My friend (bandmate) and I have been debating the fact of doubling vocals in the recording of our songs. As the singer, I like the sound of the doubled vocal because it fattens the sound up a bit and allows for the vocals to cut through and not seem small compared to the other loud instruments. I also think my voice sounds better when doubled rather than with just one track.
Is this a silly idea? My friend seems to think the tracks will phase and sound "stupid" but I plan on having one at normal level and the other at half level or so, just to beef up the vocals a bit subtlely, but not overpowering it so it sounds like "two of me" singing together, if that makes any sense.
Comments
I think there is a plugin that helps to align doubled tracks. It
I think there is a plugin that helps to align doubled tracks. It is called Vocalign, never used it though.
Gertok is correct and it is available for ProTools. But back in
Gertok is correct and it is available for ProTools.
But back in the old days.... We would frequently double the lead vocalist. Even if it wasn't intentional, a la' numerous isolated vocal overdubs later combined during the mix. Frequently makes folks that can't stay on pitch sound better.
To prevent that phasing effect, you only need to delay one of the two vocals by about 25 ms.
Some folks rely on a digital audio processor to create double vocals. Generally, these sound horrible with a robotic synthetic quality. I think that technique generally sucks even if randomization is built into the program. It basically pitches up and pitches down while speeding up and delaying tempo. Whereas a real double vocal shows off the vocalists skill i.e. it takes some talent.
I've used the double vocal technique to make otherwise crappy sounding local bands, sound better.
Only one of me
Ms. Remy Ann David
Remy, you are a gift. I am not a big poster but I read, read, r
Remy, you are a gift.
I am not a big poster but I read, read, read like a siv, and I really enjoy your experience that you share here.
Why thank you Glide. In fact you are my favorite....dental flos
Why thank you Glide. In fact you are my favorite....dental floss! I won't use anything else but Glide! Of course I like to glide on other things, such as beautiful music. Make some for me would you?
Always listening. Always talking.
Ms. Remy Ann David
I agree with you Glide. Thanks Remy for all your help. By the
I agree with you Glide.
Thanks Remy for all your help.
By the way--you hit the nail on the head with singers using doubled vocals to make them sound more in pitch (it's kind of what I do because I'm not a very good singer). I hope that's not viewed as "cheating" or cutting corners too much from a professional standpoint, I'm just still a 19 year old newbie. lol.
Happy Holidays everyone!
I need some help with this as well. My problem is that Vocalign
I need some help with this as well. My problem is that Vocalign is not compatible with my OS. any help? is there any other plugin like Vocalign?
Thanks much.
I hope that's not viewed as "cheating" Not at all. Read up on A
Not at all.
Read up on Automatic (aka artificial / automated) Double Tracking (ADT), you'll find out why.
Personally I prefer to double vox without plugins, as Remy stated.
RemyRAD wrote: Why thank you Glide. In fact you are my favorite
Glide's my favorite......nope, nevermind...my bad. That's Astro-Glide.
:twisted:
RemyRAD wrote: But back in the old days.... We would frequently
Ha...I love it.
I was just doing a session where I was doing trumpet quartet overdubs and the quartet had like 20 takes on the same 16 bars. I accidentally hit the unmute in the DAW while tracking and the guys in tracking room came alive! It seems 70 some trumpets punching into their cans while they were trying to play is not desirable....
Oh well, they deserved it - one of them whistled into my Royer SF12 and I heard the ribbon make all sorts of funky sounds..... :x :evil:
Don't know why you would use a plug-in for doubled vocals.... se
Don't know why you would use a plug-in for doubled vocals.... seems lazy and fake.
Why not just do another take or 7?
Don't know why you would use a plug-in for doubled vocals.... se
Don't know why you would use a plug-in for doubled vocals.... seems lazy and fake.
Why not just do another take or 7?
yeah. I usually just set a track on loop-record and do two takes
yeah. I usually just set a track on loop-record and do two takes instantly. Double vocals really fattens things up.
i don't consider Vocalign a cheaters tool. It's not creating a f
i don't consider Vocalign a cheaters tool. It's not creating a fake doubler effect like some plugins. Vocalign just helps with lining up the phrasing so that they are better in time with each other. You still have to sing the doubled vocals. Helps me save a TON of time. i just wish i would have checked to see that it was compatible with my new OS.
It's only compatible with ProTools, which is compatible with Win
It's only compatible with ProTools, which is compatible with Windows XP home and pro but not Media Center Edition. In fact, I wouldn't necessarily consider using it when going for those doubled vocal sounds. You need a little of that natural randomness to keep it sounding from being too unison.
Maligned
Ms. Remy Ann David
bent wrote: Personally I prefer to double vox without plugins,
Once you get good takes to work with, how do you approach mixing/blending the two (panning, EQ, delay, etc.). Obviously the song will dictate, but I'd like to hear some basic examples that perhaps you've done in the past.
I'll see what I can find when I get home this evening. I might
I'll see what I can find when I get home this evening.
I might have some tracks I can load in and make a quick mix with doubles and without, for comparison's sake...
bent wrote: I'll see what I can find when I get home this evenin
Beautiful, thanks Ben.
Dave and I gotta have a Pow-wow. We'll see if I can post what I
Dave and I gotta have a Pow-wow.
We'll see if I can post what I have...
Sorry for the delay!!!
