refers to your tutorial.
I respect the OP taking the time to post this, and I'm sure that there are those that might find this helpful - although I'm not in agreement with the "this is how you do this" mentality in a generalized fashion - across the board. Perhaps if he had posted it as "this is how I get good bass tone on _________." it would have a bit more value. There's just no way you can state that this is THE way to get great bass tone.
And, I think he's probably targeting the home recordist who doesn't have the budget for pro gear because he's using a lot of VST's in his examples of "how to", which is fine, I suppose.
I listened to the link that Chris posted... the low end was very heavy through my system, pretty muddy too. But, then again, I'm not a fan of that genre so you have to take my comments for what they are worth in that regard.
Oh man, this whole topic has me all bent out of shape lol.
respect as well, however,
The link I posted sounded common to the average home studio sound = overuse of plug-ins and DAW bus congestion (we need to finally coin a phrase for that sound ). Its time, wait for it....
I don't hear tremendous bass at all. To be honest, its not close to what I would call exceptional bass but then again, the song is about as bad an example as he could have chosen too.
I love bass and its been a life long mission to be the most bad ass bass mixer (in my own mind lol) on the planet! Thus, why I invested in the 120v rail Neos and a system that helps me phase it all in, really FAST! Gut reaction, hear it and nail it down before I start over processing it.
Now that I know this, maybe, in the next 20 years I might actually hit the big one lol. I wonder if I would be the first 77 year old fat to finally mix a good one. I can come back here and tell you all how to do it lol!
All these extra plug-ins are BS to me.
FWIW, here is my opinion on Waves.
I bought the Waves C4 multiband years ago, thinking that, and so many other pretty plugs would get me there. They look great but did nothing for the music! Ya, I was suffering from dilutions of pro tools studio/waves grandeur too. Like most of the populous.
It started out with Pro Tools, a mac, then Farms, then more DSP, then upgrades, then more upgrades, a new computer, endless research on compatibilities to a point I had about $40,000 just in software and never one thing to be proud of. Oh, but I knew my way around Pro Tools! Big deal...
All the plugs I bought never sounded better than the stock Pro Tools I had to start with. I should have never started reading all the crap on the DUC and listened to people I though had their $*^t together. At least I was rocking 18 years as a sampling guru, midi guru, and Rock guitarist on the AA circuit. I was a leader in the 80's around this part of the world, not a follower. But, what did I know about DAW's and the Pro Audio world. I was musician using this stuff on stage.
I got fooled by wordsmiths on all these forums.
Not until I realized the DAW is a sampler, did I start to put this all together. I already knew Samplers like the back of my hand. And I did know sampling did something undesirable to music. But, at the time, in the 80's, effects were the bigger deal back then.
What a supermarket for coders selling all this $*^t. The more I spent, the worse my sound got and this is what I hear here in his example.
The best bass I get is when it has the least amount of code attached to it.
I wouldn't waste a dime on all that nonsense today, even if I was broke, I know I would get a superior mix on a Stock Samplitude or Pro Tools any day of the week over someone which a folder full of all this imaginary colour.
I'll challenge anyone who cares to question this.
The Renaissance EQ was the last plug-ins I bought and shorty after those purchases, I cut my losses and put my $40 thousand dollar Pro Tools crap studio in the closet and moved on.
To the OP, you are lost in the world I described above.
I think that this was probably directed at those who don't have the budget to get the "real" gear. Most home recording hobbyists rely on plugs because they don't have the cash to shell out on a real 1176. So, take it for what it's worth. I don't believe that he was attempting to compare the real stuff with the run of the mill average plug ins.
I think it may have created less controversy if he had perhaps titled the thread differently, perhaps something like "another option to getting bass tone".
I have very little of the "real" OB stuff anymore myself - with the exception of an old dbx 163, a dual 15 band MXR Graphic, a Lexi Prime Time, a Rockman Sustainor/Delay and a Digitech TSR-12, I'm mostly bound by vst's myself. I use what I have because the alternative would be to not do it at all until I had some of those classic pieces, and, well, that's simply no alternative at all - at least not to me, anyway. I'd rather keep recording and mixing.
I do have some nice mics, and, I'm putting money into the process of getting my mixing space as acoustically accurate as I possibly can, but while I've used that real gear plenty over the years, I don't actually own any of those pieces anymore, so yeah, I do need to use vst's - like the LP64 EQ or the Vintage64 Compressor from Cakewalk... along with other plugs like Waves RChannel, etc.
I make the due the best I can with what I have. If the original poster hadn't called this thread what he did, I suspect it would have been much more palatable to those that know that there simply isn't any one way to do things.
My bass tones, rely mostly on either my UA 4-710 or ISA two preamps or a combination of both (either with or without a mic depending if the bassman has an amp). The rest is done ITB not by choice, (please send me money ) I try to keep it simple unless the instrument is real crap !! I often end up with only EQ and Compression on the track or just EQ if I used the compressor in the 4-710 !!
DVDhawk LMAO that was precious that video! Yeah... there's not too many places where you can get a Pabst Blue Ribbon that serves 15-year-old bass players. Nope. That was high comedy for sure. Or for those who were high that watched this comedy?
Obviously he couldn't play his bass because he hadn't sent it back to the factory to have it tuned, in time for this video. Obviously he went to the Gene Simmons School of Tongue.
And where he does not Obviously purchase his Jeans from The Gap since he likely has none, between his cheeks? In fact I think he had his cheeks sewn together just to get that tight look. And maybe to help keep him from crapping in his pants when he tries to play the bass guitar?
He's probably making more money with that video than any song he would ever play in his life? I laughed my ass off. And now I look better in a swimsuit for summer.
Sounds like most of the other popular VSTi /midi / library bass guitar samples I've heard. It's not awful or anything, it is what it is. And I have nothing against VSTi's... not at all. I've heard great sounding samples of many different instruments. I just don't consider this to be one of them.
Personally, I wouldn't consider it to be an example of "tremendous bass tone", and most pro bass players I know probably wouldn't, either.
But, after all, it's all in the eye....er, uhmm "ear" of the beholder...
One man's "average" is another man's "tremendous".
After all is said and done, if it works for the song, works for you, and your client is happy, then that's all that matters.
(If you had not put such a "tremendous" title, we would not be having this discussion)
When I first started using digital tools, it was the craze! No one heard samples and music like that, so it was cool and an opportunity to take. It was perfect for the times. Midi was the $*^t, samplers where just beginning and digital recording (the beginning of the DAW) was starting to take shape in products like the Emulator.
Pop music (what else was there) was mostly 2 or 4 on the floor with the odd exception to some shuffles. The MPC had that one in the bag!
Pretty much everything had no dynamic unless you were smart enough to learn how to do it itb. Most people however, were clueless figuring out how to do it anyway so NEW WAVE made its way into the culture and a way we go...I see a correlation to plug-ins here.
Kicks, hats and bass were Half, quarter or 8ths and everything was quantized or sounded quantized. Similar to this example above. Only its quantized in the wave as there are not transients, dynamics or real world space outside the bitrate. I hear it, do you?
The best thing going was guitar and Vox. Those two essesials kept NEW Wave real. If you had that in your sound, you had an audience. If you had a drummer that could play like a metronome, you really had an audience.
I used the guitar to make it sound better. Thank God it still isn't an easy rhythm to fool people with. I think that has kept us somewhat grounded still and quite possibly coming back again. Its sure to infect the youth as it did in my generation.
That was 34 years ago.
I was so stoked on it, making handfuls of cash that I could jump on a plane and head 2500 miles to the Van Nuys GS to get the latest Linn Drum Eproms that were just released, hang out there for a while and come right back to Canada to work on my next song.
This example of bass, sounds no different than the samples we got 34 years ago. Its dead, no dynamics and dated.
Your mix and interpretation sounds like every other kid that just discovered digital processing.
In fact, my Krono's sounds better than this on its own right now.
I admire your enthusiasm but you aren't fooling the guys that grew up on this $*^t who no how to mix it.
At one time we would all be going "wow". But the world is sick of this $*^t continuing. It belongs in the group of the worst music of this century. It worked once because it was never heard like that before, now its old news and we all want better.
Don't get me wrong, I love samplers (DAW's) and digital technology but give me something that doesn't sound like a kid that just upgraded his plug-in list and just discovered volume optimization.
If you really want to jump in on the lead, try creating a song that sounds like someone actually played it. That is the next craze.
well there's 30 seconds i'll never get back. it's a decent bass tone for what you are doing but it's not the bass tone for everything. it fits the clip but would it fit in a Country song? i don't think so. i really hate the snare tone though.