-Ben
If you "sing" 2 takes, you will NEVER get them so close phasing
If you "sing" 2 takes, you will NEVER get them so close phasing will become an issue. Not even J Lennon could do that...
ADD a second mic might help.. Yeah doubling the vocals is KEy t
ADD a second mic might help..
Yeah doubling the vocals is KEy to a big sounding vocal. Your singer must be able to match him or herself 99% of the time. All this does is train your singer to be more consistant with their performance. They will love you later when they learn how to sing their song properly =)
Now one thing that I have been doing is tossing in a second mic on the stand ( TAPE IT UP ) SM58 or an AKG. Run this to a second Input so you can mix them 2 seporatly. Put a weeeee bit of Chorus on the second mic. Not a lot just a small bit. This will give you a doubled effect if your singer just cant pull it off. This will also save your singers voice if they are strugling to do the doubles.
I mainy use this for pre production. Saves the voice and we can move a lot faster to hear the sway of the song with vocals on it.
Hopefully by the time you move to your final takes they can pull off the doubleing, If not at least you have two tracks recorded differently at the same time =)
Its a cheet but it does sound 80% of a double.....
Hey Mr Ben, any luck yet? Get distracted?
Hey Mr Ben, any luck yet? Get distracted?
basilbowman wrote: Hey Mr Ben, any luck yet? Get distracted? H
He posted it here...
(Dead Link Removed)
Thanks!
Thanks!
Sorry, I didn't know anyone else was waiting to hear that (aside
Sorry, I didn't know anyone else was waiting to hear that (aside from Sshack, that is).
:oops:
bent wrote: Sorry, I didn't know anyone else was waiting to hear
You have a following.
8)
Soon we'll be living in a rented house waiting for Hale-Bopp to
Soon we'll be living in a rented house waiting for Hale-Bopp to return, of course that's not gonna happen until what... 4500AD or thereabouts?
:lol:
I like Strawberry kool aid please.
I like Strawberry kool aid please.
hey I am new to this place, thought I would contribute some idea
hey I am new to this place, thought I would contribute some ideas.
If it was a rush job, sometimes I would duplicate the track. Delay it maybe by 15 to 25 mSec depending on what works. Also I use a plugin like Autotune on one track or possibly both pitch correcting with different strengths. It is a quick and dirty trick but it gives two vocal tracks that behave differently due to the fact one is more corrected than the other. Of course you may want to go through and just pitch correct the parts that require it and not do all of it.
I do prefer two separate takes especially when the singer is skilled and fairly consistent.
Also a Chorus on the second track I have done as well.
Kid Rock was on Howard Stern and defended his use of double voca
Kid Rock was on Howard Stern and defended his use of double vocals after the idea of "cheating" was brought up. He said that he was in fact harmonizing and that the vocals were completely different.
Perhaps it is cheating if you are covering something up.
But, since Blues is what people should be singing....I would say to add the second vocal because blues is never the same way twice.
Don't try and emulte the first track, but just repeat a few key words like they do in rap songs.
If you want to be great, then listen to TuPac Shakur and what he does with double vocals.
If they are an octave apart then go for it, or have one vocal track be spoken word like The Doors did.
i hate to say this but i get pretty good results when i am too l
i hate to say this but i get pretty good results when i am too lazy to sing a double vox using waves doubler. i keep the grequency mod (on the 2nd voice) pretty close to zero and duck the gain a bit behind the real one.
i know purists will kill me- but it works okay. if you are an expressive singer and , like me, never seem to sing my double track close to my original without a million takes (in which i lose my patience often)
it helps me to keep the flow of creativity going...
just my 2 cents
Filmmusic said: But, since Blues is what people should be singin
Filmmusic said:
OK, which one of you turned that particular rock over???
Just filmmusic doing his thing. Whatever that thing may be...
Just filmmusic doing his thing. Whatever that thing may be...
Noob here... Question. When you double the vocals, do you keep
Noob here...
Question. When you double the vocals, do you keep them the same volume, or do you have one quieter then the other?
Yes.
Yes.
Why would anyone consider doubling a vocal take cheating? It tak
Why would anyone consider doubling a vocal take cheating? It takes a lot of skill to be able to sing consistently enough to make doubling sound good. And when it works (when you have a good singer), it sounds great.
I've read in some places where they would have upto 4 tracks. Ap
I've read in some places where they would have upto 4 tracks. Apparently Coldplay does this in some of their stuff just to fatten the vocal. I could see this being helpful with falsetto stuff as well to thicken those vocals.
when i record my own songs, i tend to improv the vocals each and
when i record my own songs, i tend to improv the vocals each and every take, (i've been to too many counting crows concerts i suppose) but i've found straight copying the vocal take from one track to the next, then chopping it up into several sections, (segments of 10 or so), then time stretching each segment by a ms or 3, and run it through some various (but gentle) processing of sorts, and tuck it (volume wise) under the original by a few db
hi, what about the old school(motown) method - spliting the lead
hi, what about the old school(motown) method - spliting the lead vocal in two channels and then using the heavy compressed second ch to fill 5-8khz presence freq in the first. I am thinking to try this live. is this sensible? any advice?
Doubling vocals... I prefer just adding some effects like choru
Doubling vocals...
I prefer just adding some effects like chorus or delay, reverb etc.....you have to be very careful when doubling that it doesnt sound to artificial. If done right, it can sound very cool!!:cool: